ST Kylo Ren's Future/Fate. Death/Redemption/Other?

I think kylo will be redeemed because he may be the only skywalker bloodline left is rey isn't a skywalker, han is dead, leia (who knows) and luke is alot older and may not have any kids.

I think if episode 9 ended with kylo having to be defeated then its like cutting off the bloodline for the 9th movie and thats not the most happy ending.

 

I believe, thematically, that if Rey is a Skywalker, Kylo *must* be redeemed.

 

It would make sense that rey should be a skywalker because the fact she will probably be using anakins/lukes lightsaber and that she seemed to be the main jedi character but because many are expecting her to be lukes daughter i can't help but think they will go against expectation.

 

a person can redeem themselves without even needing it to be "through someone" so i don't think that is true at all. just because that was how vader was redeemed doesn't mean it's the only way. also, kylo has rejected his family in a way anakin never did. so that seems like the way that probably WON'T work.

 

It occurred to me Kylo would be the de facto leader of the First Order after Snoke and Hux are gone. One way to pull off a redeemed and live story would be to have Kylo/Ben order a cease fire and move the FO towards peace. The whole reason the FO could arise in the first place was the leadership vacuum in the Empire after Endor and this would avoid that.

Ironically, he'd be accomplishing what Vader started - bringing peace to the galaxy.

 

The stormtroopers would ideally need to be freed, since they were not cloned or genetically engineered to serve the First Order in the first place. They were stolen from their homes and families. Finn was not the first stormtrooper to break from his conditioning, otherwise there wouldn't be a reconditioning program or executioners to put down traitor soldiers, so we know they're still capable of thinking independently and could adapt to a society outside of the FO should the organization get brought down. I believe Kylo should be redeemed and get to go home... but so should the stormtroopers who were indoctrinated as babies/children and did not choose to serve an evil leadership.

 

I would hate for kylo to die because he is Han and Leias only child that we know of. He should be redeemed.

 

He could be redeemed *and* die?

All I'm certain of of the following 1. JJ knew what he was doing when he had Kylo kill Han, 2. There will be lasting consequences for that act and 3. Kylo will be redeemed (if for no other reason than thematic necessity).

 

I look at Kylo Ren as the dark sides Luke he's not getting redeemed and he dies at the end of the trilogy .

 

If Kylo is not redeemed, then all I can say is poor Leia.

- Lost her parents at birth (metaphorically)
- Lost her adoptive parents in the DS1 blast
- Was tortured by her own father
- Had a "weird" relationship with Luke before she knew it was her brother
- Lost most of his friends in the Rebellion at the hands of her real father (Vader)
- Her marriage to Han failed
- Could not steer the New Republic and prevent the war with the FO (failed as politician)
- Her only son turned to the Dark Side and abandoned her
- Her only son committed patricide

The only reason I think Ben will have to be redeemed or shown to do good is for Leia's sake. Hasn't she suffered enough?, will she not have any peace and happiness?

 

Yes. I'd like Kylo redeemed more for the sake of his family than anything else.

 

continued from here: http://boards.theforce.net/threads/...-new-guidelines-on-page-228.50040666/page-267

i've actually always found this interesting since i thought that the main point TFA showed was how kylo has committed a terrible offense that not even vader could commit and the immediate message to me in my first viewing was that the story is saying he's sealed his fate. this isn't to say that this fate will not be tragic.

it wasn't until i thought about it more that i began to consider the alternative. but most of my redemption thinking for this character reflects my own wishes. i like redemption stories because i find them internally uplifting and they remind me that of all the ways i perceive myself as having fallen and failed, that there is still hope, that my problems are not nearly so insurmountable as i may often believe. redemption stories "heal my soul" in other words. stories about the condemned who just lock themselves deep in hell feel to me like the devil has won, and there is no hope. to me they mean the dark side has won (in the star wars lens).

anyway at this point i have no prediction at all about kylo's fate. i think that what he has done has been deliberately presented as the most awful thing ever and really not only killing his father but that his father was beloved han solo and that it was the murder of a man who was only there trying to save him... this *is* worse than vader. but i also think that han's unconditional love will be a dagger of light in kylo's heart, potentially guaranteeing that there is no escape from the light now.

but anyway i can 100% understand the position that kylo will not be redeemed.

 

I agree.

It was the “pull to the light” and “there’s still light in him” lines that convinced me he’s on a redemption arc, no matter how much JJ appeared to want me to loathe Kylo as of TFA. That’s textbook “redemption arc” foreshadowing, imo.

And coming out of TFA I had no desire to see Kylo redeemed at all.

 

I'm somewhat interested in conducting a survey on how agnostics and atheists perceive a potential redemption arc vs. practitioners of the major world religions, particularly Judaism and Christianity. As someone from a joint Jewish-Christian household (now agnostic), I found the teasing of a redemption arc blindingly obvious in TFA. I remember sitting in the theatre and - no pun intended - going 'Oh, jeeze' as the prodigal son spilt blood of a father on a lightsaber literally shaped like a cross. Like, c'mon, JJ. Twisted inversion of Judeo-Christian parables and beliefs, but still subtle as a brick through a window. Ben = Ben-oni = 'Son of my sorrow', but also derivative of the root bana, meaning 'rebuilding' or 'raise up.' Again, subtle. The only thing I'll be truly shocked by in TLJ and IX is if Ben doesn't get a redemption.

And yes, +1 what you've said, JoJo. It was almost like JJ was trying a little too hard to get us to hate Kylo. Sure, there was craft to it. We wouldn't have 500+ pages of ongoing debate if there wasn't. But it was still heavy-handed, as if in anticipation for a bait-and-switch.

 

since i don't mind, i'm agnostic and i like spirituality - all of it.

however, i really do believe they could go either way with kylo in this story (the pull to the light stuff will end up being foreshadowing *regardless of the direction*). it's possible that kylo's path wasn't even pre-determined.

 

I feel like Kylo Ren should be redeemed.

Anything otherwise would just go against the idealism of Star Wars IMO.

 

I feel that you don’t have a character commit patricide onscreen without having a firm sense of the intended endgame....

 

i think it's both a myth that they always know where the story is going in movies and that if they don't the story will be bad because it was too last minute. it's one thing to consider rey's parentage as locked in (i think it probably was, though just going off DR quotes). but it's another to see the end of the trilogy as locked in. in the OT for instance GL was considering ending with luke on the dark side i seem to remember. i think that the path is not necessarily pre-planned and even if sketched out is not something that must be adhered to. this is going off of RJ's quotes about how much leeway/freedom he had. however, JJA is back and finishing, so if he had an overall idea he can carry it through, or completely change his mind.

 

And if you’re uncertain of where you want to take a character you don’t narrow your options by having a character do what Kylo did....

 

but are the options narrowed if redemption and being forever condemned remain on the table. patricide stories don't usually end in redemption???

 

Didn't JJ say that they decided to have Kylo kill Han because it was the only way to paint Kylo as the truly evil bad guy? Presumably if they hadn't had him do something as awful as that, the audience might have left TFA fairly certain that his redemption was a sure thing?

Having Kylo kill Han pushed Kylo firmly into the Bad corner where most of the fanboys hate him and the GA think he's this trilogy's Vader. If the're going to have a redemption arc, they need the situation to look impossible right through the first third of IX.

 

This is a really interesting thread some great points and food for thought. I think the Kylo/Ben story will not only be pivotal to this trilogy but also tell us where Disney are going with the future of the franchise from a movie perspective at least...Kylo/Ben carries on the Skywalker story which is the central theme, if Disney wish to carry on this theme with additional movies/trilogies you feel a redemption arc is most certainly on the cards, if Disney do not see the Skywalker story as the future then we could get something very different. Unless of course Rey is a Skywalker....a debate/conversation for another thread (hopefully we'll get some answers on Rey's lineage TLJ - otherwise it's Palpatine is Plagueis all over again )

 

Why not both? Just kidding. They already did that with Anakin

 

Well Anakin killed all those little kids and he was redeemed in ROTJ, right? So Kylo might still be redeemed after all.

 

After that line from leaked pages of TLJ book about Kylo want the revenge, i slide much more towards him not being redeemed and all these speculations and fake leaks are absolutely misleading and far from truth.
I didn't like Kylo character in TFA at all, but see the POTENTIAL, thus think that redemption will only make him worse. He isn't Anakin/Darth Vader and never had conditions that will allow his redemption to be as glorious and believable and understandable as Darth Vader's one. It will ruin the pitiful angry murderer. Kylo should stay evill till the very end.
Redemption won't fix his character, at least in my eyes. It won't make him a good guy, nor good character.
Dive further into the depths of Dark Side IS ABLE to shape him into formidable character, an Interesting villain.