Should Qui-Gon Jinn appear as a Jedi ghost?

Discussion in 'Revenge of the Sith (Non-Spoilers)' started by Kit-Fisto7BA, Mar 23, 2003.

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  1. Kit-Fisto7BA Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Mar 21, 2003
    star 3
    I've been wondering should Qui-Gon Jinn appear to Obi-Wan or Anakin in Episode III?
  2. Jedi_Master201 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 5, 2001
    star 5
    Yes.


    Or he should at least appear in SOME form.
  3. SaberGiiett7 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2002
    star 6
    No, that storyline should be left indigenious to the Original Trilogy. Yoda and Obi Wan disappeared but none of the Jedi that persished in the Prequel's including the arena and Qui Gon have vanished, therefore they hav'ent acquired that ability... yet. :)

    <[-]> Saber
  4. Malaki Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Feb 16, 2003
    star 2
    I think that he should, but to Obi-Wan, not to Anakin. It would seem to be a waste of energy to have a dialog between those two when Ani is well on his way if not fully into the dark side. It would work with Obi though, he being the former Padawan and all. It would also explane how Obi-wan knows that he will be able to do this with Luke later. Jinn doesn't even nessesarally have to apear in the movie. Just his voice would be sufficient.

    This will work just as long as there is no explaining how Qui-gon is doing it. Obi never felt the need to explain to Luke, and it was just accepted that he could, so why bother going into an explanation now?
  5. DarthKarde Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2002
    star 5
    It really depends on how GL intends to expand and explain the phenomenon, if indeed he does.
  6. -_-_-_-_-_- Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Apr 28, 2002
    star 6
  7. Adali-Kiri Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 31, 2000
    star 4
    Lucas has stated that the disppearing and reappearing thing will indeed be elaborated on. We haven't seen any Jedi disappear yet, and we know that they do in the OT. Neither have we seen any Force ghosts, but they are aplenty in the OT. However, in AOTC Qui-Gon Jinn's voice comes through when Anakin slaughters the Tusken tribe. The novel further explains that Yoda hears it and is truly disturbed, because he has never heard of any possibility of communicating from beyond...

    So something will happen, and it seems to involve Qui-Gon Jinn...
  8. Garth Maul Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    May 18, 2002
    star 6
    Yeah, I'm in agreement with DarthKarde and Adali-Kiri.

    There is a definite reason why we heard Qui-Gon's voice in AOTC.

    Something tells me he'll be appearing to both Anakin and Obi-Wan, and possibly Yoda, although that's just my gut feeling right now.

    I would like an explanation for the whole disappearing vs. non-disappearing, Jedi Ghost vs. non-Ghost phenomenon as well.

    But I agree that it MIGHT be better to leave it alone - if Lucas gets too philosophical (or starts to interfere too much with the OT), it could screw things up.

    Lucas has said all along that we'll see the OT differently after the PT is complete; already we have to see Obi-Wan, Vader, and Palpatine in a new light, and I think the Jedi-Ghost explanation will be along the same line.
  9. Jedi Greg Maddux Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 3, 1999
    star 6
    I think he should, solely because I saw a QGJ ghost in a fan trailer in late 2001. :p

  10. Kizakh Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2002
    star 3
    Yes, if it advances the story.

    Quiggy rocks!
  11. DarthKarde Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2002
    star 5
    I for one remain convinced that Qui-Gon's story is uncomplete. I am sure that there will be references to him at the very least. Furthermore I can't see Lucas not expanding on the disapearing Jedi / Force ghost angle. Whether this means we get to see a Qui-Gon ghost, I don't know.
  12. MOSEP Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 22, 2002
    star 2
    I read somewhere that QGJ was to make an appearence in AOTC, but it was changed due to a motorcycle incident.
    So they only used his voice (NO,Anakin, no...).
    So i say yes, he propably will.
  13. Adali-Kiri Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 31, 2000
    star 4
    We don't even have to ask. Lucas has confirmed time and again that this issue WILL be adressed. And with Jinn's voice coming through in AOTC, what could possibly be the next step...?
  14. THE_MISSING_TRIPLET Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 28, 2003
    star 4
    hey everybody we've bin discussin this very topic in the spoiler forum personally i think he will appear to obi1 due to their strong connection, but yoda did hear his voice in aotc.. anywayz if u'd like to discuss it there feel welcome, this is one discussion u don't have to worry about being spoiled on


    force ghosts in episode 3
  15. OBI-GYN_Kenobi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 25, 2002
    star 3
    Here's my take:

    Jedi's body disappears, Jedi returns as a 'force ghost'.

    Jedi's body doesn't disappear, he doesn't return as a visable 'force ghost'.

    Now, QGJ just speaking from the great beyond seems to fit better, but I bet GL will show QGJ & screw up the whole 'consistency' that's been shown forth in the 4 'sequels' to Star Wars (aka ANH).

    The one glitch there is Obi-Wan's voice guiding Luke in the Death Star battle in ANH. Maybe force ghosts can't be seen when traveling at fast speeds? ;)



  16. THE_MISSING_TRIPLET Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 28, 2003
    star 4
    i highly doubt that. ok ob1 and yoda dissapear, but does vader? there is no visible proof. so with this in hand qgj could and should return in ep3
  17. OBI-GYN_Kenobi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 25, 2002
    star 3
    Allegedly, the Official site was changed from Vader died & Anakin/Vader's body was burned to just the suit was burned.

    This creates big problems with the PT story......

    Supposedly, the AOTC novel states Yoda was shocked to hear QGJ's voice, i.e., Jedi never retained their identity up until then.
    Allegedly, GL has stated that OB1 learns the trick of 'retaining his identity' between EP's 3-4.

    If so, how'd Vader/Anakin learn it? He was obviously shocked at OB1's disappearance.
    There's only 2 possible answers:

    1. Vader researched & figured it out after seeing OB1 "up & vanish like a fart in the wind" (Shawshank Redemption quote).

    2. Obi-Wan gives the dying Anakin a crash course in 'Identity Retention 101' as Luke drags him to the shuttle in ROTJ.


    However, there's a bigger problem if Vader/Anakin didn't disappear after dying in ROTJ:

    How'd his 'force ghost' retain his identity if he didn't "up & vanish like a fart in the wind"? (Sorry, I love that quote ;) )

    That would imply that EVERY Jedi who died retained his identity, & GL is obviously not implying that in the PT.

    Either way, I believe there's going to be some inconsistency in the final explanation.

  18. Garth Maul Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    May 18, 2002
    star 6
    Agreed, doctor.

    My brother and I think that Jedi such as Yoda and Obi-Wan epitomize what it means to be Jedi, so they are Jedi "Saints" in a way - this is why they disappear, this is why they re-appear as Jedi Ghosts.

    I think Vader disappears and Luke burns the armor, but that's just me.

    That would be enough for me.

    But I agree, Obi-Gyn, that things might get more complicated now.

    Qui-Gon definitely doesn't disappear - and there are dozens of Jedi corpses on the Arena floor on Geonosis.

    Will they become ghosts?

    See, I thought the Jedi Saint theory means that the disappearing happens without using a certain "technique", beyond being calm and wise and immersing one's self in the Force.

    To use a Biblical reference, it's like when Elijah gets carried bodily up to Heaven - Yoda and Ben become one with the Force immediately, and their bodies disappear.

    The same thing happens to Anakin after his redemption.

    They will (and should be) the only Jedi Ghosts IMHO, but I'm positive Qui-Gon will be one.

    I can't decide whether Lucas figured on doing this with Qui-Gon from pre-TPM, or if he just figured he should expand his character...
  19. Vanthorne_OX Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Nov 11, 2002
    star 3
    I'm thinking it will just be Qui-Gon's voice, no ghost. But it all depends on how Lucas goes about explaining the phenomenon, and/or how much he'll leave for the audience to decide for themselves.
  20. Drunken-1mmortal Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Mar 24, 2003
  21. winter_chili Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 6, 2002
    star 5
    alright this is a long shot but maybe people who are igg.gadgo nevemrind i proved my own theory wrong while typing the premise...sigh
  22. Garth Maul Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    May 18, 2002
    star 6
    best...post...EVER!

    Man, that's happened to me at least a dozen times here. My sympathies.;)
  23. LordIsurus Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jun 24, 1999
    star 3
    Supposedly, the AOTC novel states Yoda was shocked to hear QGJ's voice, i.e., Jedi never retained their identity up until then.

    I want to preface this idea with the forethought that Sith teachings are not what leads to the dark side as much as how they're used or abused. Errr, but thats a whole other thread. But, I thought I'd mention that so people dont assume Qui-Gon is a dark sider. His lineage of Padawans, Dooku's lineage of Padawans really, all have this ability to retain their identity. Dooku, highly probably, also knew of Sith teachings prior to his association with Sidious. A lesson passed down to his Padawan, Qui-Gon, and from Qui-Gon, eventually, to Obi-Wan. It's something other Jedi dont know much about because the Jedi are ignorant to Sith teachings. Thats why those teachings are feared so much.

    Ok ok...so I have thoughts that if Qui-Gon does appear, somehow it'll be shown it's because of Sith teachings. But..I suspect even if Qui-Gon is shown, there's a possibility that Anakin may be 'possessed' by a former Sith Lord...possibly Darth Bane. That would show Bane and Sidious to be taking the whole Sith appirition teaching to an extent it's not intended....sorry for getting off topic a bit. Ciao!

    Isurus the White
  24. OBI-GYN_Kenobi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 25, 2002
    star 3
    Are you sure you're not 'Darth Howell' on the spoilers thread & just changed your name? ;)
  25. _Xanatos_ Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Feb 18, 2003
    star 3
    I would like it, but if he doesn't I won't be bummed.
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