Should "The Duel" be reclassified as "Yoda vs. Sidious?" Instead of "Obi Wan vs. Vader?"

Discussion in 'Revenge of the Sith' started by DarthSithLord, Apr 27, 2005.

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  1. r8hitman Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 30, 2004
    star 4
    Anakin vs. Obi-Wan has no real bearing on the story at all.

    Neither one of them is killed, and it's not where Anakin makes his choice, and even if Anakin was killed it wouldnt have mattered because Sidious is the problem NOT Anakin.

    This fight is more "symbolic" than anything.

    It's symbolic of a relationship gone bad more than a primary piece of the story.

    The place where Anakin makes his choice is during the Mace/Sidious duel.

    The fate of galaxy was to be determined during the Sidious/Yoda duel.

    Showing how manipulative Sidious can be was the reason for the Anakin/Dooku duel.

    Besides the breakdown of a friendship, Obi-Wan vs. Anakin really only has one thing going for it....it shows us why Vader needs a breathing machine, but to say it's a pivotal part of the story isnt true.
  2. lordvicious Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Apr 17, 2005
    star 2
    I am looking forward to Yoda vs. Sidious more despite GLs wishy washy ideas about how it should play out. He changes his mind about key things too damn much. The Anakin vs. Obi Wan will be longer and probably more emotional, but I have been wanting to see Yoda and the Emperor fight since I first saw the Emperor unleash force lightning. Back then, I didn't even know that Obi Wan is why Vader is what he is.
  3. -Master_Yoda- Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Feb 6, 2005
    star 3
    Well, I think:

    1) Yoda v. Palpaltine will be the most visually stunning and awesome in terms of Force Power. I have to admit, it's the one which has me excited!

    2) Obi-wan v. Darth Vader will be the most emotionally draining, and intense, because of what it means

    3) Mace v. Palpatine is the one I'm most interested about (blasphemy!). I want to see Mace fight properly at last, see him kick some Sith arse, and see if Palpatine is really faking. The 'POWER' bit at the end should also be quite good ;)#

    EDIT
    Just out of interest, I think perhaps people should state what they saw first. I've got an as yet unproven theory that the children of the 70s/80s will be after the Obi-wan/Vader, as opposed to Yoda v. Palpatine
  4. r8hitman Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 30, 2004
    star 4
    Yoda vs. Palpatine is more than just a "visually stunning" duel....it's the most important in the saga.
  5. -Master_Yoda- Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Feb 6, 2005
    star 3
    ^
    I agree it the most important in terms of the fate of the Galaxy, far, far away, but in terms of the story, and hence maybe the saga, Obi-wan v. Darth Vader is.

    The Saga is essentially the rise, fall and redemption of Anakin Skywalker, which makes Obi-wan v. Darth Vader the most important.

    But I agree with you, from a certain point of view ;)
  6. Padme Bra Administrator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 1999
    star 6
    <i>Anakin vs. Obi-Wan has no real bearing on the story at all. </i>

    Did someone actually type that? Star Wars was never about the fate of the galaxy. (EU aside), the galaxy may well have fell into anarchy two minutes after ROTJ for all we know.

    Think of your best friend or your brother. Then think of that person commiting the worst atrocities you can imagine and beleieving that you're partially responsible. And now you have to kill him. Now watch him sloawly burn to death as you turn your back. What influence the duel turns out to have on the outcome of the galaxy has nothing to to with its importance.
  7. CIDLORD Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Sep 6, 2001
    star 3

    Yoda and Sidious are the most powerful force users.

    Therefore, that is the real duel of the saga.
  8. -Master_Yoda- Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Feb 6, 2005
    star 3
    Star Wars was never about the fate of the galaxy. (EU aside), the galaxy may well have fell into anarchy two minutes after ROTJ for all we know.

    But we happily know that didn't happen thanks to the montage George so helpfully inserted in the Special Edition :p

    What influence the duel turns out to have on the outcome of the galaxy has nothing to to with its importance.

    I agree. In terms of the Saga, it's THE most important, and the pivotal moment in the Saga for me.

    The most important duel for the Galaxy is Yoda v. Sidious
  9. Darth001 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Apr 7, 2005
    star 1
    Yoda vs Sidious does not hold that much importance in that everyone including Yoda knows beforehand that he cannot win. Yoda knows that Anakin is the chosen one and the only one capable of bringing down Sidious.
  10. Padme Bra Administrator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 1999
    star 6
    The we're speaking on different terms. To the audience, what is more important, what regime rules the galaxy or the main characters? In ROTJ, what did you care about more, the rebels blowing up the Death Star or the Luke, Palpatine and Vader arc?
  11. Barf_Vader Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Oct 26, 2004
    star 1
    I'm looking foward to Yoda v Sidious more,but the focus of the film is on the Obi v Anikan/Vader duel.
  12. Darth001 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Apr 7, 2005
    star 1
    Can't say I'm really excited at all in seeing Yoda in action. Sure the first time I saw him fighting in AOTC, it was brilliant because it was something we had never seen before and always wondered about but after you saw it a few more times, you kinda thought that it wasn't really all that great afterall. Its not Yoda's fault because he just happens to be a green 3 ft cgi model but there's only a certain style that he can fight in and seeing his just jumping and spinning around again and again like Sonic the Hedgehog, like an earlier post described, its not really that exciting at all, especially when you know its just a cgi figure.

    I'm even looking more forwaed to seeing Mace in action than Yoda.
  13. obianikdart Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 2, 2002
    star 4
    NO

    YoDA vs sidious will be great to see


    But VAder vs Obi Wan is where the emotion , the drama ,and everything else will be
  14. tephjo Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 30, 2005
    star 4
    Yoda v Sids is just sorta a fun thing that gets thrown in there, its cool to see, but the emotion is with Obi and Anakin
  15. PloKoons_Apprentice Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Mar 29, 2005
    star 1
    i think there just as equally important becuase both duels symbolize somthing
  16. r8hitman Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 30, 2004
    star 4
    Padme Bra you're talking as if everybody has wondered about Obi-Wan and Vader's relationship since the beginning ('77).

    Nobody even thought Vader=Anakin until ESB (and wasnt confirmed until ROTJ), and even then he wasnt the "central" part of the story, it was all about Luke's quest for his father, we didnt even really get to know about Anakin and Obi's relationship until the PT.

    The StarWars Saga is all about the classic battle between good and evil, the best way to represent that is Sidious vs. Yoda.....Obi-Wan vs. Anakin is just the "extra" treat that you guys keep trying to refer to Y vs. S as.


    And even though the story is about Anakin's fall and redemption, we never really make an emotional connection to Anakin in the OT, it's only through Luke do we even feel anything for Anakin/Vader.

    He's basically the "new hero" (since Lucas put the movies out backwards) and the two characters who are central characters in both trilogies are Sidious and Yoda and to see them "finally" go at it is what StarWars is all about IMO.
  17. SnakeCharmer Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 9, 2004
    star 1
    Obi-Wan vs. Anakin is far more important to the story of star wars.

    1. it is Anakin's story.

    2. Obi-Wan defeating Vader, is the only reason why Luke and Leia don't grow up under him, and why Plapy is able to continue his rule. Anakin not becoming mr. roboto would of lead to Plapy dying a slow and painful death once Vader was ready to strike. Heck it is also the only reason Anakin i able to gain his redemption.

    3. Obi vs. Anakin doesn't end in one guy running away. It is to the death, the way it should be.
  18. The_Dark_Knight Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 15, 2004
    star 4
    The Duel will always be Obi vs Vader so dramatic and so visually awesome. Here is some Duel footage right here just click on the link to see my tribute to the Duel.

    http://rapidshare.de/files/906140/The_Duel__final_version_.wmv.html
  19. -Master_Yoda- Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Feb 6, 2005
    star 3
    The StarWars Saga is all about the classic battle between good and evil

    Yes, but the good and evil is represented in one character - Anakin Skywalker, who is the central character of the saga.


    We never really make an emotional connection to Anakin in the OT, it's only through Luke do we even feel anything for Anakin/Vader.

    I would have agreed with you before 1999. The Prequel Trilogy changed all that. I would argue that you make an emotional connection to Vader, given his fall from being the innocent child Qui-gon found on Tatooine. Yes, Luke enhances that connection, but I don't think you can say there is no connection otherwise.

    I also dispute the fact that Yoda is the incarnation of good. He may be more powerful, but I don't think he's any less 'good' than Obi-wan.

    As I said in my previous post, the saga is about Anakin, and therefore his duel with Obi-wan should be termed 'The Duel'.

    I would only name Yoda v. Palpatine 'The Duel' if the Saga was primarily about the fall of the Republic, which for me, is only a sub-story to Anakin's.
  20. tephjo Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 30, 2005
    star 4
    Yoda vrs Palpatine is going to be nothig next to the duel.

    The special effects may wow the first time, but the emotion of the Anakin vrs Obi fight will carry it far longer in peoples minds.
  21. r8hitman Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 30, 2004
    star 4
    No, Yoda isnt any more 'good' than Obi-Wan, but he is more powerful.

    Just in the same way that Sidious isnt any more evil than Maul, but he is more powerful.

    These two characters are basically "representatives" of their sides (because of their levels of power), the ultimate good guy vs. the ultimate bad guy.

    That's what makes this so important IMO.


    EDIT: That kinda sounded like "Thunderlips" from Rocky III for a minute :p
  22. Ob-wan-shawa Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Mar 10, 2005
    star 3
    The diff is emoional or collness. The Duel is more emotional more the movie more it! While Yoda Sideous might be a coooler duel it's not the same.
  23. DARTH__DEATH Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 30, 2003
    star 2
    sure it's "the duel" in terms of the two toughest guys fighting (yoda/sidious)

    but THE duel should and is about Anakin/Obiwan ... due to the emotionalism.... the betrayal ... a father and a son (their relationship is kinda like that.) ....the dynamic of their relationship.

    Just infinitely deeper meaning than just the 2 toughest guys fighting.

    It's gonna be really emotionally something to see anakin/obiwan at the end.... anakin says (as he's about to bite it with the lava) ....... "I hate you"

    wow! emotional stuff.

    that's gonna be something to see.

    that's THE duel.
  24. SlytherinHouse Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 20, 2000
    star 4

    I like the way Stover put it...Yoda vs. Sidious is millennia of Jedi vs millennia of Sith...light vs dark.

    Obi-Wan vs Anakin is so much more and so much less. It's personal.

    Sly
  25. Deeysew Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Mar 5, 2005
    star 4
    From what I know about this fight, the yoda vs sids battle will be like the burly brawl from Matrix Reloaded (actually a lot of rots is looking like it har har bash bash) lots of pointless action until the real story comes back into focus again. Neo vs A thousand agent smiths = Obi-wan vs Grievous and his legion of doom. Go back to the superfriends you cyborg bastard. Vader vs Obi-wan = Neo vs Smith (revolutions)

    Gratuitous and pointless as it is... guess what?

    I'm one of the 1% out there who really enjoyed the hell out of matrix reloaded despite the entire film being full of pointless violence and some white dude sitting in a chair explaining things to the Chosen One.

    HAR HAR!
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