Discussion in 'Archive: The Senate Floor' started by Mr. P, Mar 10, 2013.
LandoTheCape, you are not allowed to talk economics unless you first understand it. If you're spouting off Austrian school crap about the Fed squandering and fiat money and yada yada, you don't understand economics but do understand the cultural appeal of the humble parrot.
In short: at what rate would the Fed apply interest? From what date to what date? Would they average out a rate or apply it daily, in which case, who will pay for the implementation of this system?
In dispute resolution involving any funds that should be awarded to a party or parties, the notion of an opportunity cost is rejected. That is, let's say your tax gets an average rate of 0.3% (lol. Your economy is crap). Now, you're savvy and entitled to a whopper of a refund, so you argue that the return could have netted you an average of 6% in a term deposit, or 10% in shares. The fact that these claims are universally recognised as invalid doesn't stop people from making them so my question is this; how much is budgeted for responding to those claims from the X-hundred million American taxpayers?
Your idea is ill-considered sir. Understandable, but ill considered.
The GAO exists to keep the money accountable for most departments and agencies (just a few like DoD, DoHS, CIA aren't audited annually).
Is there still some waste that the GAO misses? Of course. But it's minimal. Could the government be completely reorganized for better efficiency and structure? Yes, see my thread for that.
While it's a problem, it's not too big of a problem. People do know where most of their tax dollars are going, if they bother to look into it.
Talking like this:
"The reason they don't break down where your money goes because if the oublic knew no one would file income taxes, plus there would prob be riots everywhere ... that doesn't give you any information you can actually use. People would be shocked to find out how the FED wastes our taxes. ... None of that money is used for anything like infrastructure. Most federal money is squandered on nonsense. If you actually believe our taxes are used properly I have a bottomless glass I wanna sell you. I feel our federal government should be held to the same standards as a private company when it comes to handling money and 'the books'"
...is not helpful, or enlightening. At first you make it sound like you have insider knowledge, but you don't.
It doesn't sound like you've really done that much research into how the government works... so maybe you should do some more research before you form opinions?
AND from the federal government.
(also, states and municipalities used bonds [aka borrowing, aka NOT taxes] to finance most capital projects, and just use tax revenue for maintenance)
and if youre spouting off Keynesian crap you are not allowed to talk economics either, well until you understand it...
and I didn't know you had to be from a specific "school of thought" to believe that our government wastes enormous amounts of money...
The Interstate Highway System was built with local city taxes from every town and hamlet in American acting spontaneously under the guide of the free market. The federal government never helped at all.
Ron Paul 2012
when bridges and roads are built locally it comes from local and state taxes or paying a toll or some type of consumption tax at the pump... Money being taken out for the FED directly does not go to fixing a road..
Whats funny is you use the word "MINIMAL" when it comes to government waste and your the one who says I need to do more research on how government works..
If you think you get the most for your taxes than we cant even have a debate at all, youre another one with the freaking wool pulled over your eyes. Its like you've never even put on TV and seen the sad state of affairs our medical expenditures are costing the tax payers, and the amount of waste that comes with it..
But in your mind the government doesn't waste your money.
Well city taxes and municipal taxes go to what infrastructure you use locally and on a daily basis. The FED has nothing to do with that. They serve different purposes from federal taxes..
You don't use highways regularly? No one does?
no one would contest that most of your local infrastructure comes from local or state funds. still doesn't make your claim that none of your federal tax dollars go to infrastructure any less ridiculous. i guess you could keep trying to narrow you definition of infrastructure until it matches that statement. that will be fun.
and that's paid for with a gas tax or tolls...
Generally speaking that's what pays for the highways.
Currently though I wouldn't be shocked to see how the major highways aren't dipping into more broad taxes from the state or states they run through. Id venture to say the highway lobby in America probably makes it hard for more mass transit approaches to get off the ground..
no no, youre wrong, you made the claim that local infrastructure doesn't come from city and municipal taxes...
lol, i did?
Apologies, Congressman Paul. However, all the record shows is this.
You're looking pretty wrong here. Surprise.
yes which was directly related to roads and local infrastructure being paid for federally. In which he was 100% wrong, just like you are. The infrastructure you use the most, in your city or towns is not paid for by federal taxes. That's municipal and local taxes...
That wasn't the issue anyway, the issue was the misuse of federal tax money and if you really get the most bang for your buck... You think you do, while I think we don't.. That's all that was being spoken on...
It wasn't "directly related" to anything except in your head. What you actually posted was that no money whatsoever is used by the federal government to support infrastructure at any time. You made the statement without qualifiers or caveats.
yeah, because my post contains the word "local" or the phrase "that you use most". i'm not even sure what you're trying to do here. is it that worth it to you to be "right" that you have to distort the entire conversation? ugh.
Should the Federal Government pay interest on tax refunds?
Just use your tax refund to buy savings bonds.
Remember earlier when you were disagreeing with me, on page 1, and I said infrastructure doesn't come from the federal lot.
Its because it doesn't, infrastructure is generally paid for locally. Now sure maybe there prob are times it isn't paid for locally, so than I guess would be wrong but nowhere as wrong as you are for thinking local roads, bridges are paid by federal income taxes. Which theyre clearly not...
Remember when you said is it paid for by magic? or rich benefactors? No it isn't paid for by either, most is paid locally. In turn making you completely wrong.
i was never making a point about local infrastructure (still not sure where you're getting this). i was making a point about where your federal income tax dollars go, because that's what we were discussing. can you stop this now?
no no you completely were making a point about infrastructure, in which was directly related to me and what I posted...
and I said infrastructure isn't paid for by federal taxes... you made some smart ass comment towards me because I don't believe the exact way you do.
Now don't get me wrong, I even said above there is a chance that federal money is "NOW" being used to pay for highways, but infrastructure isn't just highways. Its schools, local roads, bridges, and a million other things. Which is paid for by local and municipal taxes and gas taxes, and tolls etc etc etc.
Let's just discuss positions, not individual posters. - SuperWatto
You realize that even in your warped re-telling of the thread, what you claimed to have said still isn't right? Where the "majority" of funds for infrastructure comes from has nothing to do with whether there are federal funds directed towards such endeavors or not. Your heavily revised comments aren't a rebuttal but at best an aside.
dude infrastructure is paid for locally.... what don't you get...
Sure I will admit that the federal hand probably does make its way over to it but not to the point in which id be wrong. All things locally are paid for locally. Its just that simple. Federal income taxes don't go to fixing a road in your town. That's not how it works.
That's all im getting at, when you pay federal taxes its used to pay the bureaucracy and to pay the holders of our debt, i.e. other countries, the federal reserve etc etc etc, federal taxes don't fix a bridge or the parkway highway I drive every day in New Jersey, it doesn't pay police, or teachers or fund local public schools. That's done locally... The schools are something that feels the government hand more than the roads though.