PT Simon Pegg's Recent Comments

Simon Pegg does not respect us? Good, we do not respect him.
Respect for Dave Filoni, the only successor of Lucas.

 

My partner swore she'd never watch a Star Wars film. One day TPM comes on the TV and it slowly starts gnawing away at her. She ends up watching the rest of the films and now not only loves them, says her two favourites are AOTC and ROTS. I now can't wait to have kids and show them the films 1-6 (whether they watch 7-9 will be completely their decision ). To be honest, I'm envious of anyone who gets to watch them in that order for the first time.

 

Well if you think about it rationally, I'm not sure Lucas really did know what he wanted from his films. The PT and the OT really contradict each other in a lot of ways, creating a great amount of plot holes. When the OT came out, Lucas said that there wouldn't be any more films. He actually commissioned a book to finish off the story that A New Hope had started because he hadn't planned on making any other films on account of he was sure ANH was going to fail. When the PT came out, he said that he had always intended to have six films. Except he had only, in the beginning, intended to have one film and have a novel finish off his story. And the novel was completely different from what ESB and RotJ established. So from those bits of proof, I really don't think he had any idea what he wanted to do with the franchise.

 

As much as I love Pegg for being a nerd who got successful and made some very fun movies he has always had kind of an unlikeable streak to be honest, so it's very easy to take his blatherings with grain or two of salt.

If one of his lovely mates like Nick Frost or Edgar Wright had said this I'd be heartbroken though.

 

But that's not the same as failing to understand the films from a storytelling POV. That's failing to understand their potential from a business POV, at least initially. I think most people (including George) got to grips with understanding the business side of things after 1977 . And even then, I'm pretty sure he'd already cut the infamous deal with Fox which also gave him complete control over any sequels. Including that in his deal would point to a him wanting to make more movies regardless.

 

That's not the same thing as not understanding your own work though, and whatever the contradictory quotes from the past, he certainly wanted to make sequels - they were part of the negotiations with Fox from which he demanded total control of. Plus a lot of the very earliest ideas he had to discard initially found there way back into the PT.

He also described himself as a toy maker at times from the get go - so yeah he is hard to pin down, but given that ESB contradicted ANH straight away - from the very start, molding things, changing the angle and sculpting on the fly was going to be Lucas's way. In fact it makes more sense to say that if plot holes and inconsistencies bother you to much you don't understand the films, or at least you don't understand George Lucas. The poetry is not entirely in the script as people are forever pointing out.

double post as in saying same as d_arblay !!

 

Well that's true and that's a good point. But as I said in my previous post, there's a lot of inconsistency between the OT and the PT. (Two glaring ones being the use of midi-chlorians in the PT and Qui-Gon being Obi-Wan's teacher instead of Yoda, as was stated in the OT). It just feels like he either forgot a lot of his original story or he didn't really understand where he wanted to go with the prequels.

I wouldn't even say it's about poetry or creativity in this aspect. He has two completely opposing universes within one story. There's a lot that doesn't make sense when you relate the story or the PT to what we're told in the OT.

 

It just feels like he either forgot a lot of his original story or he didn't really understand where he wanted to go with the prequels.

People say things like this all the time, but it also applies to him deciding that Vader would be Lukes father for the next film. I mean did he just forget that Ben said he was killed by Vader? Did he really understand where he wanted to go?

He's not senile obviously.

There is a lot in ANH that doesn't make sense from what we are told in ESB

 

But that can be explained. In a way, Vader took over Anakin and killed him mentally and spiritually, if you go after that translation of the films. Even as a child, no one ever had to explain that fault in storytelling because that's how I had always interpreted it. There's really no way to explain a way out of the fact Yoda was originally Ben's teacher, or that anyone could be a Jedi in the OT, but in the PT all of the sudden you needed a certain amount of a special, symbiotic cell. So in my opinion and from what I've read, no. I don't think Lucas really understood where he wanted to go.

 

Not a fan of the prequels, so in a sense I agree with Pegg. I also think it's his right to express his opinions with as much exaggeration as he'd like. I do, however, expect that he'd show more tact in his choice of words, given that he has a role, however small, in a Star Wars movie that is yet to be released. It's not like he hasn't expressed this opinion in the past, but at the moment it's unprofessional and reflects poorly on his character.

Maybe I'm just old-fashioned.

I'll add something. I've regrettably not yet seen a Pegg movie, though I've heard good things about them. There's a strange correlation here, though--I see tons of people insisting that even his most lauded films aren't very good, are nothing special, etc. One or two people holding these opinions wouldn't raise an eyebrow (it's entirely possible I won't like his movies when I do get around to seeing them), but I think there's an odd bias at play here.

Roman Polanski is a detestable human being, but I'll acknowledge that Rosemary's Baby and Chinatown are exceptional films. So will most people. Are Pegg's sins so great that they retroactively affect the quality of his movies?

 

But we just go round in circles now where post hoc filling in, is, or is not acceptable depending entirely on what you want to hear / see / believe yourself.

Who taught me at college? Sure I had specific assigned tutors, but the senior staff taught everyone - and if you were a bright enough student would get to be familiar enough with senior staff for them to know you personally, and get the benefit of their advanced wisdom. They might write references for you or help you get on - even though you were not under their specific tutelage. I instinctively intuited that Yoda was this kind of teacher and knew Ben in this capacity if not as his assigned trainer.

But whatever - it's just an example for something that apparently really has no explanation.

What suggested to you that anyone could be a Jedi in the OT? I presumed the exact opposite because of the way Vader and his 'old order' seamed distinctly different from Tarkin say - who couldn't 'sense' anybody or anything.

But I hate doing all this nerdy cr@p, I just don't like this idea that everything was watertight until The Phantom Menace. There are as many intra trilogy as inter trilogy problems - all requiring fudges - or your imagination.

 

You're gonna hate the ST (Episode VII at least) even more I bet using that logic.

"For over a thousand generations the Jedi Knights were guardians of peace and justice in the old Republic" It's been a plan since the first movie.

So, it just takes 10 or so Jedi to help govern an entire GALAXY? I don't think you understand the scale of the universe, might wanna check it out.

http://htwins.net/scale2/

They were called Clones, but whatever floats your boat.

"You fought in the Clone Wars?" Again, planned. Boba being a clone was just an idea he came up with. I doubt it's fan service, as I can't seem to find any OT fan who likes Boba, but also likes that he is a clone.

What is plot.
It's a space opera, dude.

He never became the most powerful Jedi, you know... the suit and stuff. The story was always centered around Anakin. Just because you viewed them out of order doesn't change the fact.

Wut. The new planets were mostly physical sets and real locations. The only really heavy CGI was The Coruscant battle and stuff, which still hold up much better than even some of the modern stuff in today's movies.

How's it feel to tout your opinion around as fact? Others can like thing you don't like.

Kids loved Jar Jar and my family and myself have never been bothered by him, and found his antics to indulge a chuckle every now and then. Maybe you just outgrew Star Wars? It is a family friendly franchise targeted at the 8-14 male demographic.

And you're right, the force is not microscopic cells. But the Midiclorians are what channeled the force through the Jedi. Did you not pay attention when Qui-gon explained it?

Lots of people enjoy the films. Its mostly just a bandwagon thing that's gotten out of control. I had a friend who had only seen the prequels once when he was little who wouldn't watch them again because he heard they were bad. We sat down last week and watch all 6, and he thoroughly enjoyed all of them. It truly is a bandwagon that keeps itself in perpetual momentum.

Now I'm not saying that makes the movies good, but it certainly isn't at as bad as it's made out to be and doesn't deserve to be castrated for it.

No he doesn't. It's his opinion, and yours to an extent. It gives him an outlet for sure, but not credibility.

I personally find Simon Pegg to be an ass and enormously dislike both franchises you mentioned (well, the recent reboot fro Star Trek, old ones are still good). As well as his other films like Shawn of the Dead and such. So then to me his opinion is worth less than the dirt he stands on. Just because you've acted, doesn't give you penultimate authority over what is good and bad.

 

Dude, chill. Just trying to have a friendly, relaxed conversation. I haven't said anything to attack anyone here, you included. I request you extend the same courtesy to me.

The fact that Luke stated Leia could train to be a Jedi. The fact that Han could easily handle a lightsaber. It was suggested in the OT that anyone could become a Jedi if they studied and practiced. That was half the draw to kids. That you could be a Jedi and you didn't have to have some special requirement. Anyone could do it if they learned how and took the time required to achieve that status.

It was suggested, and later confirmed in various areas of canon, that once you're taken up as Padawan, your Master basically teaches you everything. As Yoda was not Obi-Wan's Master, we can deduce that he had very little to do with Obi-Wan's training in the Prequels. And yet Obi-Wan's quote in ESB suggests that Yoda was either a pivotal teacher, or was his only teacher when it came to being a Jedi.

 

If you're buying that then you shouldn't have any problems with connecting PT and OT. The only direct contradiction is Leia's memories about her mother. Everything else can be explained in some way.

By the way, I don't know if you're interested in the origins of Star Wars, but The Making Of books are a tremendous source and one of the most amazing things is how much from the original Star Wars drafts and designs were used in the rest of the OT and even the prequels. For example, Cloud City reused the design of Alderaan (before it was supposed to be blown up). A cyborg father who lost his humanity. An enemy who needed to be redeemed. A green alien accompanying the heroes (!). Obi-Wan playing a detective. The Knights of Sith. A hero named Annikin. And so on.

That doesn't mean he planned every single detail in advance or his ideas haven't evolved over the years but to say that he didn't know his own universe or he was always inconsistent is just factually untrue. All of Star Wars movies are extremely eclectic, combining elements that are often at odds with each other or outright bizarre (hard to believe now, but George had a hard time selling his idea precisely because it was so different from what everyone else was doing). Even if sometimes it gets to be too much for some folks, in that sense Lucas has always remained true to his vision.

 

Shira A'dola Well there you go, it's all interpretation. I simply presumed those will the aptitude could be trained, the same way that anyone can apply themselves to the piano - but only the talented would make it as a concert pianist. The general idea of commitment was universal though.

Anyway you is you and me is me - but right now I can't recall the scene where Luke suggests Leia could be a Jedi? Sorry !

 

But what about "The Force is strong in our family" stuff?
Why Luke? Why Ben and Yoda wanted to train him? Why not find a random guy (or a few)? Why both Vader and Emperor were interested in him? Why Luke suggested Leia could be a Jedi only after she turned out to be his sister? Clearly, there was some genetic component to their abilities.

Which doesn't mean it can't be random seeing as how Jedi are forbidden to have children and yet they still manage to have a few thousand of Jedi in the Order.

 

you could make the argument that only the family of the chosen one had any chance of defeating him, hence they didn't even try to train some random guy...

but what OT and PT links have to do with Simon Pegg is a riddle I can not answer, but the clue is probably that the thread has made it's point.

 

He wasn't the Chosen One as of the OT, only a very powerful Jedi once. But they absolutely assumed a son of a powerful Jedi would probably be at least close to him in power.

 

J.J. Abrams has specifically said that midi-chlorians has nothing to do with anything in his SW film. I have proof of the film that backs up the claim, but that would be MAJOR spoilers, so I can't post it here. You can PM me if you have any interest in it.

 

Considering this is Episode VII and it is not ignoring anything from the prequels, just because it doesn't mention midichlorians doesn't mean they don't exist anymore. Episode II didn't mention them, either.

 

He wasn't the Chosen One as of the OT
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that's irrelevant when watching the saga as a whole.

Point is Yoda and Obi-Wan know that Anakin is the chosen one by the time the OT. Regardless what was filmed first.

 

What I'm trying to say here is that idea of the Force inheritance didn't start with the midichlorians. It was clear as day in the OT (or, at least, it was clear to me... I guess a lot of kids missed it and decided they could be Jedi one day )

 

What's wrong with that? That was the whole magic of the films, believing you could be something as awesome as a Jedi. What's eye-roll inducing about that concept? I don't get it

 

sorry Shira A'dola that isn't an example of anybody being able to become a Jedi is it?!

 

I really don't care what Pegg says, to be quite honest.