JCC So 2030 Americas little problem

Oh, it's absolutely a racial and class issue.

From the office of minority health and usgovinfo.about.com

African Americans had the highest rates of obesity (31 percent) and Native Americans had the highest rates of diabetes (33 percent or more). People with less than a high school education had higher rates of both obesity (27 percent) and diabetes (13 percent) than people who had a high school education. African American women were 70% more likely to be obese than Non-Hispanic White women. Deaths from heart disease and stroke are almost twice the rate for African Americans as compared to Whites.

 

I actually agree with you. Everyone is getting fatter in the U.S. across socioeconomic strata, but the problem is, um, largest among the poor.

Also, the problem can't be attributed to "people are lazy." Children are among the hardest hit in the epidemic. If you become fat as a child, your chances of staying fat all your life are, er, huge. Also, the science of weight loss shows that dieting almost always fails. And as you say, people with the most access to professional help do best. And the development of the epidemic over time suggests that something else is going on besides just that Americans are losing their power of self-control. The reality is that power is somewhat illusory. Eating is by and large not easy to control with high level cognition. It's regulated by an animal brain designed to eat whenever it encounters an opportunity. We've developed a society that has encouraged sedentary behaviors and effectively removed all roadblocks to constant calorie consumption.

We have something like 15% of Americans on food stamps. Even more people being fed at least in part through privately-run community food banks. The first thing I would do if I had control of our national health/poverty policies is convert this program into a national nutrition program.

Everyone who qualifies for this program would have to come in for family nutritional education and nutritional planning and budgeting. And instead of being loosed with their food EBT cards, people who qualify for benefits would have to go to a nutritional distribution center where they would have an allotment of food matching their family's weekly nutritional needs provided to them. Another option would be to subsidize grocery stores by putting something like a food stamp buyer into a store who would shop with qualified food stamp participants to help them meet their nutritional needs with a restricted set of nutritious and healthy foods.

Nutritional planning should be incorporated into child welfare/health and family services programs at the state and municipal levels.

To test this model, the government should fund a pilot program for federal community health and nutrition centers where people who qualify for food or other welfare assistance could go to have healthy food distributed to them, get nutritional planning, have their EBT card spending matched against that nutritional planning and get tips for developing exercise routines. Fold that in with community programs to help people manage type 2 diabetes.

Also, as stated above, end all agricultural subsidies that artificially deflate the price of food. If I wanted to be really sneaky about it, I would triple the price of gasoline. This would raise food prices but also encourage the development of community lifestyles less dependent on automobile transportation. Encourage walking. Create walkable communities.

Aside from the flourishing of fast food outlets, walking is another thing that separates us from people a generation or two generations ago. If everyone physically able would walk 2-3 miles a day, the fat problem would be considerably reduced.

 

A topical article on how changing the obesity industry doesn't work : http://www.npr.org/blogs/thesalt/20...n-tried-to-slim-down-big-soda-from-the-inside

So the industry won't change itself, and the government can't or won't tax or demonize it into the margins.

 

Yeah, but how are they ever going to fund something like that? It sounds brilliant, and workable, and able to be implemented at a community level--but it would cost billions of dollars.

Currently food stamps are run out of the USDA budget--they're part of that farm bill that nobody wants to get passed. In 2011 it cost almost $80 billion, 92% of which went directly to food purchases (source). Congress stalled for a year and a half at increasing that even a fraction--and even then they didn't. So when state-funded programs attempt to do nutrition education, planning, and budgeting about all they can afford to do is say "don't drink pop" or promote the First Lady's initiatives. Effective.

 

Given what we're spending on the dole already, and given what we're going to be spending on the health consequences of obesity and diabetes, I see this as a cost-effective approach to the worst healthcare crisis in American history.

 

http://www.fns.usda.gov/snap/retailers/eligible.htm

http://www.fns.usda.gov/ora/menu/Published/snap/FILES/ProgramOperations/FSPFoodRestrictions.pdf

"No clear standards exist for defining foods as good or bad, or healthy or not healthy."

Personally, I believe this is bs, a line forced on the government by lobbying from the processed food industry. It's the mantra of every public relations statement of companies that make crappy food.

"Coca-cola isn't bad for you, because no clear standards exist for defining foods as good or bad."

"McDonald's hotcake breakfast with 56 grams of fat, 1090 calories and 2150 mg of sodium isn't bad for you, because no clear standards exist for defining foods as good or bad."

right.

 

I can't speak about federal assistance, but around here our state Louisiana Purchase assistance cards cover everything except for alcohol and tobacco.

 

The food assistance program is another massive subsidy to the food industry. The food industry has as big a vested interest in the program as the people who need food assistance, and they have the best-funded voice in influencing what the program looks like. The end result is that the program is not designed to optimally meet the nutritional needs of families who qualify for assistance. It's optimally designed to meet the needs of some of the biggest consumer products companies.

Some Wal-mart stores get 25-40% of their revenue from food stamp spending.

 

Not surprising. In 2007, the Junk Food Lobby campaigned and won to change the end of daylight saving time from the last Sunday in October to the first Sunday in November.

Trick'r treat!

 

There isn't an easy solution to our obesity problem and every person claiming to have an easy solution is either delusional or a liar. In the black community for example, there are deep cultural ties to high-fat, high-calorie foods. I assure that it's not (primarily) the consumption of high fructose corn syrup that has black Americans in the south suffering from disproportionately high levels of obesity and diabetes. It's soul food and a culture built around food.

My mother (a Jamaican immigrant) has been obese my entire life. As are all her sisters and brothers. Growing up, food was the focus of our lives. I can't count the number of times we'd be eating a very large lunch and the subject would turn to what we would be doing for dinner. You never leave food on your plate (starving children in Africa and all that) and enough food was always prepared so we could have seconds. If you got seconds, you better finish it (again, those poor children in Africa). You ate until you were full. Every day. Sunday dinner was "special" and we ate even more than normal. The point is food was everything. The caloric content or makeup of the food was simply not an issue.

Why were we like this? Well, maybe because we were inordinately poor for much of my youth and food was one of the very few pleasures we could afford. Jabba's point about the price of food is not entirely out of left field (his solution is a bit...unwise, though). Maybe because we had a lot bigger problems on our minds than our expanding waistlines--like whether we'd continue to have a roof over our heads or whether the drug dealer next door was going to be involved in a shooting so close to our house. What I can tell you for sure is that we didn't care about being fat. It wasn't a problem that was on our minds.

You can't fight that culture by regulatory fiat or suddenly spiking the price of food (people will invariably go to the cheapest cost food with the most number of calories and that exists in abundance).

Does that mean there's nothing that can be done? No. We can and should end food subsidies. Or, if we must be involved in propping up businesses (there are good arguments to be made for food subsidies), let's at least subsidize them consistent with our stated values--whole foods, vegetables, grains, etc. Without question, the farming welfare system that props up corn needs to change. But I think the best thing that can be done is already well underway. We have to change our relationship with food and exercise. We talk about food in a much healthier and productive way than when I was a kid. Fitness facilities are among the fast growing industries in the country. People are working out more and eating less. We won't see the results for a few years, but I am optimistic. My hat goes off to the First Lady for her outstanding work on this issue and I hope it continues. It's not perfect, but--especially in the black community--her actively talking about food and activity is prompting lots of us to reevaluate ourselves and only good will come from that.

 

About the whole food thing - I see people getting free or reduced lunch at schools, while wearing brand new Nike kicks that are $200 that they sure as hell didn't get used at Goodwill.
Now if people actually played basketball in those shoes instead of talking about how basketball stars wear them and that they want autographs to put on their shoes!

 

The First lady understands that fat American adults are a lost cause, but that if we can keep children from getting fat we have a shot at equipping them to stay healthy for life.

Fitness clubs are part of the problem in my view. They give people the impression that it costs thousands of dollars a year to stay fit, when what most people need is a pair of shoes and 30-60 minutes a day to walk.

I'm not convinced that we "can't fight that culture by regulatory fiat." First, we need a national food subsidy program that spends on education and serves the needs of poor people rather than the needs of giant processed food companies and agribusiness. Second, we need to spend heavily on preventive care to stop children from getting fat. I believe we'll get all that money back through long-term savings on national healthcare spending.

Allowing a child to get fat is child abuse. A parent who does that has ruined a child's physical health just as a parent who sexually abuses a child ruins their mental health. We need to start prosecuting parents for childhood obesity, not to punish them but to force them into treatment programs for reeducation and food rehabilitation.

McDonald's helped create the obesity epidemic by bypassing family food habits and marketing their toxic **** directly to children. Now we have a generation or two of adults who grew up eating this stuff regularly and think it's normal to feed it to their own children. We need a counter-revolution to reprogram new generations of children and keep them from setting foot in places like McDonald's.

 

I say people need to learn how to portion out how much food they eat, and that McDonalds is a sometimes food, not a "every night for dinner" thing.

Is that so bad?

 

Yes, they need to learn that. But no, they aren't learning that. The question is why not? Part of the reason is that the opposite message is coming in louder and faster.

Ban all tv food advertising, particularly all food advertising on channels and at times when children are likely to be watching. That might help cut back on the bad learning. Ban all food marketing aimed at children.Ban everyone under the age of 18 from fast food restaurants and drive throughs.

 

This thread needs more Malkie!

 

Brilliant!

Oh wait, I meant to say stupid.

Instead, teach American parents responsibility. When I see a fat 8 year old at McGreasyHut or whatever, I don't think: "damn, that kid watched too many commercials and has been poorly influenced by media and society to think it is OK to eat bad stuff all the time" I think: "damn, that kid's parents are irresponsibly lazy losers (probably fat) who are too apathetic to make their child a proper dinner". This stuff is supposed to be a treat. You go out for pizza after the big game to celebrate. You don't bring home pizza after work because you're too tired to cook dinner - just like every other night.

Blaming the media or society is such an American think to do. Take responsibility for yourself and your own kids.

 

Let me rephrase my earlier statement. You cannot stop obesity by legislative fiat and remain a free nation. Jabba. What you are proposing is insane and would never be approved. Nor should it.

Nothing you are proposing is reasonable nor is any of it likely to have but a marginal effect in the long run.

And I disagree with you about fitness centers. The fact that so many franchises are popping up has driven the cost down ($10/month in some) but the really important point is that franchises are popping up because people are using them. When I went to the Y (I mostly work out at home now), it was always full. This is a marked improvement over just a decade ago, when only mothers and their toddlers went to the Y. Is a fitness culture pervasive yet? No. But I'm optimistic enough to happily dismiss the draconian nonsense you're proposing..

 

Time to play Americas FAVORITE internet discussion boards game.....SER!OUS OR SARCAST!C?

 

That's not really true. Take the 15% of Americans on food stamps. Start with them and their children through a dramatic overhaul of the program. Create a program that not only incentivizes them to make healthy choices for their caloric intake but also refuses to fund unhealthy choices. That makes sense, because taxpayers should not be subsidizing poor nutritional choices that lead to more taxpayer-funded healthcare spending down the road.

Maybe we get some of this money back through shortened lifespans. The average lifespan of poor people is dropping in this country. Maybe we get back money in reduced social security spending, and medicare spending if we can fatten them up enough so they die sooner. It's hard to say, but I suspect it's not a wash. I suspect we spend a lot more at dramatic end-of-life healthcare interventions for all the diabetes-infested, heart-disease-ridden fat people.

Healthy people fund the lifestyle choices of unhealthy people. The more obese diabetics on health insurance rosters, the more expensive it is for thin people to get insurance coverage and the more of our tax dollars go to the social healthcare spending to keep fat people alive. The more fat people get on airplanes, the more thin people have to pay to fly.

I think we have a say in this. It's not just about freedom.

 

Or we could scrap "Food Stamps" altogether, and have each office simply hand out a month's worth of actual healthy food. Meats, eggs, veggies both fresh and canned....

Sure more tax dollars would be spent....but we wouldn't have any EBT cards being used for junk foods, liquor, cigarettes, strip clubs, or casinos.

 

Sure. I think I mentioned that as an option. Healthy food distribution programs instead of EBT free-for-alls. But combined with nutritional education.

 

I like how this "freedom" to shovel greasy and HFCS food into my mouth doesn't provide any benefit on my end. At best, nothing will happen to me; but it's statistically more likely that I'd gain weight and if I had the genetic predisposition (I don't) I'd probably develop diabetes as well. The only people (billion-dollar corporations) who are benefiting from our Freedom to Die Slowly are those who are profiting from it.