Clone Wars So is this it for our good General Grievous?

Discussion in 'Star Wars TV' started by DavidIX, Sep 6, 2012.

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  1. Sable_Hart Force Ghost

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    Nov 28, 2009
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    As others have pointed out exhaustively, TCW!Grievous really is no different from ROTS!Grievous. If anything, TCW!Grievous is preferable-- the general has held his own in combat against Obi-Wan, Kit Fisto, and Ventress at various points, whereas Obi-Wan casually manhandles him in ROTS up until the contest becomes a hand-to-hand one. Likewise, Filoni has reminded George a time or two that Grievous must be seen as a credible threat even if he can't take on the most powerful Force users in the galaxy. "Massacre" was a step in the right direction.

    Like others, I personally think that Grievous should slay a handful of "redshirt" Jedi throughout the series (if not all at once) to justify the general's confidence in taking on trained Jedi; if he kept losing to them in single combat, then he wouldn't be eager to duel Obi-Wan alone in ROTS-- no matter how arrogant he is.

    The most important thing Filoni and co. need to do is spend time portraying Grievous as a threat in naval combat; we need to see him win fleet battles, even if they're against no-name commanders. I reiterate a point brilliantly made by @TaradosGon : if Grievous isn't a military threat, then it doesn't make sense for the Senate to vote Palpatine further powers.

    Why people don't respectfully remind Filoni of this point at Celebration VI or things like it eludes me.
  2. Dan_Grievous_Tikkes_Fan Force Ghost

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    Sep 3, 2012
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    Great point! Idk why...
  3. Sable_Hart Force Ghost

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    This is a persistent itch to me that has yet to have been scratched. I am, for the vast majority, satisfied with Filoni's work on TCW and pleased with his involvement in the fandom. I genuinely believe that if respectfully reminded that the immense danger posed by the Separatists to the Republic has its roots in G-canon, specifically the ROTS opening crawl ("the Republic is crumbling"), he would address it.
  4. Dan_Grievous_Tikkes_Fan Force Ghost

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    Sep 3, 2012
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    TCW show is kinda failing at the "Separatists and Grievous and Dooku being a threat" department...

    I figured it out - at CVI Force Cast drones are too busy yelping for Ben Q and that little kid from Tatooine and most of the other fans who swarm Filoni are clone fans or Jedi fans and Fett fans...
    There are Grievous fans but they are not as many as the Jedi and the clone fans.

    PS: Nobody take this personally. :D
    Last edited by Dan_Grievous_Tikkes_Fan, Sep 6, 2012
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  5. TaradosGon SWTV Mod - Like Palpatine with animals

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    I guess I'm not the only one who gets sick of hearing about Kitster and Ben Quadrinaros. Stopped being funny a long time ago, IMO :p
    Last edited by TaradosGon, Sep 6, 2012
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  6. Dan_Grievous_Tikkes_Fan Force Ghost

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    Kyle Newman's supporters achieved what they wanted so Ben Q has a figure now and Anakin will have a Ben Q poster in his room on Coruscant - NO COMMENT.

    But Kitster - there is no ground to continue that.

    Wanting Dengar or Tikkes or San Hill or Boba Fett or Mon Mothma is reasonable cause they all have possibilites in this war and can be explored by that making them more diverse when we see them later in the movies. Now when I see Dengar in TESB, I am reminded of "Bounty",,,

    But the Kitster thing needs to die cause it has been confirmed for a decade that the kid is still ROTTING on Tatooine. SW Galaxies even showed him still being there. There is no need of him in TCW...
  7. TaradosGon SWTV Mod - Like Palpatine with animals

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    Well that seems to be the thing.

    Fans can ask for something and ask for something and ask for something, and Lucas and Filoni will come up with some excuse not to do it.

    But since Filoni is personal friends with Kyle Newman and the ForceCast guys, he'll put something in the show, that the vast majority of the fans aren't going to appreciate (either because they simply won't notice, or because it's stupid) just as a friendly joke with those guys.

    Maybe if I make my own podcast and invite Filoni for a chat, I can push to get Tarados Gon in the show [face_thinking] And then he can be killed by Grievous. Kill two birds with one stone for me.
    Last edited by TaradosGon, Sep 6, 2012
  8. Dan_Grievous_Tikkes_Fan Force Ghost

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    Exactly! I do not mind but it would be retarded if that pointless kid makes it to TCW before Tarados or TIKKES or San Hill. Cause these guys were directly involved. Have you seen the stuff Filoni posted about Tikkes?! :D
    I managed to get Filoni's attention as much as those FC guys who are "cheating" per say! lol

    Back to the topic: But I agree... seeing Gon on the show would give Grievous a kill (some things that Gallia and Koth should have been) and a new opponent for once.
  9. TheAvengerButton Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 11, 2011
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    I think as we get closer to the events of Episode III Grievous will be given more attention, and I can't say that I haven't enjoyed his appearances so far in the show, even the oft maligned "Shadow Warrior". He's just a great character. He knows how to fight but he also knows when to live to fight another day.
  10. Dan_Grievous_Tikkes_Fan Force Ghost

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    Great post and I hope you are right 10000000000000000000%! MTFBWY!
  11. DARTHVENGERDARTHSEAR Chosen One

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    I thought he seemed like the cool GG in that witch hunt episode.
  12. QuangoFett Force Ghost

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    Great point.

    From an IU perspective, if Grievous is to credibly seize control of the CIS after Dooku's death, he should be a credible military commander from the Separatist perspective. The shrewd business elites and the other military officers at the head of the CIS are not going to let a failure of a commander grab all the state's power without a fight. He needs plenty of victories, ideally crushing and blood-drenched ones, in order to become a threat to both Loyalists and Separatists. Rising Malevolence and Massacre are good examples of how these should be done, but they should be more decisive. The Malevolence arc ends in Grievous' humiliation and he fails to kill Ventress or Talzin in the latter. His victories need to be better, perhaps contrasted against the victories of a foil CIS commander who is competent but nowhere near as ruthless and effective as Grievous.

    Once again, Shadow Warrior rears its ugly head with counterproductive characterisation. Even if you don't mind Grievous getting his arse kicked by Gungans, that whole Naboo invasion scheme is botched from the start and not becoming of any military commander. His army is small and their remote control unit (do they seriously still use them after what happened on this very planet in 32 BBY?!) is easily sabotaged by Gungans who he foolishly lets into his ship. The scheme is dependent on the Gungans remaining in alliance with the CIS, which is dubious from the outset considering that the alliance is built on just one turncoat hypnotising the Boss. He doesn't even take any fully autonomous MagnaGuards with him.

    If Commander Bly is able to kill more than one Jedi in a day without being a superpowered Gary Stu, Grievous should be able to do the same. Or rather, the forces they command are or should be able to do so. He should at least be capable of executing an invasion.

    As you said, this is G-canon, not C-canon conjecture.
  13. Dan_Grievous_Tikkes_Fan Force Ghost

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    Such true words Quango! Sadly due to the bad handling of Grievous by Lucas, nobody in their right mind would ever assume he would be the key to the downfall of the Republic. He has been so humiliated and downgraded in this series that nobody would imagine he would be the SUPREME commander of the CIS forces. By all means, Riff Tamson and Trench were more capable commanders than Grievous and why should he be in charge of more capable people than himself.
    If judging by Lucas's mistakes in the TCW Grievous, the General should not be allowed to use a lightsaber cause he could cut himself. The many failures the show has given Grievous over the course of almost 5 seasons makes him look not only like a coward but like a weakling. There is nothing bad in being a coward when you are a villain but that is only tolerable if you are a smart and strategic coward. LOL
    Even when he does something right like in Heroes on Both Sides or the Malevolence start - it is always downplayed by the overuse of Dooku and his dumb scoldings.
    Shadow Warrior has destroyed Grievous to the fullest. That was his ultimate failure which I still can not believe is canon. The whole episode was backwards and stupid - from beginning to end it was like a vision of an idiot AKA LUCAS. Filoni did object to this move of humiliating Grievous and taking the last 00,0001 % of his credibility but in the end if I worked at LFA I probably would not want to lose my job cause I argued with my boss (even if he is a moron these days) over a fictional character).

    At this point I do not know how many episodes of TCW there should be to fix Grievous's reputation but they have to be a lot and to make him look like the strategic player in the war that he is. He is not just some thug but THE SUPREME COMMANDER!
    The least they could do is have several episodes in the feel like the end of the episode "Monster" - Grievous totally mauling the Republic forces and achieving COMPLETE victory. "Massacre"-styled episodes with all objectives completed.
    And show how genius of tactician he is, not have the idiotic Dooku feed him with a spoon information.
    Grievous is not a goon! He is supposed to be the biggest threat...
    Last edited by Dan_Grievous_Tikkes_Fan, Sep 9, 2012
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  14. Sable_Hart Force Ghost

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    Yeah, there's really no way to handwave it or rationalize it; the LFL writers have fumbled the ball consistently when it comes to the portrayal of the Separatists morally and militarily. Hopefully Filoni has enough integrity to acknowledge this failure and the clout to rectify it by persuading George to take another gander at the film scripts that bear his name.
  15. QuangoFett Force Ghost

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    Jun 11, 2011
    star 4
    The moderate Separatist Parliament was a good development in my view, and there is some room for an intriguing story in the corporations playing both sides.

    However, you're spot on about the military portrayal. This may be a show targeted at children, but if it can do stories like Umbara and Mortis, it should be more than capable of giving the bad guys a decisive victory over the good guys, particularly when this is necessary for ROTS.
  16. Dan_Grievous_Tikkes_Fan Force Ghost

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    Sep 3, 2012
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    Ok... I just do not want my fave Villains in SW ignored just cause of some hippies. I would love to see Po Nudo's propaganda do one on the senators of Raxus. I would like to see how the CIS senators are misinformed. Or how Tikkes and his people help create the invisible hand and so on.

    Total bullseye! I do not understand why the villains are not given a victory at all. I want to see an episode where the villains win, and Grievous especially.
    Nothing shows how strong are the heroes better than dealing with failure.

    There are so many possibilities for stories about the bad guys that the show tends to not explore out of some fear. THERE IS A FAN BASE for such stories.
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  17. QuangoFett Force Ghost

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    Jun 11, 2011
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    "Some say the senator from Deko Neimoidia doesn't have a hatching certificate, just a certificate of live hatching. Some say he's actually a Loyalist Palpatine-adoring Jedi-worshipping Sith cultist plant! Who does? Some people. Others think he isn't any of these things. We'll let both sides argue it out and we'll then have to end it there with a fair'n'balanced conclusion! Just keeping them honest!"

    "Bail Organa's speech was filled with lies! Really! He may have backed up his point that Lott Dod is a Separatist turncoat with lots of nice-looking graphs and investigative reports into his financial dealings... but how uncivil of him! You'd think there was a war going on!"
    Last edited by QuangoFett, Sep 10, 2012
  18. Dark Lord Tarkas Force Ghost

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    Apr 29, 2011
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    [face_rofl] [face_rofl][face_rofl][face_rofl]=D=
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