ST Son of the Suns and The Journal of the Whills in EP7

It does. This could also tie back into the sabre as Excalibur angle, and the whole relic thing (if indeed those are close to the mark). How cool would it be if Rose was a Whill or something (although I'm probably off on this - were the Whills those force beings in TCW?

I would love them to bring back the mythic feel. A sense of a rich history, etc (I appreciate some feel this never went away).

 

Satipo - It was never specifically stated wether they were the whills in TCW... but they are certainly the closest we have seen to them. I certainly like the mythical idea re. Excalibur etc. But I think the most mythical SW has been was with the prophecy of the chosen one. Unfortunately this was never really expanded upon enough for me... but more of that would be great.

 

If there was a way to almost retcon the Chosen One angle so that further exploration is possible, or so we get a richer, deeper understanding of a greater mythos, I would be all for that. What if the Son of the Suns was one of the first Jedi - the wielder of Excalibur and somehow the first Chosen One and ancient ancestor of the Skywalker line. Man, would I pay to see that film, especially knowing it could tie in to TFA and beyond (and also the PT and OT too by extension).

 

Just had a thought DarthPJ, Now that TFU is toast in terms of canon, they should reclaim Starkiller and make him the Son of the Suns and legendary wielder of TFA's Excalibur. I would watch the Hell out of an Adventures of Starkiller trilogy.

 

no you've got it wrong.... it's

 

Would it be a pre-Sith War story? Something from the early years of interstellar travel?

 

Could be!

 

Filoni asked GL if the Priestesses are Whills, but GL refused to answer. Perhaps GL didn't want to spoil something from the ST?

 

I would love to see The Chosen one tie in again.

 

Found this 5 years ago at an auction house, it's 24 x 18 lith, or etching. Can't seem to find anyone who has seen another nor give any insight to it. I do know the very outer border and the inner border that look the same have what appear to be just random shapes......but the are not they are words and the shapes are actually negative space. the words have a yodaish sound to them and the refer to the fall of the empire as well as rules of the jedi, the force and the dark side. If anyone has any input that would be awesome. Been trying to find a value on it but everyone i have come across is stumped. Its either just something cool or its the holy grail.

 

http://m.imgur.com/awRaNIX
There's a small passage from the Journal of the Whills in the TFA novelization

 

What Priestesses? That a TCW reference?

- T

 

Ugh, this image not displaying but I really wanna see this, ha.

 

A shocking but pretty clear indicator that the Journal of the Whills is Canon.

- T

 

Whether or not Rey is a biological Skywalker, I do think it is very likely that she is going to be revealed as the "Son of the Suns" or whatever revised phrase that would now be. TPTB seem to have drawn a lot of influence from Hayao Miyazaki's character, Nausicaa, in designing Rey. Nausicaa herself was revealed in to be a prophesied savior and I think TFA has its fair share of hints that Rey may very well likely to share a similar power or role herself in the Galaxy Far Far Away.

Also, we totally need to get Mungo Baobab in on this discussion. Your thoughts?

 

The Priestesses appear in the final 2 episodes of TCW.

 

I've been reading the Art of TFA book today...it's a great book, I highly recommend it. Anyway, there are some interesting ideas that they explored early in the design process that if not directly associated with the Journal of the Whills and Son of Suns stuff, do indicate that there are major revelations about the Force to come over the next two movies.

On page 249, there's a quote from Rick Carter:

"I have told Kathleen Kennedy that my job is to really pay attention to the Force and what I feel the Force is as it represents itself in the story and the visuals of the movie - so that it has a presence. What is the Force? It's when you recognise that it was always there, like Kansas for Dorothy. But that doesn't mean that every aspect of the Force is known yet. So when we get to this third act in the Star Wars series, there's more to be revealed. And that reveal is going to involve things from the past that were right in front of us all along. We didn't understand all that those things meant, and now we have to let them play themselves out. To me, that's the Force."

There's also some intriguing concepts of Luke, which seem to be for something like a vision ( perhaps more like ESB's Dagobah cave than the flashback that Rey has ), that involve Luke seemingly trapped, then being buried by, and emerging from sand. Also, a sequence that depicts Luke transforming into what appears to be an early Snoke design. Very interesting stuff.

There's also a piece of art depicting Han confronting Kylo on the walkway in Starkiller Base, and Carter says that the light in this scene ( they are at first stood in a shaft of light, before the the Starkiller drains the sun, enveloping them in darkness ) is the Force making it's decision. It seens that all along Kylo has had the potential to be a champion of light or dark ( as Snoke says in the book ), but at this point his destiny is sealed. Rey must then step up and accept the opposing destiny to Kylo: the champion of the Light.

So it seems that in this trilogy, instead of one destiny, we have twin, opposing destinies.

 

Was the Son of the Suns ever really explored at all in the movies?

The TFA novelization opens with an excerpt from the Journal of the Whills.

Mungo Baobab, ahh George Lucas style duality!

 

That's a very interesting quote. I'll need to get a copy of that book myself at some point in the near future. Maybe once I get back home from my family vacation over the next couple of days.

Ooh, this is definitely an intriguing concept. This isn't all that surprising a thought to me personally, but I think it's pretty clear that Luke and Snoke will be meant to parallel each other much in the same way that Rey and Kylo will. Speaking of which-

Wow. I'd picked up on the light symbolism in the final scene as Kylo slowly made his decision, but it being the Force making its own decision on what Kylo's fate will be is something I hadn't thought of. I wonder if this means that Kylo is less likely to be redeemed?

 

I understand there needing to be both light and dark in the universe and the force is a part of this materializing but...if one were to choose the light over dark, such as Ben, then does a replacement get chosen? I would still like to think we have a choice.

 

The novel for TFA opens with a passage from the Journal of the Whills, just like the novel for ANH did.

And with mention of the first Jedi temple, I bet we will get some delicious insight on this stuff. Also history of ancient dark side followers as well.

Also, did anyone see the new canonical map of the SW galaxy in the EW feature this past summer?
It had Moribund (was Korriban) and Rakkatan from Knights of the Old Republic, with the Rakata homeworld being in the Unknown Regions where the last of the Empire's ships jumped into after the Battle of Jakku. Now they're back with highly advanced weaponry after they had been nearly obliterated? Sounds a little like Star Forge technology of a type.

I think we will be getting a large scale war with a lot of red vs blue sabers if you know what I mean.

 

What may I ask was the reference to The Journal of the Whills?

 

I came across a Japanese version of this book in Osaka waiting to see TFA a 4th time. Too expensive at ¥4800. Really beautiful artwork. Can you explain why there are Sith in this book, such as Darth Talon?

It's too bad Arndt's version wasn't filmed. Very beautiful and interesting judging by the pictures. And JJ, KK, LK, etc. supported this version. Unfortunately, he wasn't going to finish in time and was let go. Not that I'm unhappy with what we got and the creative process for all 7 movies is fascinating.

This is an interesting summary.

www.starwarsnewsnet.com/2016/01/from-concept-to-reality-a-glimpse-into-the-art-of-star-wars-the-force-awakens-by-phil-szostak.html

The Force Ghost going back and forth between Anakin and Vader is interesting. Since Luke communes with both sides of his father, the writer of the linked article opines that maybe Luke 1) acknowledged the dark side in himself and 2) balanced both the light and the dark inside himself. I agree with 2) if it means 1). According to GL in the Time 1999 interview for TPM, the Jedi who tried to use both the light and dark after being expelled gave into the dark side and created the Sith. Dooku may have tried to use both and fell into the same trap (my speculation? Source?) Snoke thinks Ren has an inherent balance, but must reject the light. Ren rejects the light by killing his father. Rey can feel her dark side when tempted to kill Ren, but refuses.

The pic of Luke holding and talking to Vader's helmet lead to Ren's doing so. Many parallels.

 

The Legions of Lettow

I believe that the Darth Talon images in the book were actually an exploration of the 'Jedi Killer' character ( that went on to become Kylo Ren ), using the look of Darth Talon, rather than a straight adaptation of the Darth Talon character from SW Legacy. This is my interpretation, anyway. There are many different versions of the Jedi Killer in the book, and this seems to be one of them. At this point, it seems that the character was an ( unrelated ) former student of Luke's, rather than a Solo / Skywalker family member. The 'Darth Talon' pieces also feature a strange creature, described in the book as 'the evil thing, manipulating everything', that seems to be an early version of the Snoke character.

Interesting point regarding the balancing of the light and dark. Whilst I don't think GL quite spells it out in the interview, it would certainly make some sense that the Sith first fell to the Dark Side from a desire to balance the Force within themselves. Easy to see how this idea could play into the next two movies, too. It would be easy to tempt a Jedi with the idea of balance, but to achieve balance, one must move closer to the Dark Side. A trap of sorts?

LUCAS: Yes. That story also has been retold. Buddha was tempted in the same way. It's all through mythology. The gods are constantly tempting. Everybody and everything. So the idea of temptation is one of the things we struggle against, and the temptation obviously is the temptation to go to the dark side. One of the themes throughout the films is that the Sith lords, when they started out thousands of years ago, embraced the dark side. They were greedy and self-centered and they all wanted to take over, so they killed each other.

http://content.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,23298-4,00.html

 

They/She appears in TCW and is the being that tested Qui-Gon and tests Yoda to deem them worthy of learning how to become a Force Ghost after death. It appears as several characters with different facial expressions, which I believe Filoni has said represent the different emotions of a single being, and that being itself is long dead and is appearing as a ghost.