Lit SOS: Save Our Skywalker, Luke Skywalker (v3)

Discussion in 'Literature' started by Jedi Ben, Mar 22, 2008.

  1. Auditor Dredd Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 8, 2005
    star 4
    I'll leave it to your expertise :p

    Thank you for sharing that quote, that scene is hilarious [face_laugh]

    CoPL we got what I would say a great deal of feats from Luke but his personality was off and I attribute it to Wolverton and his "take" on the character, Obi-wan/Yoda like sounds right not that much Lukish. Hambly during the Callista trilogy got Luke, save for the crazy desire for Callista, and allowing Cray and her boyfriend to sacrifice themselves...also it spawn the repetitive injured Luke trope. JAT had such a passive Luke....which doesn't make that much sense after RotJ and DE.

    think about it, we probably take for granted his feats from OT since we watched them like eighty times, but for ANH he destroyed the DS after Obi-wan told him to use the Force and maybe 20 mins of training on the Falcon, in TESB he destroys an AT-AT on foot, lifts an X-wing off the ground until he gives up on believing in himself, and held off his father for a good bit, and finally in RotJ he single handily destroys most of Jabba's guards and his pet Rancor...remember he render two gamerreons unconscious by waving his hand :cool: , defeats Vader and saves his father from the DS while causing the destruction of the Sith/saving the galaxy and only after that he just became a jedi knight :D

    I agree with you partially there about DNT not being too personal...save when Mara, Ben, or Jacen are in danger.

    SQ I think mentions it too I think...

    that's why there should be more fact checking by the Del-Rey team..

    It's the only memorable thing from Tempest I remember for Luke.

    oh....well happy to be your beta :):p

    I mention he was doubtful/fearful when his wife was in danger. Can we agree that Luke was doing gray questionable things ? Dark comes off like what Jacen did during the book and clearly Luke was not that absolute in his actions he held remorse and ultimately reject the principles....if anything Luke at worse is pushing anti-hero territory early in the trilogy.

    which book ?

    like ?

    I'll give you Invincible....mostly due to Denning's grayish tone in that book. Fury is the suicidal book but I can somewhat understand Luke's perspective after losing his wife but Inferno he was full of action. The Traviss books of course have him without his mind...but I think he was alright in Betrayal and Inferno

    In Tempest he lost early ground in the saber duel due to her well placed strategies...but he won the fight with a blaster...after that he had a stalemate with her in Exile and he kills her in Sacrifice. Not in any of those fights did he lose to her but I understand your meaning in how Luke should have wiped the floor with her yet somehow Luke was written with the Superman mentally of not using his full abilities in their fights.

    considering he lost his wife in the last book and witness his son being tortured by his nephew there is no denying that Luke is at his emotional low....the FACT that he resists the darker callings of ending his nephew's life still expresses that he was in control but barely. As he mentions in the fight when he gets kicked by nephew..."Good this is suppose to hurt."

    uh Jaina would have :p ...admit it was a cool feat that Luke did cause he was healing off a head wound which would have killed a lesser jedi ;)

    you're preaching to the choir.

    which could be fixed with more L&M books.
  2. JediMatteus Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 16, 2008
    star 4
    they want to redo the eu after TUF fine, but do not throw out the njo series. That would be a crime

    But he was also not pleased about the idea that all of the EU might be overwritten by the ST. I think.

    i agree. i am worried about that too
  3. JediMatteus Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 16, 2008
    star 4
    It's the only memorable thing from Tempest I remember for Luke.

    like it or not the most memorable things was Lumiya almost killing luke and Mara
    Last edited by JediMatteus, Feb 5, 2013
  4. Auditor Dredd Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 8, 2005
    star 4
    yeh I did not like the scene....even though Luke won the battle it still bugged me. Although to be fair Luke lost focus once Mara's life was on the line....also how did Lumiya survive the 6-9 blaster shots ???


    also a warning to those that buy the Complete Saga blurays....apparently due to the bad packaging and poor shipping and handling it will be common to find your discs all scuff up and scratched...at least the US versions.
    Last edited by MasterSkywalker86, Feb 5, 2013
  5. Jedi Ben Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 19, 1999
    star 6
    Or now, the Not-So-Complete Saga, where's Eps 7-9 eh? Complete Saga it says, but it's only 6 films!

    Talking of which, this might be of interest to people: One theory is the villain for the ST will be Darth Plagueis, now it's only a theory, but it does have quite a bit of plausibility to it.

    First, Plagueis was only mentioned in the last film as this Sith legend, but it wasn't revealed that he'd been Sidious' master! That's a plot-bomb waiting to blow right there.

    Second, the notion of a super-enemy lying in wait that the heroes were inevitably to face is a time-honoured one, in this respect SW is quite traditional.

    But third, if Luke Skywalker takes on the Sith who taught Sidious and defeats him, possibly doing what the Force created Anakin to really do, killing Sidious was only half the job, say much of that prophecy had been lost, then that effectively switches the focus back to Luke away from Anakin!
  6. Auditor Dredd Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 8, 2005
    star 4
    :cool: JB you're hired to make this film especially if it turns out that Plagueis is actually alive and turns to be much more powerful than Sidious expected. It would also satisfy me to see Luke slay the "cinematic" dragon proper this time around.

    on the blurays, I hear the UK region doesn't have the issue with the boxset cover sleeves scratching up the discs any truth to that ? I might just wait for the eventual re-release of the blu-rays in a better box set :rolleyes:
    Last edited by MasterSkywalker86, Feb 5, 2013
  7. ChildOfWinds Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 7, 2001
    star 5
    I don't have much time today, so I'll just respond to this one. I'll catch up with the others tomorrow.


    Jedi Ben:
    I would REALLY like to have that happen, JB. I would certainly love to see the SW saga focus back to Luke! Unfortunately, I'm afraid that if they do make use of Darth Plagueis, that it would be more likely that Plagueis would kill off Luke, and then the "new" SW hero (Luke's student or son) would be the one to take out Plagueis. After all, I'm expecting the sequels to be mostly about the next generation, with Luke and Company being the wise leaders/mentors, and eventually passing the torch to them.

    I am hoping that Luke will survive at least to Episode IX.
    kataja likes this.
  8. Auditor Dredd Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 8, 2005
    star 4
    cup half empty indeed :p I'm hoping that if JB's scenario is the case that Luke defeats the big bad by Episode 9 but instead of say dying like Anakin he passes the metaphorical torch to the young generation while he goes on to lead/teach the NJO while also going on adventures with his wife or kids. It would also highlight the difference between Anakin's decision and Luke's. Disney isn't ONLY eyeing the new trilogy as the only SW movies. The ST could be a good way to introduce/develop the new generation and the solo movies could be the moment where they get the keys to the Falcon and be the focus of the movie.
  9. kataja Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 4, 2007
    star 4
    Well, it makes sense, in the way that Luke's pretty calm and controlled in ROTJ, definitely learning something new. But what worked onscreen because Mark Hamill was so clearly alive under the surface - turns uniteresting on the book pages - at least with Anderson writing.

    Well, yes, but the authors also need space to create a plot.

    I guess I'm in minority, but I remember enjoying most of LOTF - and particularly Luke in it too. There was too many misunderstandings that made Luke and Mara seem like they didn't communicate - and that was OOC - and too many Lumiya battles that didn't work out for different reasons - and Mara's death was a wrong desicion plus too intwined with misunderstandings - but otherwise I think it was ok. That is, because I don't see Luke's actions as vengeance killing at all, and I think his "dark note" in Inferno wasn't Dark at all, just grim - whch was more than allright considering what had happened. The whole 'suicidal' thing was nothing but a teaser; the IU characters were afraid Luke migth lose hiw will to live - as were the readers - but if you read the novel, Luke uses exactly that belief, to sneak ontl Jacen's ship. Ok, actually I can't remember if that's what he does, but at least he uses other people's assumtions very cunnignly - and I liked that - it showed that even after Mara's death Luke was in his full senses and prepared to put everything in to win.

    That's how I see it too.

    Heard! Heard!!!


    Well, she is a cyborg - more machine than human, so I suppose she just had a good recoveryfile...

    I'd approve of that!!! :D
  10. Auditor Dredd Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 8, 2005
    star 4
    in that sense yes, but being inactive when Gantoris attempted to kill you and reeks of the DS.....sorry that one doesn't work for me. especially right after DE. Luke should be able to detect the first sign of the DS after spending some time with it's avatar [face_not_talking]

    not at the expense of the character's portrayal or we end up with another Sacrifice.

    the cons outweigh the pros to me.

    I don't think he was dark in Inferno but the way Traviss wrote Luke in Sacrifice leaves it ambiguous enough that it could be taken either way IMO. If Luke beheaded her before disarming her then it would be unquestionable that he killed her in self-defense but others will argue that Luke killed her in cold blood or at least with the intent. From years of experience in EU, it's proven that sith are never powerless/weaponless...so I don't necessary believe Luke was a vengeance killer especially after the previous book he shook her hand and believe she would surrender without bloodshed....which turn out to be a sham. Luke at this point had given her too many opportunities to surrender peacefully, time to use lethal force [face_devil]

    could you clarify what you mean apprentice ?

    lol ok, point

    that idea is so full of awesome that if it was actually used I wouldn't care if they erased the whole EU. Also it would set things straight since due to the prequels the "Chosen One" is basically a child/wife killer, mass murderer, and psychopath and yet we're suppose to root for this guy since he did one good act in the end ??? sorry that doesn't work for me no matter how many times GL tells me he's the Chosen One.
    Last edited by MasterSkywalker86, Feb 6, 2013
  11. kataja Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 4, 2007
    star 4
    On another thread, someone pointed out that we shouldn't be too hasty dooming GFFA parenting skills after out own, national ideas of parenthood. Even in RL, parenting is a highly cultural matter that can vary a lot from country to country - not to speak of how it has developed though history. We know very little about parenting in GFFA - and if Ha & Leia were standard, Luke and Mara have nothing to be ashamed of. Also, Mara's had to learn everything from scratch as she didn't have any memoeries from her own childhood.

    Ok, I agree with that allright!

    This is how I read it too. Plus it's stated straight out that he was completely calm when he made the final blow - not emotional at all. Now, I'm not satisfied with how all of that was written in general, and I'm not sure Traviss wasn't trying to make the scene ambiguous on purpose - but at least this is spelled out - Luke wasn't led by his emotions.


    I mean that in retrospect it becomes clear that Luke's been using others people's worries about his mental state as a cover so that they'll fear he's dead when in fact he's hiding in the Force. This means he's not been even near what they've been thinking (and which was the same that many readers thought when the novel came out) but instead has been cunning enough to actually play on their mistake. I think it was a pretty neat maneuver, actually. All the more, as it also was Denning using this towards the readers, probably managing to cheat quite a lot of them for a moment.
  12. JediMatteus Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 16, 2008
    star 4
    i never understood the difference with Luke and Mara in theNJO, too how they were in Dark Nest and LOTF. To me this is Dennings influence. The writers in the njo series showed levity, humor, lovingkindness between Luke and Mara. We see NONE of that ever since. No intimacy, nothing. This is another of my plethera of reasons why the NJO series is far superior to any other Star Wars writing.
  13. kataja Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 4, 2007
    star 4
    How about this one?
    Last edited by kataja, Feb 7, 2013
    colojedi7 and MasterSkywalker86 like this.
  14. Auditor Dredd Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 8, 2005
    star 4
    I wouldn't say that, I remember DN (as Kataja pointed out) and Betrayal portraying their relationship as what we would expect from the two lovebirds. The problem is we had fewer opportunities of them together than we did in NJO due to the book count and also the series ends their togetherness forever.....with murder :rolleyes: . Also I remember some NJO books had them together but didn't expand on them due to the plot taking priority....like the Force Heretic trilogy :(


    I would also like to point out that wars are hardly the ideal scenario to raise children in.....

    eerily calm was the text if I remember correctly.


    but that took place in Inferno where he shut off his Force prescense after he made the illusion of his ship exploding when Jacen attack him right ? I think you're mixing both Inferno and Fury.

    bravo =D=
  15. ChildOfWinds Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 7, 2001
    star 5
    MasterSkywalker86:
    Our former SOS poster JKDart used to reallly like the "messiah-like" Luke of the JAT, I remember.


    I agree about that. The events of DE were what convinced Luke that more Jedi were needed. That's why he started the Jedi Academy. I would think Luke would be passionate about this task and NOT
    be passive or indecisive.

    Well, she *was* able to use it against him a couple of times. I remember that at one point he was even paralyzed with fear for Mara. He literally couldn't even move to help her even though she was seriously injured.


    But I do believe that there is a "continuity team" of experts that they could ask. There is Wookiepedia and probably an LFL bank of information about everything SW. Plus, I've heard more than one author say that they are given a huge number of books like essential guides and SW encyclopedias. So they aren't required to remember everything. Plus, aren't there editors around?????



    This was also in Sacrifice. Remember Ben's boots?

    As I said, in Invincible. For example, it didn't seem to bother Luke that he caused a bunch of Mandalorians to be killed off in place of the Wookiees. Yes, Boba Fett had planned to have the Wookiees be the ones who would die and Luke turned the tables on the Mandos. But he didn't seem at all troubled about it. And Luke said that he was "tainted" because of the vengeance killing and that's why he couldn't go to face Jacen/Caedus.

    He was kind of darkish in his battle with Jacen after finding Ben in that Embrace of Pain too.


    But would have died if Mara hadn't grabbed him and pulled him to safety. Wasn't there something about a bomb?

    Luke Skywalker should never have had a stalemate with her! For him, that's a loss... Plus, she managed to confuse him and trick him... also a loss.

    I consider this a loss too. Lumiya had the last laugh really. She turned the Jedi Grandmaster into a vengeance killer. If that's not a loss, I don't know what is!

    Yes, this too....

    True! Jaina and Leia, but those would have been the only ones who would have risked Han's wrath!








    JediMatteus:
    I think we're all anxious to find out what they plan to do with the EU: Use all of it; ignore all of it; or pick and choose things here and there...
    I agree.



    More another time....
  16. kataja Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 4, 2007
    star 4
    Exactly!

    Ah, I migth do that. Anyway, I think it was a cunning move from Luke's side!

    Well, we all like different things. Fair enough. But I don't.

    Agreed!

    Actually, I was thinking of some of the basic stuff: like "if the Jedi as so powerful - howcome they..." Stuff like how the heck can Obi-Wan and Anakin be caught and put in a prison cell when they're Jedi?? Stuff that's so essential that it infects the basic ideas of the plot already. I'll need to expand on taht at some point later.


    Not really, only vaguely...

    See, this is a bit what I'm talking about. You can't write a story based on the premis that one character is so powerful taht when he's brought to table he wipes the floor with anyone. Either you have to accept he can lose - OR you gte the passive Luke who sits back fro some reason OR the wounded Luke so we get a reason why he's not as powerful as he used to. You can't have both. No writers are that good!

    He was grim. IWhich was absulotely adequate, considerng the earlier events. That Manod thing, if i remember correctly (that was Niathal's pointing that out, right?) was a thing we never saw Luke's POW to. It was mst certainly a thing that happens in war when you're general level: you do send people out - knowing some of them will only survive if a miracle happens. Ad the Mando's were mercenary's. I don't blame Luke - and I don't beleive he didn't care either! We just didn't see it. And Luke never said we was tainted becaue of the vengeance killing. He tried to explain he couldnøt go after Jacen, because every time he did (in the Force visions) he turned dark - and that sounds like a realistic and sound desicion - not even Luke Skywalker would be able to go against the man who killed his wife without dark emotions. It was Leia who used the word 'tainted' - and it was more of an explanation to the others present, so they could accept Luke's desicion.

    Ok, RL upcoming - I'll be off now and probably in only sporadically the next week. Have fun while I'm (mostly) away!
  17. JediMatteus Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 16, 2008
    star 4
    okay there are a few moments that showed that for Luke and Mara in dark nest, but they were few. And there were none of these moments in LOTF. Especially leading up to sacrifice. Books like Tempest and Exile. In LOTF they spent most of their time arguing about Jacen and Ben. Luke and Mara's relationship was strained because of disagreements about Jacen's influence and how Luke was treating ben. That fact she left his bedside and did not tell him, is horrible. The fact that he would not wake up and sense this in the force before it happened seems unrealistic.
  18. JediMatteus Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 16, 2008
    star 4
    He was grim. IWhich was absulotely adequate, considerng the earlier events.

    I love Luke, and I love Mara. But this is why attachments are so bad. They skew your judgement and you act of out of emotion, and not peace. Jacen taught this reality to Luke and to us, in how crazy he reacted when he thought Mara was dying in Unseen Queen. or was it Swarm war? Jedi should not be in romantic relationships. It can derail them to the dark side, and can be used against them. ex:( a villian going for the loved one, to get to the jedi)
  19. Auditor Dredd Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 8, 2005
    star 4
    Betrayal has a good bunch of moments such as their dialogue when they are about to infiltrate Corellia and they masquerade as themselves/actors, but agreed with all the rest....from Bloodlines on they argue....and Tempest/Exile on they don't do much.

    I don't agree at all, for starters we're quoting Jacen who was demonstrating Luke's weakness via Force illusion of his wife being endangered in TSW, and at that point Jacen was manipulating Luke to use his aggressive emotions(DS) to make him stronger. While in hindsight Jacen himself had a child with with Tenel Ka...this is basically the kettle calling the pot black. One of the big failings of the OJO was in fact their issue of avoiding attachment. and being indifferent to love. When Love is one of the main aspects of the light side if NOT the main aspect of the light side. It was Luke's love for Anakin that he didn't kill his father and it was Anakin's love for Luke that cause him to save his son and fulfill his destiny. If anything jedi should not avoid relationships but they should learn to accept when it's their loved one's time to become one with the Force....which is one of the ultimate lessons not only as a jedi but in life.

    I know he also was impressed with Luke's feat of walking on lava, which I was too. But Luke isn't messiah-like...

    I wouldn't say that passionate is the word but I know he would have been especially careful considering his past experiences.

    Actually these two quotes you reply to were from Kataja. I in fact agree with you about Lomi, she could only used fear/doubt against Luke until the end but he overcame that in the end. Also it should be the priority of the the team to consult the continuity experts....especially when it comes to Luke.

    and I agree with you on Sacrifice and Invincible....but the other books he did NOT act dark. As for Ben's book, you mean Fury ? well Ben's fear was if Luke would commit suicide to be with Mara but I would label that as mourning and him coping with his lost. He went from Inferno as being action orientated to Fury where he had time to really analyze his situation and his loss of his wife. You can't expect a jedi master....not even Luke not to be affected by the murder of his soul mate. There is simply not enough training/preparation for you meeting your other half and then losing her.

    and as I said Luke was in an emotional low from losing his wife to witnessing his son being tortured by his nephew.....Luke acting calm in that battle would make no sense. Simply put Luke was angry/upset/torn up during that fight....BUT he does not go for the kill in that duel.

    Luke was able to walk on his own but they both had to Force sprint due to the bomb....Mara didn't Force grasp him away.

    and that's your POV....but that doesn't make it reality in an actual battle sense. But as I said I agree with you, we did not get to see Luke wiped the floor with her as he could have.

    as your beta this is how I see it :p

    me either.

    well they have no problem with injuring Luke FAR TOO MUCH!!! :rolleyes: Perhaps there are better approaches ?

    have fun apprentice :)
    Last edited by MasterSkywalker86, Feb 8, 2013
  20. ChildOfWinds Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 7, 2001
    star 5
    kataja:
    For me, LotF was one of the absolute worst series! Not only did we read about Luke losing Mara; Jacen going Sith; and Jaina killing her brother, but we also had the rift between Luke and Ben; Luke's vengeance killing; and Luke's rather poor showings in his dealings with Lumiya. We also had young Ben portrayed as an assassin AND we had Traviss portraying the Jedi as near villains and the mandalorians as wonderful models of great, compassionate, hard-working family-oriented individuals who were far superior to Jedi. :rolleyes:


    I wish I didn't see it that way either, but I think it was pretty clear that this is what the author was going for....


    I'm not sure it was... Not only did Ben seem to think that his father might be contemplating it, but I seem to remember that at a point later in the series Luke made reference to this time and gave Ben credit for helping get his father out of his funk, his despair.

    I don't think the two were related though. Luke let Jaina and the others think that Jaina had shot down Luke's ship and killed him during a battle, so he could sneak aboard Jacen's ship. He really did it to let Jacen think he was dead so Luke could sabotage Jacen's turbolasers and then go to Ben. Remember that Ben told Jacen that Luke wasn't dead, but Jacen didn't believe him. Luke had found a way to let Ben know that he was alive even though everyone else thought that Luke was dead.








    MasterSkywalker86 :
    I definitely agree with you about this, MS!

    Again, I agree. Sadly, I think that during LotF and FotJ there were many times when the characters were thrown under the bus and mischaracterized, doing things that were completely wrong for the characters just to serve the plot. I don't think that should happen. If you have to twist a character into a pretzel in order to have him/her do something that is completely alien to the character than either use another character or create a new one to allow your plot to go forward, or change the plot... It probably wasn't that great of an idea in the first place!

    For me as well...



    I'lll second that, MS!








    kataja:
    Perhaps not, but I can't imagine how having a thirteen year old as a member of GAG could possibly be a good idea no matter what culture you're in! Allowing your impressionable young son to continue to be an apprentice to a guy doing very questionable things doesn't sound logical in any galaxy either.



    And in a way, I almost think that makes it worse.... If he had done it when he was emotionally distraught, we could say that he didnt know what he was doing; his emotions got the better of him. In this case though, Luke was TOO calm, in my opinion. He knew exactly what he was doing and he knew it was against what he believed as a Jedi, but he did it anyway.



    As I said though, I think they are two different things. Luke isn't suicidal at this point. He only pretends to be dead so he can sneak aboard Jacen's ship. It was important for others to think that Luke was dead too so that Jacen wouldn't sense through them that Luke wasn't dead. If they didn't seem upset, than he would know that Luke was trying to trick him.







    JediMatteus: i
    Well, we didn't see much closeness between Luke and Mara early in the NJO. I remember being annoyed that this was the first time that we saw Luke and Mara as a married couple and Mara was keeping Luke at arm's length because of her illness. They seemed more like siblings than a married couple early on. But I agree that it got better in some of the later books. And I also agree that we didn't get much of a relationship between Luke and Mara in the DN and onwards. In fact, in the very book in which Mara was killed, we got absolutely NO good scenes between them at all. We got a good Ben/Mara scene and a good Leia/Mara scene, but all we got no good Luke/Mara scene at all. Instead, we read about Luke sleeping and snoring through most of their scenes together, or we got them arguing about Ben. :mad:







    kataja:
    The author had Luke almost foaming at the mouth angry when he found out that Lumiya had access to Ben's boots.


    If the opponent is near Luke's level, or there are multiple opponents, of course Luke could lose. But he shouldn't be written in such a way that he pretty much loses three times out of three times, all in different ways. Especially in that first duel, Luke shouldn't have been written as so weak that he lost his lightsaber and his hand and only managed to survive because he fell pretty much on top of a blaster... I thought this made Luke seem really weak and foolish.



    He was grim, but he was also darkish in that he wanted Jacen to hurt and did his best to make his blows as hurtful as possible.


    But I think we SHOULD have. Luke is supposed to be one of the heroes. He shouldn't be shown doing questionable things without the author letting us into his head so we know that he's feeling terrible about what he is doing, but also realizing that there are no other options. Otherwise, it makes Luke look ruthless. And many people said that about Luke after Invincible, both because of this and because he manipulated Jacen's visions.

    But Saba or Leia did and Luke didn't disagree with her...


    Good luck in dealing with RL! Hope to see you here again soon!








    JediMatteus:
    I agree with all of this, JM!

    I disagree about this, JM. I just think that the authors didn't write Luke and Mara's relationship correctly. I think that the old order was wrong not to allow marriage and families. Jedi just shouldn't have obsessive, possessive attachments and they shouldn't fear letting go. There's nothing wrong with love. In fact, it was the love of a father for a son and a son for a father that brought down the Emperor and an Empire in the OT. And people form attachments to friends and mentors too, and those attachments, if they are obsessive and possessive can cause problems for a Jedi too.







    MasterSkywalker86:
    EXACTLY!!!!!! And we saw Luke accept this when he allowed Ben to go on that mission even though he had had a vision of Ben being captured because he knew Ben was needed on that mission. So, even though he didn't know whether Ben would survive or not, he allowed Ben to go and he was willing to let go of his son if necessary.



    Yes, he would be wary, careful, and watchful and would ACT when he saw that there were problems.


    YES! Definitely!


    I mean Ben's boots. I thought that scene was in Sacrifice.


    Oh, I agree, but I wouldn't expect him to be a vengeance killer, and I would hope he wouldn't be suicidal.


    Didn't she need to help him somehow?
  21. instantdeath Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 22, 2010
    star 5
    I was reading a Tom Taylor interview, and came across a comment that I really liked, and I think gives a great picture on why he writes such a good Luke. It's in regard to Superman, but the principle remains the same, and Luke and Superman are similar characters in a way. Both are sometimes criticized as being so powerful they can become boring, but both are interesting for so many reasons besides whatever powers they can use.

    "However, I’m a Superman fan more than a Batman fan. I believe, for a writer, angst is easy and hope is hard. I don’t look for easy. I don’t believe a story is worth telling without humor, heart and hope, so there will be plenty of this as well. With Injustice, fans are getting to see an author who loves to write in the light, struggling along in a very dark place. It’s a challenge but I think it makes for some pretty good writing!"

    We could use him writing Luke again. I don't completely agree that angst is easy, as I think either can be done extraordinary well, but I like the sentiment.
    Last edited by instantdeath, Feb 8, 2013
  22. Jedi Ben Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 19, 1999
    star 6
    Also, it's in DN that the notion of prophecy as unstoppable starts. If ESB had been done DN / LOTF then Luke would have gone to Bespin and watched his friends die and then had to kill Vader because there was no other way! Yet, arguably the point of the OT is that there are other options on the cards, always. In this respect SW is, despite its title, manifestly not a war story! War requires that you kill and destroy the enemy, war stories tend to focus on that and the effect it has on the combatents and, in some cases, further afield. That's never really been the case for SW. When it has tried to do serious effects of war, it works out akin to superheroes engaging in social issues, which is to say: Badly.

    Back to LOTF: The problem I had with it is I couldn't buy into its central concepts, but from what has been posted here over the years, I likely would have had the same problem with its later ones too. The key one that stands out though is the notion that the future you can see in the Force is set - the films argue very strongly against that!
    ChildOfWinds likes this.
  23. Auditor Dredd Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 8, 2005
    star 4
    we definitely could as I would like to see more of his approach when handling more optimistic characters. I think angst is bit overused now and expected in most protagonists now a days. Life is hard but it takes great strength to accept it with a smile and upbeat manner.

    actually it was LotF's Betrayal when Jacen started to believe that visions can't be changed....ironically in DN he already prove himself wrong when he changed the vision of the never ending kilick war by preventing it. Apparently Jacen forgot this detail going into LotF :rolleyes:

    agreed.

    The ST should prioritize the OT heroes as well as create a few new ones....my hope is they'll make Luke the main hero once again and let him have his own "chosen one" prophecy too. But this time things go well ;)

    The problem of series books in general is we get fewer scenes of them together than we would with a solo book dedicated to them.

    agreed on that,(I'm also of the belief that no one should be on Luke's level save for now Force entities....so no typical force user should able to match Luke ;) ) Luke beats Lomi and Raynar who were far more powerful than Lumiya. The next issue is we have two more duels between them and even then we don't get the inkling of Luke using his full ability.

    The stalemate should have been something similar to Dooku vs Yoda.

    this needs to be emphasize in the new movies.....as love and relationships are not a weakness. they are a strength for Lightsiders.

    which doesn't make any sense that he would be indifferent to Gantoris's aggressive behavior.

    what's the significance of Ben's boots ?

    nope, nothing I recall. In fact Luke saved Mara's life with his Force warning which cause him to lose his focus on the battle.
    Last edited by MasterSkywalker86, Feb 9, 2013
    ChildOfWinds likes this.
  24. lukemaraben Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 1
    ChildOfWinds said:

    I don't post in here very often (I just lurk:) )... But I agree to the above 100%!!! LotF was extremely guilty of this!
  25. ChildOfWinds Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 7, 2001
    star 5
    instantdeath:
    I agree. Luke and Superman are similar. I also agree that Tom Taylor writes a great Luke Skywalker. It's too bad that he doesn't write more Luke stories!


    I love Taylor's comment here! No wonder why I like his Luke portrayals so much!


    Oh, yes!!!








    Jedi Ben :
    And I really HATE that notion! Did the authors trully miss the "always in motion is the future," lesson by Yoda. Did they also miss that the Emperor was WRONG about what he had "foreseen"???


    Exactly!


    I agree with this. It may have war as its backdrop, but it's not really about war.



    Nor could I. In the first place, the very fact that the Solo/Skywalker characters were on opposite sides of the conflict at the beginning just felt WRONG. During all of the terrible crises and wars that they had been through, at least the characters had one another to rely on and to work and share with. I thought it was awful to have a rift between them.

    (And exactly WHY was Han suddenly such a Corellian patriot??? And why would Leia pretty much commit treason???) None of it worked for me. And then to have Jacen beome a Sith was just awful, not to mention Mara's death and Luke turning into a vengeance killer. :(:mad:







    MasterSkywalker86:

    Well said, MS!


    We can dream, can't we? That *would* be nice!


    That's probably part of it. When there is a big series, there are many characters, and the authors try to share time among most of the major and semi-major characters, which means there's not as much emphasis on just a few people.

    Or at least, it shouldn't be easy. They should need to have a lot of things in their favor while Luke has some impediments. OR, there should be multiple villains attacking Luke.

    I REALLY hope this is the positive message that we will get with the ST.

    Well, it's been a while since I read any of the LotF books, but the hint was that Lumiya had access to Ben since she had access to his boots. Luke was worried that Ben would be killed or influenced by her, I guess.

    Yes, that was earlier in the fight. Maybe I'm misremembering about Mara needing to help Luke up, but I do remember that he was in pretty bad shape. He even still looked pretty bad to Tenel Ka after being in a healing trance. And, of course, he needed a new hand...







    lukemaraben:
    Thanks. I'm glad that others agree. I didn't think I was imagining it!