Lit SOS: Save Our Skywalker, Luke Skywalker (v3)

Discussion in 'Literature' started by Jedi Ben, Mar 22, 2008.

  1. Jedi Ben Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 19, 1999
    star 7
    Well, that's why I said it could have worked far better than a simplistic 'attack the Vong / don't attack the Vong' schism.

    For instance, we know there but 100 Jedi and billions of Vong, the question is not do the Jedi defend the Republic but how? The Vong are invading on multiple vectors and the Jedi and NR cannot stop them all, therefore they have to choose. There's the first flashpoint.

    Second flashpoint is the numerical limit - there are 100 Jedi, what is an acceptable loss? Can Jedi run a covert campaign of resistance instead of outright duelling their more numerous yet equally individually lethal adversaries? What happens when numerous Jedi die? Is that too big a loss to the NR? Is that sufficient to justify caution?
  2. SiouxFan Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 6, 2012
    star 3
    Apparently not for Anakin Solo. If there was only 100 Jedi, risking 10 percent of them on ONE mission seems a bit...dumb. So does Luke allowing him to go through with it.
  3. ChildOfWinds Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Apr 7, 2001
    star 5
    Yikes! I don't know how I'll ever catch up with the posts! ;)

    It's nice to see some new posters! Welcome!



    MasterSkywalker86:
    Well, if it turns out to be true, I'll be happy about it. It would be nice to see an older and wiser Jedi Master Luke Skywalker, for instance. I do want Luke to play an important role in the Sequel trilogy, even if other characters will be the main ones. As you know, I'm hoping Luke will have a child or children who will be the major heroes, but I really want Luke to do something really amazing as well. (or many somethings!) I'm hoping Luke will survive the trilogy, even if he plays smaller and smaller roles in Episodes VIII and IX. I'm not really keen about the idea of seeing Luke as a Force ghost. :(:mad:



    You and I are in agreement about that!


    Who knows? Maybe we'll find in the ST that Luke is really the Chosen One of Prophecy who brought balance to the Force by being the catalyst that caused the Emperor and his Empire to be destroyed, and by restoring the Jedi Order.


    Which to me, was really a pretty dumb decision. As far as I'm concerned, if one has gifts, one should USE those gifts, not hoard them. As long as a Jedi doesn't abuse the Force or use it for trivial things, I've never seen the point in not using the Full power of one's gifts! I'm glad that Luke eventually changed his mind about this!



    I can't say for certain about Shelly, but the Jennifer that took Sue Rostoni's place definitely seemed surprised.


    I agree with all of that, but I really liked it as a sort of mystery story that Luke and Mara got to try to solve. I thought it worked really, really well with OF.









    kataja :

    No, I don't think that Luke and Mara's relationship was boring because of their Force bond. I think it probably made them far closer. (or should have) I was teasing with my comment, but I was disappointed that we didn't get better romantic scenes between them in SQ and ESPECIALLY in VP, which was the very first time we read about them as husband and wife in a novel.


    Good luck with whatever you need to do!




    More another time...
  4. Jedi Ben Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 19, 1999
    star 7
    Rationality is irrelevant to the Power of the Plot!
    SiouxFan likes this.
  5. JediMatteus Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 16, 2008
    star 5
    if they make Luke and after thought or a weak old man i am done!!
  6. Mat Skywalker Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 8, 2005
    star 4
    agreed with all points, basically we are saying the same thing, although I'm more worried if they keep Luke single instead of giving him a wife and kid. question is if they do bring Mara to the live screen she would have to be in her 50's at least. Any idea on who could play her ? Julianne Moore ...

    [face_praying] I really hope JB's theory pans out with Luke fighting Darth Plagueis and the next gen face off the apprentice of DP. It could be an interesting combination of both the young and old generation work together.

    exactly.

    then it makes me think that most of the EU will be overlooked, I find it hard to believe that the film will limit itself due to previous material that mass audiences aren't aware of.

    looks like Luke got a new girl in the Star Wars comic ;)
    Last edited by MasterSkywalker86, Mar 14, 2013
  7. Darth_Pevra Chosen One

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    If you don't use your gifts, they will atrophy and wither. How should you ever gain experience if you don't use your skills?
    MasterSkywalker86 likes this.
  8. ChildOfWinds Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Apr 7, 2001
    star 5
    Darth_Pevra:
    Right! Excellent point, DP! Not only that, but I think it would be an even bigger form of abuse of the Force if you could help someone by using the full power of your gifts and don't because you're afraid of using that full power. I think it's wrong to have talents and not be willing to use them to the fullest to help others. If you have a special gift, I feel it's your duty to put those gifts to good use and not waste them by letting them lie dormant.







    MasterSkywalker86:
    Oh! I do too! I really wish that we could have gotten more books where Luke and Mara go on missions together and solve problems or solve mysteries and help people.

    Thanks! I really don't think I would like to see Luke die alone.


    That would be WONDERFUL! I have wanted a Luke-centered animated series since the Clone Wars series came out. I was never interested in the Clone Wars series, but I would LOVE one about Luke in the New Republic Era!








    JediBen :
    Definitely!


    EmeraldJediFire:
    Yes, and I really, really hope that it involves Luke!


    I'm not a fan of DE, and your comment is one of the reasons that I dislike it so much. I really don't believe that Luke fell in DE, though he was certainly foolish to go to Byss to try to defeat the Emperor by learning about the dark side. But, like you, lots of people do feel that Luke fell to the dark side in DE. However, Luke was really like an undercover agent in DE. He never really did any evil acts, and really saved many alliance lives by sabotaging Imperial ships, equipment, and plans, and by sending the Alliance the Imperial codes. And he only pretended that he had joined the Emperor.

    Leeland Chee confirmed that Luke didn't fall in DE when he made the comment in the Luke omnibus that Luke "Nearly fell". But the story obviously wasn't written clearly enough, because so many people still say that Luke was a darksider or Luke fell in DE. Even some authors seemed to get the impression that Luke fell to the darkside in DE.


    Now *this*, I can agree with! ;)







    Jedi Ben:
    And well you should "Stand well back"! ;):p




    More another time!
    Darth_Pevra likes this.
  9. Mat Skywalker Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 8, 2005
    star 4
    we are still waiting for a second book :mad:


    YES! :D

    LOL, I'm merely observing ;)
    Last edited by MasterSkywalker86, Mar 15, 2013
  10. EmeraldJediFire Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 23, 2012
    star 4
    Well, I guess when I said darksider Luke I really didn't mean darksider in that way..I guess I meant more of a dark tone they gave him in DE. (gee how many times can I say dark in one sentence.)

    When I go back and listen to the audio..its obvious to me that the way they did it was a contrived way. Luke really didn't fall perse...he allowed the Emperor to think he had devoted himself to the Emperor's service.. Truthfully he had as I said dark tones..but that was all an act he was putting on...the dark tone was the interesting part.. Though in the end, he may NOT have fallen to the Darkside..but he was certainly manipulated/controlled by the Emperor in the end..or so it seemed.That's just what I took away from it

    (tthough in the actual graphic novel that might not be so obvious..i hate the art for that btw so I try to avoid reading it)

    last point: Brown has never really been Luke's color.its just *makes gagging motion* Not HIM
    Last edited by EmeraldJediFire, Mar 15, 2013
  11. ChildOfWinds Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Apr 7, 2001
    star 5
    MasterSkywalker86 :
    Probably wise... I'm afraid I may have scared off EmeraldFireJade with my DE comments. :( I hope not!

    Well, I'd rather see Luke in black Jedi robes than those awful, boring brown and tan ones...







    EmeraldJediFire:
    Exactly!!!!








    Tim Battershell:
    Maybe...But I wouldn't think that the Force bond between Luke and Mara would be affected... If they are supposedly connected by that bond, I don't see why Mara would need to exert any extra power in order for Luke to be aware that Mara was in trouble. And even if it DID require some power on Mara's part, it wouldn't affect Luke's ability to connect with her. Either way, it didn't make sense that Luke couldn't detect through their bond that Mara was in trouble. It wasn't like she was half a galaxy away. She was in the same building. She was just in another room.

    Well, they're not like Ysalimiri, are they? They don't block Force use, I don't think. They just can't be detected in the Force, right?








    MasterSkywalker86:
    In fact, I don't know if it would require any concentration at all.

    Yes, I think that's pretty much what the problem was, and it was disappointing. As I said, this was the first book in which we got to read about Luke and Mara as a married couple, and it was annoying to see them acting more like siblings than a married couple. I didn't like the fact that Mara was so distant from Luke.

    That's a good point, MS.







    T-R-
    Welcome, TR! I can't either! I hope he will be the wise, smart, resourceful, POWERFUL, compassionate Jedi Grand Master. I do hope we'll get to see him do a really amazing, surprising feat!








    EmeraldJedi:
    I'm not expecting Luke to be the main hero of the ST, but I do hope that he'll play a fairly substantial role as the leader of the Jedi Order. I also hope we'll get to see him do something that will get us to say, "WOW!" to show that Luke really has inherited the full Skywalker potential.








    T-R-:
    Did Lucas actually say that Luke would be the main character of the ST?








    Darth_Pevra:
    I completely agree with all that you said above, DP!!! Luke was portrayed very poorly in the NJO. I especially hated the way he passively sat by for far too many books while the YV took over more and more of the galaxy. I won't go into my two least favorite things concerning Luke, as you haven't gotten to those books yet, but trust me, he wasn't like the active, duty-driven, responsible, in the center of the action Luke we know and love!

    I think things get even worse in the Dark Nest books and in LotF, so agree that I hope we get a very different Luke in the sequels, one who is more like his movie self from the OT.




    More another time...
  12. EmeraldJediFire Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 23, 2012
    star 4

    I don't scare that easily. DE canon is ambiguous almost as ambiguous as most of the older comics. There are a few comics that can be taken to be true continuations..the Legacy comics in which Luke comes back as...as one of my friend puts it a counselor to Cade (due to the deathsticks) is canon EU. though to Lucas those words are contradictory since anything outside of his movies aren't canon. I digress.

    Luke had some good scenes in the Legacy comics (as a Force ghost)
  13. Jedi Ben Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 19, 1999
    star 7
    EJF,

    Oh, Luke definitely got utterly mind-frelled by Sidious at the end, a kind of kicking over the chessboard move: "Screw it, I'll just sledgehammer the little bastard into submission!". Shame it only took another Jedi to really screw it up! Come to think of it, ROTS adds an interesting layer to DE - aside from showing exactly how skilled Sidious was, whose stronger, younger form is decked by Luke - is the care taken to isolate both Luke and Anakin. Each the Emperor wants to keep on their own, why? Because another Jedi is all it takes to blow his plans up.

    And yeah, I can do with Luke in the Legacy comics - COW thinks he accomplishes nothing, I disagree point blank!

    Oh, should say that there's a nasty myth that says everyone has to be agree on everything here - as you might have noticed, not really the case.
    Last edited by Jedi Ben, Mar 16, 2013
  14. EmeraldJediFire Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 23, 2012
    star 4
    People have different point of views, I don't think its a prerequisite that people agree. Cade's arguments against Luke were valid though. He even made Luke back down by threatening to off himself. Though Luke's persistence is in with his character as always...It had me going in my head as Cade...it's a wonder your wife married you at all with all your nagging.

    Sorry, I just had to throw that bit int there.
  15. Jedi Ben Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 19, 1999
    star 7
    Cade's stronger point by far was how the galaxy treated the Jedi, in contrast, threatening suicide to win an argument is quite pathetic.

    My own pet theory is that Luke could see where Cade was going and was aiming to nudge him away from the abyss, but that's easier said than done.
  16. JediMatteus Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 16, 2008
    star 5
    yeah i wonder if the new tv show will be DE or maybe the njo series. otherwise maybe it will be a completely new canon with no eu refrence.
  17. Mat Skywalker Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 8, 2005
    star 4
    you guys made it so much harder to catch up :p


    right, he was going undercover to discover Palpatine's weakness who basically was invincible at this point. Luke was still in the light the only problem is being so close to Palpatine and near Byss can corrupt the purest of souls. That is one of Palpatine's major powers mind corruption and Force storms....one is a bit more subtle than the other.


    Yup Palpatine had him under his thumb near the end.

    actually there are a few lines in the comic where Luke states as much. Also we see Han and Leia become more aggressive in their first moments of being near Palpatine...the man is a Dark Side nexus.

    lol, I thought it was already established that we want to see Luke in black jedi master robes ? :p

    glad to hear it, we need more new people at SOS :)

    lol and I agree with you. nah I think EFJ will be fine :p

    lol I think that is the general consensus among us :)

    good point, I think for a novice or a a green Force sensitive it might take some minimal concentration but for a jedi master like Mara....psah.

    Zahn has the annoying habit of restraining Luke and Mara from typical signs of affection. I mean they should kiss, hug, and kick boots....that is what married people do after all.

    I have a few from time to time ;)

    emphasis on wise and powerful.

    YES!!!! [face_praying] please I hope we really do get that, I hope JB's suggestion comes to fruition, that Luke is the Chosen One and has to fight DP. Also I hope the new enemy is as equally powerful as Luke(think of the new enemy as the DS's version of the Chosen Onew), that way the Luke has a challenging adversary who's equal but will cross the line.

    I'll argue that at DN things were manageable, Mara was still alive, Jacen didn't want to be a sith, the galaxy wasn't going through another MAJOR war.


    well Sidious knew he couldn't beat the kid directly. I mean their first duel Luke was already being mind frelled by Palpatine constantly. Palpatine willed Luke to lose at that point(Luke states he could not concentrate). Sidious's weakness also include being fascinated by power....why keep Anakin or Luke around when you want to rule the galaxy by yourself ? Palpatine got a kick off subjugating the most powerful beings of the galaxy to his servants.

    not just any jedi either, a Skywalker. Just like before with Luke redeeming his father in RotJ. Luke and Leia have the ability to undo the mind control ability that Palpatine possesses. I think that is a key trait for the Skywalkers, anything the Emperor can do the Skywalkers can do better.


    right it seems the only way Palpatine had a shot at converting them.

    lol exactly we're a diverse group of Luke/EU fans, we are in agreement about DE, but not NJO. With Child I agree with her about NJO but not DN. With Kataja I agree with her about DN but not FotJ. Although I think everybody here loves Mindor, TTT, and HoT :D
    Last edited by MasterSkywalker86, Mar 16, 2013
  18. EmeraldJediFire Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 23, 2012
    star 4
    One has to wonder if Luke could foresee where things were going. In my experience, Force ghosts only appear to people when they feel they have dire need of them. The Skywalker line mustve been fine until the whole One Sith fiasco, because it obviously didn't warrant Luke intervening.
  19. ChildOfWinds Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Apr 7, 2001
    star 5
    MasterSkywalker86:
    I would really like that!


    While those few scenes were excellent, so many more were horrible. When you figure that the NJO was 19 books long, Luke Skywalker should have had many, many more wonderful scenes, in my opinion. Sadly, those few scenes were like a few drops in a huge bucket. :(







    Darth_Pevra:
    I completely agree! And you are probably right that the Luke of the OT probably would have sided with Kyp. Eventually, he sort of does, but that won't happen for a LONG time yet in the books. As MS says, the Invasion comics give us a much more active and involved and AWESOME Luke. Sadly, that comic didn't last very long. It just seems to have disappeared... :mad:








    SiouxFan:
    Luke should NEVER have sent those teenagers on that suicide mission. He should have gone alone. He knew how to use the Fallanaasi cloaking skills, and he knew Myrkr and the ysalimiri.







    JediMatteus:
    I don't want to see this either.







    MasterSkywalker86:
    Oh, I'm with you!!! I REALLY want Luke to have a family. I want to be able to follow Luke's children and other descendants in the future.


    That's pretty much the way I feel too. I also think they won't want to limit what they can do in the films, and if they use the EU, they will have many limitations.


    Which comic, MS?






    EmeraldJediFire:
    I'm glad to hear that EJF! It's good to have you here! We really do respect all opinions here too.

    I agree that parts of DE are ambiguous, and I really don't care for ambiguity all that much. Denning is like that. He is often ambiguous and doesn't like to truly end his stories, not even 9 book stories! :mad:

    As JB said, I wasn't terribly thrilled with either Legacy or with Luke's role in Legacy. I don't think Luke accomplished much of anything. He was sort of a verbal punching bag for Cade.

    More another time...
  20. Mat Skywalker Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 8, 2005
    star 4
    yup there were definitely a lack of multiple occasions where Luke shined in 19 books. I count two books out of the entire series where Luke's powers actually stood out with the Skywalker potential. It's a sad thing when a publisher doesn't know how to handle a powerful character. As far as I'm concern, Invasion volume 1 starts NJO and TUF ends NJO.

    sigh :rolleyes:

    right I wouldn't mind to see Ben or his equivalent star alongside his dad, though I hope he would be without the angst.

    I'm really curious since Sword of the Jedi is penned as the next series after FotJ but I don't see that working if its going to interfere with the movies, so I doubt Crucible will actually lead up to the ST.

    the one by Brian Wood, issue 3 reveals Luke new girlfriend and apparently Leia is jealous and oddly enough Wedge looks like it too in the panel. I'm assuming Wedge is jealous of Luke's fame but that seems beneath Antilles.though the book seems to focus more on Leia than Luke.
  21. Jedi Ben Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 19, 1999
    star 7
    If it were NJO, it could work well as NJO's 5-year arc was pretty blatantly riffing off of B5, but where B5 had 5 series of 20-odd eps, NJO only had 19 books to do the job! Just not enough really. If ever there's a case of not being attentive to the medium of a story NJO is a lead candidate.

    Well, that's my theory precisely! Luke wasn't needed until Krayt took over, but I also suspect Krayt also had read the future and that's why he acted as he did, thus Luke had to act to counter Krayt by ensuring his descendent didn't go off the rails entirely!

    re: DE

    What's ambiguous about it? Midway through, yeah, it's there, but not at the end.
  22. T-R- Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 13, 2003
    star 4
    Here's what Lucas has said:
    1.) The ST will follow the adventures of the character that survives RotJ
    2.) The main theme of the trilogy would be moral and philosophical problems, such as the necessity for moral choices and the wisdom needed to distinguish right from wrong, justice, confrontation, and passing on what you have learned
    3.) Luke, who will then be the age Obi-Wan Kenobi is now, some place in his 60s, will reappear, and so will his friends, assuming that the creator decides to carry the epic further. Hamill and the others will get first crack at the roles--if they look old enough
    4.) In the sequel Luke would be a sixty-year-old Jedi knight. Han Solo and Leia would be together, although Lucas says, "They might be married, or not. We have never actually discussed marriage in this galaxy. I don't even know if it exists yet. Who knows what relationship they will have? I mean, they're together, let's put it that way." The sequel focuses mainly on Luke, and Lucas says Mark Hamill will have first crack at the part if he is old enough. "If the first trilogy is social and political and talks about how society evolves," Lucas says, "Star Wars is more about personal growth and self-realisation, and the third deal with moral and philosophical problems. In Star Wars, there is a very clear line drawn between good and evil. Eventually you have to face the fact that good and evil aren't that clear-cut and the real issue is trying to understand the difference. The sequel is about Jedi knighthood, justice, confrontation, and passing on what you have learned
    4.) Luke would have a romantic relationship with a female love interest
    Last edited by T-R-, Mar 17, 2013
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  23. Mat Skywalker Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 8, 2005
    star 4
    I hope some the things he mentions has been...reassess but hearing Luke will be a main character and will have a love interest has me happy
  24. T-R- Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Aug 13, 2003
    star 4
    Just for curiosity's sake, what would you liked reassessed?
  25. Mat Skywalker Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 8, 2005
    star 4
    marriage is probably the only thing, I'm guessing at the time of 1983 it wasn't exactly clear how marriage worked in the GFFA. But now we know that marriage is the same thing as RL. also Han and Leia should be married too