Lit SOS: Save Our Skywalker, Luke Skywalker (v3)

Discussion in 'Literature' started by Jedi Ben, Mar 22, 2008.

  1. Jedi Ben Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 19, 1999
    star 6
    Given that's a major point of such stories, that the characters function, in part as role models, why should it be so surprising?

    However, you are on to something as, in the greater part of the sermon, there is a strand of thinking running through a great many stories of self-sacrifice and risking all for the sake of others, which was suggested today to embody a reflection of Christ's sacrifice. It's an interesting notion to consider.

    With regard to Luke it's interesting when you consider what he does across the course of the OT, particularly on board Death Star 2.
    Last edited by Jedi Ben, Mar 31, 2013
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  2. kataja Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 4, 2007
    star 4
    Agree with MS here. And it's not like we're the only culture that looks up to storycharacters - it's just that we're aware that they're fictional. In other places and times, the many of the heroes have been simply mythological.
  3. kataja Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 4, 2007
    star 4
    Agreed! Luke shows huge similarities with other mythological characters. Christ would be one, Sigurd/Sigmund from the norse/germanic sagas would be another. To the former because of his self-sacrifice - the latter more of the classic hero's journey.

    I think it's not only cool that Luke's a hero to moderns children - I actually find it comforting too. They there's hope still ;)
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  4. Auditor Dredd Force Ghost

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    May 8, 2005
    star 4
    Child has been missing for a while......
  5. Jedi Ben Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 19, 1999
    star 6
    Fictional or mythological, I think people and children are well aware of that with regard to characters, but it simply doesn't matter or register, especially to kids at a certain age. Thus Luke and Han and Leia do inspire, while Vader and the Emperor terrify. Ditto the Daleks and Doctor Who or Dorothy and the Wicked Witch...
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  6. SiouxFan Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 6, 2012
    star 3
    I would not be surprised that if we were able to come back in 1000 years that 'Luke Skywalker' were to be the center of a religion. Look at how many books are written about him--look at how much we debate him here on the boards. We've spent days debating on whether or not he was 'really dark' (his Garden of Gethsamene sp(?) trial) Heck, we even have 'canon', and have further sub-divided that into sections. This is exactly what early Christians did.

    We have, in effect, invented a religion built largely around Luke Skywalker.
  7. Jedi Ben Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 19, 1999
    star 6
    Nah, you're massively amplifying what was a very innocent story of a what was a neat little exchange about childhood heroes! And the only reason, that I can see for it, was to create a recognisable context for the theology that followed.

    I can tell you right now, absolutely, that SW and religion are, for me, light years apart.

    But 1000 years on? We can't really predict the next 20 years never mind the next 1000! Put it this way: 20 years ago, text pads were Star Trek technology, now they're an iPad.

    Also these boards are not now, or were, nor probably ever will be, all that representative of SW fandom. We're a small slice and, despite how seriously we appear to sometimes take it, if push comes to shove SW takes a back seat to real life. We know it's but a story, religion? That's far more.
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  8. Darth_Pevra Chosen One

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5

    I don't think that Luke shares a lot with Siegfried. Siegfried was kind of an *******. For one, he tricked Brünhilde into marrying Günther (which she didn't like because he was a wimp and extremely slimy dude) and he was also a supremely arrogant guy. He kinda deserved being tricked and killed by Hagen.
  9. SiouxFan Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 6, 2012
    star 3
    No, I get that. He was talking about who the real heroes are versus what we are presented with.

    Sure, they seem light years apart now, but there is a Jedi Path is there not? It's largely tongue-in-cheek, but it doesn't really read that way; it reads like a religious tome.
  10. Jedi Ben Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 19, 1999
    star 6
    I still think you're extrapolating way too much.

    There's a detailed guide to Ankh-Morpork now, but though I have no doubt Discworld will be very popular for years to come, no one's going to treat that as an actual tourist guide! It's the same for stuff like the Book of Sith and Jedi Path. Well-constructed? Certainly. Believable replacement for religious texts? Nah, don't buy it.
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  11. Auditor Dredd Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 8, 2005
    star 4
    er...... uh.... what ? :rolleyes: I don't seem to recall making tithes or prayers to the church of Skywalker. Not to mention this thread makes up a small minority in the boards, which in whole makes a small minority of the SW fan base. I'm with JB, there is a gigantic leap between religion and escapism fantasy and not being able to discern the two is where you lose me. While you're reaching on Luke being a religion I seem to remember Jedi actually being a real following practice right next to Scientology. As you imagine the following is rather low since most people try to believe in something that was based on truth.
    Last edited by MasterSkywalker86, Mar 31, 2013
  12. ChildOfWinds Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Apr 7, 2001
    star 5
    Wow! I see I have LOTS of catching up to do! Life's been hectic with Holy week and Easter and lots of family coming to visit. I will try to post tomorrow.
  13. kataja Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 4, 2007
    star 4
    Hm, I don't think much of his character comes through in the original norse tale Vølsungasaga, which is what I refer to (I haven't read the Niebelungen lied). But in terms of story, SW in general ows much to this material - then again, Sigurd's story bis the classic Hero's journey, so...And you're right that there is much wrong with the comparition too, of couse. But I woudn't call Sigurd/Sifried an *******. In which version does he come off like that?
  14. Darth_Pevra Chosen One

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    I didn't read the original (I probably wouldn't understand it), but I read an interpretive book on it, I like Wagners ring of the Nibelung and find the tale in general pretty interesting. Siegfried is pretty much in every version an ass.

    After Siegfried became invulnerable, he challenged Günther to a duel for the Kingdom.
    He later helped Günther enslave Brünhild. Also he helped Günther basically rape her.
    General arrogance because he is invulnerable.

    Siegfried is probably more close to Anakin Skywalker than to Luke.
    Last edited by Darth_Pevra, Apr 1, 2013
  15. kataja Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 4, 2007
    star 4
    Ah, I see. The version from the Edda poems is pretty different though. Sigurd there is easier to relate to, and while he decieves Brünhilde, it happen while he's under a spell so he doesn't remember they've exchanged vows. And he's a loyal friend and a good husband to his wife Gunhild.
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  16. kataja Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 4, 2007
    star 4
    Double post
    Last edited by kataja, Apr 1, 2013
  17. Darth_Pevra Chosen One

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    Interesting. It shows how tales are always reinterpreted and evolve over time. I'm curious how people in 100 years will view the likes of Luke Skywalker and Darth Vader. Star Wars is so big I honestly expect it to become one of the big myths in human history.
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  18. kataja Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 4, 2007
    star 4
    That's indeed one of the things that fascinates me about myths too! I saw Snow white and the Huntsman yesterday - and my son asked how I was with seeing a childrens tale - and I had to tell him that at least in principal I'm inetrested in most reinterpretations of old stories. They can be take too far, though :p

    As for Star Wars in a thousand years - no it wouldn't surprise me either. I only wonder if they'll have the same debates as scholars today, who try to figure out how much of the Rheingold saga is based on true events, and search for namelikes from the history of Burgundy and the Hunn invation. I wonder who they'd think was the 'original' Luke Skywalker? [face_thinking]

    I think time will favor classic 'good guys', though. The antihero dominates now, and has so pretty much for fifty years, but I think it will be a fling in the long run of time.
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  19. Darth_Pevra Chosen One

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    Hah, Luke Skywalker is pretty easy. ;)

    Luke = Lucas
    Skywalker = Sky Walker, someone who walks the skies

    Padmé Naberrie and so on are a bit harder to analyze.
  20. Iron_lord Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    Padme- maybe from the mantra "Om nom padme hum"?
  21. kataja Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 4, 2007
    star 4
    Ah, but Lucas is only namesake with Luke - they don't share history. Maybe save the dreamer who fought a name for himself by believing in his instincts?
  22. Auditor Dredd Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 8, 2005
    star 4
    so apparently the latest news is that Dark Horse will be releasing the original draft for A New Hope as a comic(confirmed not to be an April Fools joke). There are a good couple of differences between what we know, for instance the character of Luke Skywalker is an aged jedi general(Obi-wan), Han Solo is a giant green alien(mixture of Han and Chewie), and Anakin Starkiller is the young hero(Luke). I dunno what to think save do we really need a book on the unfinished material ?
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  23. kataja Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 4, 2007
    star 4
    A lot of people will try to guess the plot of the ST from it - is that an argument?
  24. Auditor Dredd Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 8, 2005
    star 4
    I guess it's a possibility but doubtful, most of the original draft is what we see in ANH, although there are big differences....for instance Luke is Obi-wan in this one
  25. JediMatteus Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 16, 2008
    star 5
    well when the starw ars movies came out everywhere you heard, "May the force be with you". It was pandamonium. It seemed like a religion in the late 70's and early 80's.
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