Lit SOS: Save Our Skywalker, Luke Skywalker (v3)

Discussion in 'Literature' started by Jedi Ben, Mar 22, 2008.

  1. Auditor Dredd Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 8, 2005
    star 4
    RK Striker stop the MLP madness :p

    right like I mention before, anything Luke related that was good and recent was sadly not follow upon :rolleyes: Let's hope Disney fixes this

    actually it seems like aside of KJA, no one follow up with the idea of Kyp being more powerful. I think there was an NJO book where Kyp does the same feat that Luke does with the black hole and doesn't faint, but we now know Luke was restraining his Force use hence why his body would collapse at times. Once NJO and the PT came through it's pretty evident that GL's influence affected the books. Hence why in Allston's book Rebel Dream, Kyp thinks he's stronger than Luke but as he stated in an interview it's only Kyp's thoughts and not based on fact. Then you have TUF where we see how Kyp could not beat one sick Slayer and Luke defeats 8-10 to himself including the leader of the Vong.
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  2. ChildOfWinds Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Apr 7, 2001
    star 5
    instantdeath:
    Yes, I liked Zahn's early characterizations of Luke too. Although he didn't have Luke perform many amazing feats, he did write Luke as a competent, resourceful, smart, successful character with many gifts besides his Force talents. That's why I find it so disappointing that Zahn has written Luke as so useless and ineffective in CoO and Allegiance. He almost seems like a totally different character in those two books from his character in the Thrawn trilogy. I understand that Luke wasn't a Jedi yet in CoO and Allegiance, so I wouldn't expect Luke to use the Force. However, where are all of Luke's other talents that don't involve the Force???? Where is the active character that jumps into a dangerous situation and tries to help?







    MasterSkywalker86:
    Yes, I do hope Disney will fix that and give us lots of great Luke, with him front and center, smart and resourceful!


    Right! That was an Allston book, I think. Fans were annoyed that it seemed that Kyp was more powerful than Luke, but Allston said on his website that it was *Kyp* who thought he was more powerful than Luke. Kyp was wrong...

    Yes, that was the duology in which Kyp moved the black hole like Luke did.

    Yes! That was a CLASSIC battle!
  3. kataja Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 4, 2007
    star 4
    Excellent point, MS! Kyp would actually have reason to believe it since Luke's been restraining himself! Arggh! I'm so angry they've even gotten taht silly idea that Force using would be dangerous in itself!:mad: But fair enough for Kyp, then [face_peace]

    [face_thinking] Actually, this 'hold-back' theory might also explain why Kyp is so agressively taking a stance contradictory to Luke in the start of NJO? A powerful and intuitive Force-user himself, Kyp might have a vague general feeling that Luke's wrong somehow - maybe not able to put it to words, but it would gnaw on his willingness to follow Luke's lead?

    Exactly! And this writing of Luke, actulaly seems so muh worse, comign from the one who created his mate! :(

    But it makes me appreciate the Luke we now get in the Dark Horse comics even more! There Luke is actullay overly cocky, the Death Star victory partly rising to his head - and he has in no way learned how to parry orders! I kinda like this trait in Luke and find it very believable. He's been helping his uncle ll these years and done his chores - but while he's been dutiful in so far that he's stayed on Tatooine, I'm pretty sure he no't been overly dutiful, and has been regarding orders the same way as an average schoolboy: you follow them only if you can't escape.
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  4. Auditor Dredd Force Ghost

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    May 8, 2005
    star 4
    odd isn't ? he has Luke so focused on his Force abilities(in Allegiance and CoO) when instead he should rely on his wits and his blaster and rely on the Force only when conventional means have fail him. In ANH, he relied on his grappling hook to cross the gap in the bridge, he shot the lock on door to keep Stormtroopers from coming, he was the one who got the droids to shut off the power in the detention level. Then you have his resourcefulness in ESB where he destroys an AT-AT on foot and uses tow cables to take down the invulnerable walkers. That's resourcefulness and quick thinking. I understand Zahn generally dislikes to have Luke used his Force abilities when used in grand scale but I feel there should be a way to include it without holding Luke back when he's a knight and eventual master. Using few instances of his grand power would allow us to see his resourcefulness and other skills we don't get to see often, so it would be a nice balancing act. His mechanical skills are largely overlooked, although he knows how to maintain land speeders, droids, and star fighters.He modified the Jade Shadow after all. He also demonstrate his skills in HttE and SQ with using his mechanical hand as an EMP pulse and his knowledge of star cruiser structure, as well understanding the binary language. His piloting skills also seem to be forgotten at times even though he's regarded as the best pilot(Force sensitive) in the galaxy, he inherited the mantle of his father's legacy and more than earn it. I would also say that although Luke is no diplomat nor a jedi consular like his sister, he is good at reading people and their emotions.This complements his leadership skills as well being a strategist, while I wouldn't compare him to Thrawn, Ackbar, Antilles, or Palpatine as a master tactician, his skills in leading and strategy are largely underestimated in the field. He definitely can get results with his leadership as he is the cause of 1000 Sith deaths without a single jedi casualty.

    well the news is while TCW will not be renewed, there is another animated series that will be arriving soon. I'm hoping it will take place in the TNR era as we haven't seen anything in the TV medium of post RotJ. There are plenty of Luke stories to tell, his growth in the Force(time to see what a Skywalker can do) as he starts as a newly initiated knight to young jedi master. His creation of the NJO and his jedi buddies. his romantic relationship with Mara Jade. Luke's battle with new and old darksiders(Kueller, Brakiss, Exar Kun, and Sidious). The conclusion to the Galactic Civil War. Imagine seeing all of that in competent hands, I would love for Dave Filoni and Katie Lucas to work on a series like that.

    TUF demonstrated that actions speak louder than words :cool: After TUF, and especially after what Luke did in DN to both Unu Thul and Lomi I think Kyp has been humbled enough to believe himself just to be #2 under anyone who has the Skywalker surname. as he believe that Jaina was more powerful than himself and Ben has great potential.

    but you see now that Kyp has changed his tune since post TUF. Especially in DN where everybody was in awe of UnuThul's enhanced power, except for Luke who knew Unuthul would be no trouble :cool: There is reason why Kyp doesn't think he's more powerful than a Skywalker anymore. The point is though I still would like to see Kyp be sort of the aggressive jedi but without crossing the line and also at the end of the day he would still follow Luke cause he respects the man. LotF/FotJ has it that Kyp is loyal to Luke which is great, but I don't want him to be the yes man for Luke. He should counter at times.

    that's a good point as well, if Zahn and Del-Rey had Luke used in abilities to fullest then we wouldn't have a very inactive and exhausted Luke.

    so what has Luke done in the comic ? how is his character ?
    Last edited by MasterSkywalker86, Apr 6, 2013
  5. kataja Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 4, 2007
    star 4
    There is a good scene in one of the LOTF books (away from home, so I can't check which one, might be Exile) where Kyp meets Luke and Mara who have arrived at Corsucant. Theit interaction is very nice, one of really old friends who know each other for better and for worse - and if I recall correctly, they continue to a meeting between the Council and the GA where he basically practices 'devil's advocate' - and in a way that gives the feeling he's pretty comfortable in the role. I remember thinking the scene was very good and illustrated how far they'd all come.

    SPOILS! (open)
    He's young and green; close to Leia, who trusts him - but playing/beeing cocky with Wedge, obviously trusting himself to be a very god pilot. Wedge obviously dedicates all his spare time to the Alliance and to get better while Luke's getting distracted by a girl. Also, he's bending the rules but trusts Leia to bear over with him because of their friendship.[/QUOTE/spoiler][/QUOTE]
    Last edited by kataja, Apr 6, 2013
  6. Auditor Dredd Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 8, 2005
    star 4
    I remember liking that scene as well, Betrayal had some good character moments during the Skywalker/Solo dinner. It's sad that those type of scenes were few and far between.

    interesting although does Luke come off as a braggart though ? also how is Luke's and Wedge's friendship ? I have a feeling the
    Show Spoiler
    spy is probably Luke's new girlfriend who is probably trying to distract him. what do you mean that Luke is bending the rules ?
  7. Jedi Ben Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 19, 1999
    star 6
    Hope the rebellion doesn't suddenly have a 'no relationships' rule so loved of procedural cop shows.
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  8. Auditor Dredd Force Ghost

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    May 8, 2005
    star 4
    well they're rebels after all, I imagine they lived like every day was their last.
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  9. kataja Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 4, 2007
    star 4
    Your theory would be a classic, wouldn't it? Which is why I'm not sure that's what they're using. ;) No, Luke's not a braggart - just not yet humble and hard working. And while I see Luke as basically a humble person, I think it still works, because first of all, he'd be first time out of Tatooine and therefor basically confused and trying new approaches. Second, he'd be colored by the Death Star and Yavin - and the comics are called "In the Shadow of Yavin", so...

    SPOILER! (open)
    He and a female pilot are going through an exercise that makes them share an x-wing. The cockpit becoms to cosy that Luke chooses a route home that's hours longer, under the 'excuse' they might be tracked. Leia's furious, through. [/spoil]
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  10. kataja Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 4, 2007
    star 4
    No 'no relationship' rules, but sparetime is one thing and work another. Also, the plot makes clear professionalism is needed in the actual case.
    SPOILER! (open)
    Plus Mon Mothma opens up for the possibility Leia's personally distracted by Luke's romance.
  11. Darth_Pevra Chosen One

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    If the spy is in the secret squad, the secret squad idea doesn't work, right? But I guess from a storytelling pov that could be exactly the reason why he/she would be a member of the squad.

    Anyway, if you guys want to know all about the comics why not read them? ;)
    Last edited by Darth_Pevra, Apr 6, 2013
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  12. Jedi Ben Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 19, 1999
    star 6
    Quite seriously.... Can't afford 'em! I will be getting the trade though.

    Plus Luke's a teenager, there has to be allowance for that, he's 18. And for anyone who says Leia's the same age, no she isn't! Everyone knows girls are, at that age, at least 2 years more mature than boys, so no, she's 20! ;)
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  13. Auditor Dredd Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 8, 2005
    star 4
    tell that to my wallet Petra :p student loans don't pay themselves.

    I find it hilarious/creepy that Leia is angry at Luke's crush
    Last edited by MasterSkywalker86, Apr 6, 2013
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  14. kataja Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 4, 2007
    star 4
    I suppose you mean Leia's angry :p
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  15. Auditor Dredd Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 8, 2005
    star 4
    nothing to see here.....move along :p

    yeah my theory might be too classic...but you never know.
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  16. kataja Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 4, 2007
    star 4
    Exactly. Plus she's been groomed to responsability all her life - Luke's hardly been allowed to take a desicion.



    Yeah - me too! :D Better that way, than the embarrassed denial that there ever was any feelings between them. I remember Lucas stating they hade a lot of emotions between them - but due to unawareness of what they were to each other, they didn't know how to label them. I find that very believable - and I think it's good they bring them to the table.
    Last edited by kataja, Apr 6, 2013
  17. kataja Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 4, 2007
    star 4
    :p
    At that age? Hmm, maybe I should resist commenting on that, or we'll move too effectively off topic [face_whistling]
  18. Jedi Ben Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 19, 1999
    star 6
    Ah, but you want to, don't you? Resistance is futile! :)
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  19. Auditor Dredd Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 8, 2005
    star 4
    SotE, probably describe their feelings in a better light. paraphrasing from memory, Leia cared for Luke too, but it was a different sense then from Han. Leia felt some type of special connection to Luke.
  20. RK_Striker_JK_5 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2003
    star 7
    They didn't know back then. Heck, I'm sure George didn't know they were related. :p
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  21. ChildOfWinds Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Apr 7, 2001
    star 5
    kataja:
    Well, Kyp can be full of himself sometimes and arrogant enough to think he's more powerful, ;) but yes, this does make sense.

    I never liked that idea either.


    I agree. Plus the fact that Zahn himself wrote Luke so very well in the Thrawn Trilogy. He really seemed to "get" Luke. Then he started to get too involved with his own characters and seemed to push Luke backwards while concentrating on and letting characters like Mara and his stormtrooper characters shine and take precedence.







    MasterSkywalker86:
    EXACTLY!!!! Luke was not a Jedi during that time, and he really didn't know how to use the Force. But that doesn't mean that Luke didn't have other gifts and talents that he couldn't use. Luke has many useful gifts and traits and it was disappointing that we didn't get to see him accomplish something with them. Instead, he seemed totally inept and useless, and that's not Luke at all!

    And those are two of Luke's really useful talents. Even Lucas said that the reason he chose Hamill for Luke was because he was able to think quickly on his feet and he wanted Luke to be like that.


    It's really sad that the authors lately don't seem to be taking advantage of Luke's many and varied gifts. :( You've mentioned some good ones above that have been greatly neglected.


    Oh! I really do hope that we'll get an animated series involving Luke and his Jedi! Wouldn't that be GREAT??? I've been disappointed for a very long time that we didn't get a NR animated series which featured Luke!


    I agree.

    He should definitely respect Luke, not only as the Grandmaster and founder of the Order, but also as the man who forgave him and allowed him to continue to be a Jedi after Carida. Kyp owes Luke bigtime!









    MasterSkywalker86 :
    Hmmm... I'm not sure I'm going to like this characterization of Luke. Being green and active and impulsive is fine; I don't really like Luke bending the rules and not seeming to care much about the Rebellion or his duties. I don't think that's Luke. We know he has been pretty duty-driven for most of his life. Even though he's still a teenager, I think that's a trait that was already ingrained in Luke by Uncle Owen and living on the harsh world of Tatooine.


    I wouldn't like this either, so I'm glad Kataja confirmed that he isn't. I think Luke was probably always a pretty hard worker even if he liked to do things with his friends from time to time though, so I won't like that aspect of his characterization.

    I'm also surprised that Luke has a crush on another girl. He seemed quite smitten with Leia in ANH and TESB.








    Darth_Pevra:
    Only my first one has arrived so far. I guess I should get busy reading it, huh?








    Jedi Ben:
    Funny you should say that, because in the first book of SW, Luke is said to be TWENTY and Leia is 18. I truly believe that Luke and Leia were originally supposed to be paired romantically, not brother and sister. (The first Topps cards lists their ages as 20 and 18.)







    RK_Striker_JK_5:
    I agree.... As I said, I think the original intention was for Luke and Leia to become a couple at the end of the trilogy; NOT Han and Leia. I actually rather wish that Lucas had stuck with that...
  22. kataja Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 4, 2007
    star 4
    I let my actions speak louder than words and went to bed instead of arguing ;)

    Yes, they'd have a special connection - and a deep care, I think from the start. And I have a personal theory that while the attraction Leia would feel for Han from the start, would put her asexual love for Luke into perspective, Luke's many qualities would also contrast with Han, and thus delay the romance with him.

    I've always wanted to read more about what he was thinking when he chose Hamill. I think the casting of him and Fisher were the really genious moves Lucas did back then - both are a very good mix of type-casting and not-exactly-the-type anyway. In contarst with Harrison Ford who just is his type; the leaned back smartie with a heart of godl beneath.

    I can't say I like to see Luke bend the rules either - but at least this far, I think it's been done very well, with respect for the character and exploring a rougishness that both makes sense and picks up a trait from the movies that so far has been underexposed in the EU from this timeframe. As much as I like to see Luke shine, I think it's good we see him make mistakes and learn from them. He's dutiful, yes, but he also has a wild streak that he's never, ever been allowed to follow on Tatooine (maybe save when flying). Here he's just gotten massive credit from following that streak. And he's been just thrown head first into something completely new - who wouldn't stumble?

    Well, I get the impression the girl's been pretty active - and Luke's but a teenage boy, after all. I must say I've never bought the pic we've gotten until now, that Luke's been chaste as a monk because he wanted to impress Leia. It just doesn't fit with the air Mark Hamill gives him in ANH at all! In ESB, on the other hand, he's so much more mature already! Just after ANH I could easily see him fall for the first girl who bats her eyelashes at him, blindly following his hormones - um emotions. Besides, didn't Ben say "trust your insticts"?:p

    As for being smitten with Leia - talking a 19 year old greeny - how much would that contradict? He could still be smitten with her - and accept his sudden emotions for someone else, as I see it. It's not like he's given a choise; Leia or Prithi - in that case I'm sure he'd choose Leia. But Leia's busy commanding, and insists on friendship. Prithi makes Luke feel like a Man, and she's probably the first girl to do that. He wouldn't miss that opportunity!

    I don't think this is correct. I'll check when i come home later today, but as i recall it, as least for Luke's part, it's said more vaguely, takling about a robot - and twenty years of its life - and then saying Luke and it are about the same age. I remember reading it and thinking, 'so, does that mean he's twenty?' but I wasn't quite sure. Later, I read he was 19 and recalled the vague wording.

    That was always my fav outcome too.;) In fact, I was awfully disappointed with ROTJ, partly because of that! But after Mara came along, I've changed my mind - they're a much more fun pairing.
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  23. Darth_Pevra Chosen One

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    I think it is completely in character for Luke to bend the rules at that time. Why?

    He isn't used to military discipline.
    Everyone is blowing sugar in his ass because he destroyed the Death Star.
    He seemed to rebel a bit against uncle Owen as well.
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  24. Jedi Ben Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 19, 1999
    star 6
    Well, I suppose one of us had to be the grown-up! ;)
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  25. ChildOfWinds Chosen One

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    Apr 7, 2001
    star 5
    kataja:
    I guess I really need to read this issue!!!


    I think that throughout the EU we have seen many examples of Luke making mistakes and learning from them.... Sometimes, the authors even had Luke learn the same lesson more than once. :(:mad:



    I suppose...


    I checked and the book says that Luke was twice the age of the ten year old robot. It also says that he was 20 on that Topps card.(I checked that too.) Obviously, that's wrong now, as Luke and Leia are both the same age.

    For a long time, the EU said they were 18 in ANH, but since the prequels, I think it has been established that they were nearly 19 at the beginning of ANH. (19 by the end) That way, both the EU and the prequel films are right.



    I agree. Now though with the ST coming along in the future, I'm worried that not only will Luke not get to have Mara as his wife, but that maybe they won't allow Luke to have a wife or children at all. I would find that VERY disappointing. :( At least if Luke had been paired with Leia in RotJ, we know that he very likely WOULD have had a wife and kids.







    Darth_Pevra:
    You're right about that, but I do think that Luke *was* used to living a pretty disciplined life on Tatooine. I wouldn't say that he exactly "rebeled" against Owen. He was a teenager and wanted to try to get to do teenage things with his friends, so I can see him trying to get Uncle Owen to change his mind about cleaning the droids right away. Notice that Luke DID obey and did go and clean those droids. He didn't pretend to go to the garage and then sneak off for a time.

    Luke also abided by his Uncle's wishes when Owen didn't agree to allow Luke go to the Academy that year. He was old enough to go. He had earned the admittance to the Academy. He could have disobeyed his uncle and told him he was going to go whether his uncle wanted him to go or not. But he acquiesced and would have stayed if Owen and Beru hadn't been killed. So I wouldn't exactly call Luke much of a rebel against authority on Tatooine.


    Now *this* might have had an affect on him.

    I really am going to have to read that comic book. I guess I would have thought that Luke would have been more sad and "down" after the "high" of the medal ceremony though. After all, up to that point, Luke hadn't had much time to think or reflect on what had happened. Once things calmed down a bit, I would think that reality would have hit him and he would have come to understand exactly what had happened. He had lost his parents and his mentor. He had lost his childhood best friend in Biggs. He had lost a stable home. He had seen many, many people die in a very short time. He had nearly been killed himself. I would think that all of that would have had more of an affect on him than even the "hero-worship" of some rebels.
    Last edited by ChildOfWinds, Apr 7, 2013