Lit SOS: Save Our Skywalker, Luke Skywalker (v3)

Discussion in 'Literature' started by Jedi Ben, Mar 22, 2008.

  1. Darth_Pevra Chosen One

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    I'm considering jumping to Traitor and then TUF, yes indeed. Initially I just wanted to know more about Jaina, Jacen and Anakin (also in light of the upcoming ST) but so far I can't say I find them interesting. Being a Vader-fan I was also curious about how the so-called Vader 2.0 Darth Caedus comes to be and how he is personality-wise but Jacen so far is disappointing.
    Last edited by Darth_Pevra, May 1, 2013
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  2. instantdeath Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 22, 2010
    star 5
    In addition to those, the Enemy Lines duology (if you liked the Wraith trilogy and Starfighters of Adumar), Destiny's Way, and sometimes The Final Prophecy often come recommended. Destiny's Way, in particular, is supposed to be the turning point of the war, so I'd read that one.

    And yeah, Jacen doesn't begin "becoming" Caedus until after the NJO, mostly because from Traitor on he was always intended to be a hero and Denning decided to run in the exact opposite direction.
    Last edited by instantdeath, May 1, 2013
  3. Darth_Pevra Chosen One

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    Thanks for the recommendations.

    About Jacen: Yes I read he was initially intended as hero but I still wanted to get "the whole picture". He already strikes me as pretty dark because he is so incredibly self-absorbed and seems to believe his morals should apply to everyone. Anakin Skywalker was incredibly self-absorbed as well but at least he was aware of being an awful Jedi.
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  4. Auditor Dredd Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 8, 2005
    star 4
    First recommendation I heard of TFP, but yeah stick with those. Although If you want to read LotF to understand Jacen's descent you're on your own. The best way to describe that series as...."It's a trap!!"
    Last edited by MasterSkywalker86, May 1, 2013
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  5. DarthJenari Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 17, 2011
    star 4

    Jacen's transformation to Caedus happens from Traitor onwards so you can stick with that. The Young Jedi Knights series also helps you learn about the Solo twins, and I suppose the Junior Jedi Knights series can help with Anakin.
  6. Darth_Pevra Chosen One

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    Are the younger versions of the twins more interesting than the older?
  7. Robimus Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 6, 2007
    star 5
    I found the younger, YJK versions, kinda one dimesional. Jacen is good with animals, Jaina is good at fixing stuff - they never really venture far from those roots.

    NJO makes them far more interesting to me.
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  8. instantdeath Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 22, 2010
    star 5
    The series is written by KJA. That should tell you all you need to know :p

    :mad:

    I think it'd be more accurate to say the transformation to Caedus begins with the Dark Nest trilogy; Traitor is the midpoint, or possibly even the beginning, of Jacen's Hero's Journey, something concluded in TUF.
    Last edited by instantdeath, May 1, 2013
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  9. DarthJenari Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 17, 2011
    star 4
    Jacen in YJK is better than Jacen in the first half of NJO in my opinion, than from Traitor to Unifying Force, and even the Dark Nest Trilogy they kind of even out. LOTF is where Jacen ceases to exist and his character is assassinated, we're then left with Vader 2.0.

    Jaina I also liked in YJK, but NJO killed any interest I had in her character. DNT made it even worse, and LOTF and FOTJ have done nothing to rekindle my interest. However, there are many people who do like her as a character.

    @instantdeath Yeah you could also say that. :p Probably better considering he was well written back then. Only said it as I did, because his training with Vergere became some scapegoat Sith plot to turn him to the Dark Side. :rolleyes:
    Last edited by DarthJenari, May 1, 2013
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  10. instantdeath Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 22, 2010
    star 5
    Yeah, even in a shared universe, retcons like that annoy the living hell out of me. Going back and changing such an important, if not the most important stage of self-realization for the character, and then making it about something else entirely just to support your story, really doesn't sit well with me, and easily represents the ugliest part of the shared universe setup; the part where authors so freely trample over the work of others.
  11. kataja Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 4, 2007
    star 4
    It shouldn't be a problem - but I've seen other times were it is, nontheless. I have a good friend who doesn't like Mara becuase she doesn't like Zahn either - and because there are som many bad writings of her in general. But interesting enough she often likes Mara in fanfiction!!!

    Considering that at least half of the authors who've portrayed her, haven't 'got' her character at all, I'd say the 'whole picture' doesn't help one bit.

    I can definitely see why you're confused, then. First of all, Luke's strangely passive most of this time, second, Mara is odd at best, annoying at worst in many of these. IMO it's only Tyers who really gets her. But probably even Tyers' portrayal is dependent on that you know the pre-history. If you do, and if you, like I, have a clear idea of Mara's character, then Tyers is nothing less than brilliant! But if you think Luke ill written in those books you've read, let the same go for Mara.

    As for these Zahn's short stories I agree. They're pretty... dull.

    You're too sweet MS [:D] I guess that means we have the same idea about how she should be written, then ;)

    Problem is still, that if you don't like Zahn's writing, you probably won't like Mara either...
  12. Darth_Pevra Chosen One

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    Ah yes, KJA, my favorite author of them all...

    I see. I find him a weird choice to be turned into Darth Vader 2.0 too. Back before the prequels I imagined Anakin Skywalker as a decisive and pragmatic hardass Jedi, Jacen so far is completely the opposite of that. He's about as un-Vader as possible.
  13. kataja Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 4, 2007
    star 4
    Destiny's Way was an ok Mara. Not much of her, but in character. Enemy lines is ok, too, but it displays the one time when she's panicking (after Ben's kidnapping in SBS). So it's not like it's typical for her character.
  14. Auditor Dredd Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 8, 2005
    star 4
    Uh just a gentle reminder guys keep the topic related to Luke :)
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  15. kataja Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 4, 2007
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    Both Jacen and Mara are related to Luke. Doesn't that make the topic so too? O:)
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  16. instantdeath Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 22, 2010
    star 5
  17. kataja Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 4, 2007
    star 4
    Thing is, that at least the Mara's characterization discussion was related - it started out with Pevra wondering if Mara was a good wife for Luke. And my point is that if Luke's written OOC - then Mara most certainly is!
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  18. Auditor Dredd Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 8, 2005
    star 4
    I was referring to the general Jacen discussion than Mara's. sometimes when a Jacen topic comes along it gets a lil out of hand :p
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  19. Auditor Dredd Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 8, 2005
    star 4
    As long as people don't say that Callista was the ideal choice for Luke...that relationship was all sort of crazy and still remain boring at the same time, the absurdity of it all.
    Last edited by MasterSkywalker86, May 1, 2013
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  20. kataja Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 4, 2007
    star 4
    And so did Jacen...:p

    I've often been thinking how miserable Luke must have felt when things turned out the way they did. Jacen was his first personal padawan, after all!
  21. instantdeath Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 22, 2010
    star 5
    All I'll say on Jacen is that it was obvious that he only turned to the dark side in an attempt to tie-in or, more accurately, regurgitate the prequels.

    That said, the one good thing that I feel could have come from it, but didn't (this is about Luke!), is that Luke should have cut Jacen off from the Force, in the way Nomi Sunrider did to Ulic Qel-Droma. For one, I think it would be a great reference. Second, it adds so much potential for future stories. In the way it happened, Jacen died corrupted and an idiot; whatever potential he has is gone, and the galaxy is worse for it. Han and Leia are lessened as characters because they had absolutely no faith in their son. Luke is lessened because he seemed to not even try to redeem him. As someone else (maybe Havac?) put it, LOTF is nothing less than a shotgun blast directly into the heart of the post-ROTJ EU.

    However, had Luke cut Jacen off from the Force, that could have led to some highly interesting story developments. Jacen is a person that has been close to the Force all his life; in TTT, Leia is described as feeling the Force from her twins when they're still in the womb. He begins unconsciously using the Force when he's a toddler, and is trained by his Uncle not long after that. He was always painted as more contemplative than the others around him, particularly when it comes to the Force. Not only would taking that constant companion away from him have been an apt punishment, it could have led to some highly interesting journeys for Jacen. It's no secret that we need more non-Force using characters; would it not have been interesting for Jacen, who always took more after his mother than his father, to become a blaster slinging wanderer like Han was? A person who continues to seek meaning in the galaxy, even when he can't feel the Force? There's a great redemption story there, one that will never be told.

    Oh well.
    Last edited by instantdeath, May 1, 2013
  22. Darth_Pevra Chosen One

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 5
    You know what I'd find interesting? If in the ST Lukes child is not a force sensitive. Luke would definitely love it just the same but I imagine it to be an interesting situation with Luke being grandmaster of the order.
  23. instantdeath Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 22, 2010
    star 5
    That's something I've thought about as well. Personally, I think it could be a really interesting situation for Luke to have two children. One that's a Force prodigy, seems to be good at everything he/she does... and the other who's not Force-sensitive. Could be a really great jealousy angle there. Of course, I'd really hope they wouldn't do the obvious thing and make the non-Force sensitive child turn evil. I'd like the non-Force using one to turn out as useful and reliable as the other. Done well, it could be a great reinforcement of Han's old line; "hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster at your side" :)
    Last edited by instantdeath, May 1, 2013
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  24. kataja Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 4, 2007
    star 4
    I have to agree! I kinda liked her character - but not as partner for Luke. She was so noble that they became this ├╝ber awesome couple, I think.
  25. Auditor Dredd Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 8, 2005
    star 4
    14th by my count :p but how could he prepare for his nephew to turn heel for a dumb reason and then become a fully fledge sith in a shoe horned plot that aped the PT and kill off one of the EU's favorite characters. Not even the Force is a match for bad ideas but then again I'm no writer :p
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