Lit SOS: Save Our Skywalker, Luke Skywalker (v3)

Why would it? His father had a few fits of rage that involved killing in anger and he didn't fall to the DS the instant he did it. He fell gradually after doing it over and over by choice. You can only do the wrong thing for the right reason for so long before you become the wrong thing. Sure, every time you do it it will get harder to avoid doing it again but, that doesn't mean you fall today.

Falling to the Dark Side is more than losing your temper once or twice. You aren't a Paladin where you fall after a single unjust kill http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0407.html. Chances are the number of Jedi that haven't used the Dark Side ever and have accomplished anything of note is very close to 0.

 

But Luke killing Vader would've been unnecessary because all it would've done was made him Palpatine's apprentice, exactly the opposite of what Luke wanted. And even if he had done that and attacked Palpatine, you'd have a TFU scenario, nothing more. Luke would've ended up either dead or Vader 2.0.

 

I think murder of kin is a bit more than a fit of anger. Considering you have the devil right there telling you to do so.

 

Vader killed an entire tribe including women and children. I'm pretty sure that's worse than killing a Dad that's basically tried to harm you every time you met and just threatened your sister. I'm not saying it's a light side decision I'm just saying it's not one that immediately drops you off in the land of the Dark Side for life.

 

"Now we have Luke about to killed an unarmed defenseless man; we never done that before. If he kills a defenseless man, especially a defenseless father then he gone over the dark side."- George Lucas Making of RotJ pg. 73

 

Did George forget the whole defenseless part when he had Vader spend 10 seconds carrying him over and tossing him in?

Defenseless people don't take force lightning to the face and keep standing. They die. Horribly.

What George says doesn't matter as much as what the plot does.

Vader killed Dooku when he had both arms cut off did he fall to the dark side because of it? No.

 

Does it really need to be the same circumstances for one to fall ? It's different for everyone.

Anakin already had a strong sway in the DS when he wiped out a Tusken village and murdered Dooku. He was already walking the line. Sidious just gave him an extra push to the DS.

 

He is a mass murderer, I am not going to be convinced he should not die right then and right now just because he happens to lack a weapon at the time.

 

It's not our job to convince you, you are free to believe whatever you want. But the creator of Star Wars has stated that Luke would have fallen to the Dark Side if he had killed Vader in that moment. Lucas also said that Vader was redeemed, which is why we see his Force Ghost at the end.

You can believe that Vader didn't deserve redemption, but the creator of the story says he was. And his word is the one that matters more than anyone else's.

 

I find it interesting that there's still a binary view of "falling to the dark side."

 

Hmm, this reminds me of an argument in another section of the forum, that concerned what issues Anakin would be left with from being a slave. My answer here is similar, you can't compare Anakin slaughtering the Tuskens and whoever else to the spritiual effect/damage Luke would've suffered from murdering his father. Doesn't matter who it is, what that person has done, or what else is going on around him at the time. Everyone's different, and can't ever be judged the same. There are no video game mechanics here; no Dark Side points being added to a meter. There's no scale to weigh the value one life has over another, and I don't think that's what George was going for in any of his movies. However many lives Anakin may have taken before falling has nothing to do with Luke. Had Luke killed Vader on the 2nd Death Star he would've belonged to the Dark Side.

 

Then why didn't he go to the dark side when he killed Lumiya?

Does Luke have a checklist of people he'd go DS if he killed but anyone else he can slaughter for free?

 

Luke's nepotism extends to what serves as valid causes for him to turn to the dark side.

 

Luke was compromised because of it. Mission accomplished.

 

You're using an example from LOTF to argue against ROTJ?

 

Maybe because he wasn't in the same place in LOTF as he was 40+ years earlier perhaps? Just like you can't compare Luke to Anakin, you can't compare LOTF Luke to ROTJ Luke, because he's grown as a person both emotionally and in understanding of the Force. What would've effected him one way years prior, is no longer going to have the exact same effect. And even then, he was tainted by his killing of Lumiya, found himself slipping dangerously close to the Dark Side, and had to step back from the conflict to prevent it.

You're again looking at this as a video game, where a certain action is and always will give X amount of Dark Side points to all characters. That's not, and never has been how it works. Every situation's different, every person's different, at different times.

 

And don't forget it was bad writing.

 

Isn't that what quantifying "turning to the dark side" as a binary proposition is doing?

 

All around

 

How do you think the EU Luke would have developed without NJO to Crucible?

How diferent do you think Movie Luke of 34 ABY compare tp EU Luke of 34 ABY?

 

In other words falling to the DS isn't a mathematical formula.

 

you dont see it. by tossing the lightsaber Luke was sacrificing himself being a true Jedi. Doing something in rage is an act of the dark side. It is never about relevatism or what someone else does. It is what you do that matters. It can't be justified because my "Dad" did it.

 

Yep. Trying to treat it like an equation is silly.

 

Is it ok to toss in a few reflections on Luke based on the new Captain America? Its just struck me

1) how much more interesting good guys are compared to bad guys, particularly if you let the narrative universe reflect the complexity of real life!

2) once more, how much alike Luke and Cap really are!

3) that while I enjoy the action and the effects, the movie stunts even supposed-normal heroes have become capable of this past decade, will probably make anything a Jedi's supposed to be able of, look like an ordinary action hero on a bad day. How the heck will the GFFA Force users be able to reach awesome, when the earthly stunt level is running wild? I find myself starting to hope they'll find a completely different way to make the Jedi go. Of course I hope Luke will lick butt, but above all, I hope to see him as a moral rock!!!