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Amph Spider-Man: Homecoming (and Spin-offs) (Was: The Amazing Spider-Man)

Discussion in 'Community' started by Spiderfan, May 20, 2008.

  1. darthcaedus1138

    darthcaedus1138 Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 13, 2007
    I would call going down into the car to save the kid, repeatedly working with the kid to get him to come out, and just generally holding the car up with all of his newfound strength to be heroic.

    The main thing though is that the act was selfless. If he were selfish, he would have instead either ignored them or went after the Lizard. As Ben says in the movie, when you have the power to do great things, it becomes your responsibility to do them. You take yourself out of the equation, and use your gifts to help others, not something self serving or aggrandizing. In that moment, Peter had to take his personal issues aside and help someone, simply because he is able and they are not. I know that people like the with great power comes great responsibility, but I really like Uncle Ben's version of that in the movie.
     
  2. Aytee-Aytee

    Aytee-Aytee Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 20, 2008
    And nobody mentions anything else about Norman Osborn actually having a face in this one. :p
     
  3. Jabba-wocky

    Jabba-wocky Chosen One star 9

    Registered:
    May 4, 2003
    What, how?

    He initially set out before he knew the Lizard had transformed. Once he had, there was no real end game. He wasn't going to beat the guy to death/unconsciousness, and he clearly couldn't fix the guy sitting on a bridge. Letting him go was probably the most obvious and workable option regardless of what else he chose to do or not. There weren't really any "personal issues" for him to set aside here.

    Also, I find your definition of "selfishness" bizarre. Being selfish is about looking out for one's self, not block-headed refusal to ever help anyone under any circumstances. He was already on the scene. If the car fell, he had the reflexes to jump away, and the fortitude to survive the fall in any case. The only real difference is whether the child survived or not. Even a selfish person might well make the choice to try saving him, given these circumstances.
     
  4. darthcaedus1138

    darthcaedus1138 Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 13, 2007
    It is my belief that at this point Spidey does not yet know the full extent of his powers. At any time, he could have said 'No, this is too dangerous for me, I don't know my limits, I have to get out of here.' But he didn't. He stayed, he helped, and in doing so became a hero. Staying and making sure that no one dies makes certain that the Lizard doesn't cause permanent harm. The Lizard was on the retreat, and if Peter would have followed him he might have been able to stop him. At the cost of the people on the bridge dying.

    I believe selfishness can entail valuing your own self over others. By risking his life to save just one child, Spidey proves that he gets what Uncle Ben had been telling him. He's not doing it to be a hero, he's doing it because he can't and shouldn't do anything else. He has power, and he will use it to help those who cannot help themselves. He can always track down the Lizard later. I'm not absolutely certain, but I'm thinking that Peter at least suspects that this Lizard is Dr. Connors. In this case, he helped to create this problem, and feels responsible in bringing it to justice. But he has to help the people he inadvertently put into danger first. It would be selfish for him to believe that the only thing he could possibly do to help is to stop the Lizard and only stop the Lizard. That would be egocentric, to discount the lives of the people on the bridge because he has a score to settle, a dangling thread to tie up. He can do that later. There are people that are within his power to save, and he is going to save them without a thought for his own safety.

    Quiet you, I'll get to that when I'm done with Wocky.
     
  5. JoinTheSchwarz

    JoinTheSchwarz JC Head Admin & Community Manager star 8 Staff Member Administrator

    Registered:
    Nov 21, 2002
    I don't think you can be done with Wocky.
     
    Darth_Invidious likes this.
  6. darthcaedus1138

    darthcaedus1138 Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 13, 2007
    I'll just spam him with Japanese Spider-Man YouTubes 24/7, 365. Maybe I'll break him.

    Maybe not.
     
  7. I Are The Internets

    I Are The Internets Force Ghost star 8

    Registered:
    Nov 20, 2012
    I really liked ASM, and it's probably better than the Raimi trilogy. The only problem I had was that the Lizard man or whatever he's called (I don't read comics) looked like Gorn. Villains should NEVER look like Gorn.
     
  8. darthcaedus1138

    darthcaedus1138 Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 13, 2007
    [​IMG]
     
  9. I Are The Internets

    I Are The Internets Force Ghost star 8

    Registered:
    Nov 20, 2012
  10. Jabba-wocky

    Jabba-wocky Chosen One star 9

    Registered:
    May 4, 2003
    Liz.

    Ard.

    Man.

    Lizard Man. Burning up his fuse out here.
     
    darthcaedus1138 likes this.
  11. darthcaedus1138

    darthcaedus1138 Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 13, 2007
    And I think it's gonna be a long long time, till the serum brings me 'round again to find, I'm not the man they think I am at home, oh no no no

    I'm a Lizard Man.
     
  12. JoinTheSchwarz

    JoinTheSchwarz JC Head Admin & Community Manager star 8 Staff Member Administrator

    Registered:
    Nov 21, 2002
    Thanks for reminding me that Spider-Man: The Musical existed, guys.
     
  13. darthcaedus1138

    darthcaedus1138 Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 13, 2007
    What we've created here is much, much better than Turn Off the Dark.

    And it's maimed/killed less people/careers!
     
  14. Ezio Skywalker

    Ezio Skywalker Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 29, 2013
    Spider-man 2 > all other Spiderman movies so far.

    Lizard man does indeed look AWFUL.

    Parker never seems selfish in anything other than the blasphemy that is Spiderman 3 (oh and, you know, right before his uncle dies).

    They're apparently making some great changes for TAS2, so let's just hope it's better than everything that came before.


    Oh and Raimi Aunt May > TAS Aunt May.
     
    SithLordDarthRichie likes this.
  15. SithLordDarthRichie

    SithLordDarthRichie CR Emeritus: London star 8

    Registered:
    Oct 3, 2003
    But it was of no benefit to him to do it, he did it because he was able. Selfishness is about acting in your own self-interest and sometimes that is a good thing. But in the case of the child in the car it was of no benefit to Spiderman to save the kid or to potentially risk injury and exposure doing so, yet he did it anyway. That is what sets aside heroes from villains, Spiderman could have become a villain if Peter Parker hadn't acted for the good of the innocent and fought against evil. You think that Green Goblin would save a child in a car? Of course not, there is no benefit to him in doing it and he cares not if the child lives or dies because his personal goals matter more to him.
     
  16. Life

    Life Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 4, 2012
    The Green Goblin is a comic book villain, though, and a psychotic one at that. A caricature far removed from the average man.
     
  17. Deputy Rick Grimes

    Deputy Rick Grimes Jedi Grand Master star 6

    Registered:
    Sep 3, 2012
    Hopefully the sequel is the better than the 1st one
     
  18. Jabba-wocky

    Jabba-wocky Chosen One star 9

    Registered:
    May 4, 2003
    While selfishness does require that someone act in their own self-interest, it doesn't bar them from undertaking acts that have an essentially neutral valence. It would only be inconsistent if the rescue had been against his self-interest. But it wasn't. Saving the child in the car didn't effect him either way.
     
  19. Ezio Skywalker

    Ezio Skywalker Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 29, 2013


    That mask is like 100x's better than what we got. It might've made up for the Goblin's lack of a coherent/sensible story.
     
  20. Life

    Life Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 4, 2012
    It makes little sense in the context of the story explanation they chose for the suit's origin, though, as a military armour. Why would a military armour come with a mask like that, with the purple hood, no less? On the other hand, I suppose you could ask the same about the final helmet they went with as well. :p
     
    Summer Dreamer likes this.
  21. soitscometothis

    soitscometothis Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 11, 2003
    By that logic, most of Superman's actions fighting crime are not heroic at all, seeing as he is rarely in mortal danger as long as there are no green rocks around. And I'm not saying I necessarily disagree with that take on Superman, just that I've never heard you argue it before.

    I do think you're downplaying Spider-Man's actions on the bridge, though. He isn't doing something that requires little or no effort - we see just how many cars he's had to catch in a short space of time, we see how hard he has to strain rescuing the kid - in that situation he's not risking his own life, but he is risking a failure that would likely see him criticised and blamed for resulting deaths; he does go out of his way to help those people, and the outcome is by no means certain. He also risks exposing his identity to help save the kid, which of course would lead to his arrest. This isn't simply a case of him doing something easy like sticking his arm out and catching a fleeing criminal, I would argue that it is a heroic effort on his part that tests his powers and resolve and marks an important change in his actions, from initially guilt-fueled revenge vigilantism to far more positive compassionate actions.
     
  22. Eeth-my-Koth

    Eeth-my-Koth Jedi Grand Master star 9

    Registered:
    May 25, 2001
  23. TheGuardianofArlon

    TheGuardianofArlon Jedi Master star 6

    Registered:
    Feb 26, 2007
    What did I do?
     
  24. JoinTheSchwarz

    JoinTheSchwarz JC Head Admin & Community Manager star 8 Staff Member Administrator

    Registered:
    Nov 21, 2002
  25. Violent Violet Menace

    Violent Violet Menace JCC Ravager star 5 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Aug 11, 2004
    I have to echo [Sony co-chairman] Amy Pascal's sentiments: “Thank you. Thank you for not wasting the studio’s money, and I appreciate your candor.”