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FF:NSW **Spoilers** The Matrix: Revolutions - a consideration

Discussion in 'Oceania Discussion Boards' started by TheMysticForce, Nov 6, 2003.

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  1. TheMysticForce

    TheMysticForce Jedi Youngling

    Registered:
    Oct 28, 2003
    For those of you who have seen the latest installment of the Matrix trilogy I'm sure there has been much heated discussion post-credits. I am very interested in your reactions, as I'm curious to see if the seven or so opinions from the group of five that I saw Revolutions with is a normal response.

    Personally, I'll be blunt and say Revolutions was a major disappointment. I'm not interested in raging against the film, as many reviewers have done, but I do have three main flaws to identify in the hope that someone can provide a satisfactory rebuttal - for I would prefer to retain my admiration for the Matrix series.

    Firstly, all the unanswered questions that Reloaded left me with were either ignored or glossed over. Most notably, Neo's ability to destroy machines was briefly attributed to his connections to 'the source' instead of being properly explained. Other important aspects were also not considered, such as: the purpose of the Oracle, the fate of plugged-in humanity, the ramifications of Bane/Smith's existence, and the relevance of the place to which Neo's coma-state took him. As a filmmaker, treating audiences like this is just unprofessional.

    This leads into my next objection - the large amount of irrelevant/unexplained material that the Wachowski's were permitted to include in Revolutions. I grant that much of the items I am about to list may have a significance I failed to grasp, but I feel this significance should have at least been conveyed in a less minimal way. The main irrelevant/unexplained aspects I remember are: the train station/train driver, family in train station, little girl who goes to the Oracle, Bane/Smith, sun above scorched clouds, sudden power of Smith. I'm sure there was more I identified this morning, but I can't remember them all now.

    The final complaint I have is the ending. It was highly anomalous when compared to the remainder of the movie, and indeed the whole trilogy. I think the discussion between the Architect and the Oracle was a poor way of making a final comment on the Matrix system and blatantly ignoring Zion save for a few cheers was highly annoying after great pains were taken to chronicle the battle that had just taken place there. Moreover, it would be very useful if they made it explicit whether Neo lived or died (with my preference and assumption being the latter).

    Three more comments to close:

    Following in the style established for Reloaded, the dock battle scene in Zion went far too long. This is not surprising, but should have been fixed after the length of fight scenes in Reloaded was identified as a problem by reviewers/audiences.

    As opposed to what many reviewers have said, credit should go to Carrie-Anne Moss for continuing to not over-dramatise the scenes of 'emotional' interaction with Keanu Reeves (for his mechanical acting style wouldn't make this look good), particularly the scene of her death (Pernilla August take note).

    Laurence Fishburne was appallingly underused.

    If anyone has a response to either the movie or my take on it, I'd love to hear it.
     
  2. The_Scream_Man

    The_Scream_Man Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    May 1, 2000
    Okidokey then, I shall comment:

    Personally, I'll be blunt and say Revolutions was a major disappointment. I'm not interested in raging against the film, as many reviewers have done, but I do have three main flaws to identify in the hope that someone can provide a satisfactory rebuttal - for I would prefer to retain my admiration for the Matrix series.

    I loved it. Better than reloaded, though didnt grab me the way the first one did. Still, all in all, I dug the series, and its conclusion.

    Firstly, all the unanswered questions that Reloaded left me with were either ignored or glossed over. Most notably, Neo's ability to destroy machines was briefly attributed to his connections to 'the source' instead of being properly explained.

    No, that made perfect sense. Neos power as "The One" had to come, in some way, form the being that in a sense 'created' them all in the Matrix; The Source. Much Like Jesus abilities were Gods power, Neos abilities used the Sources power. It made more sense to keep it vague, than to have any of the number of other theories Ive heard.

    Other important aspects were also not considered, such as: the purpose of the Oracle

    In the first 2 themes, it was stated that the first Matrixes were rejected because they were too perfect. Humanity didnt believe it. The architect program cannot grasp randomness. Thus, the oracle provides random aspects into the program to make it believable. Along the way, she came to love humanity.

    fate of plugged-in humanity

    Those who want to be freed will be offered a choice, the rest can stay. We've already seen not everyone wants out.

    ramifications of Bane/Smith's existence

    What ramifications? As far as the people of Zion know, Bane went nuts. Only Neo and Trinity know the truth, and they arent gonna be talking to people about it.

    the relevance of the place to which Neo's coma-state took him.

    It was a state in between the Matrix and the Real World. When Neo bridged the gap, it took his consciousness there to cope.

    This leads into my next objection - the large amount of irrelevant/unexplained material that the Wachowski's were permitted to include in Revolutions.

    Actually, I thought it was edited WAY better.

    I grant that much of the items I am about to list may have a significance I failed to grasp, but I feel this significance should have at least been conveyed in a less minimal way. The main irrelevant/unexplained aspects I remember are: the train station/train driver,

    I didnt quite get why they're allowed to be there either. i assume it was a kind of....Zip Disk if u will. a Storage area for programs between the source and the Matrix. The Frenchman (Im not even goignt o try and spell his name) somehow controls this area, thought the train station.


    family in train station, little girl who goes to the Oracle,

    How they got there I don't know, but their purpose was to make the audience realise that not everythig from the Machine world was evil; They to are capable of compassion.


    Bane/Smith

    He can posess people, and he gains their attributes and memories. apparently, it allowed him to be similar enough in brain patterns to enter Bains body.

    sun above scorched clouds

    Trinity was probably the first human to see the sun in hundreds of years. It took her breath away because she knew it.

    sudden power of Smith.

    He absorbed some powerful programs. all the Smiths in the empty city implied he had absorbed EVERYBODY, so he had all there abilities and attributes.

    I'm sure there was more I identified this morning, but I can't remember them all now.

    ok :)

    The final complaint I have is the ending. It was highly anomalous when compared to the remainder of the movie, and indeed the whole trilogy. I think the discussion between the Architect and the Oracle was a poor way of making a final comment on the Matrix system and blatantly ignoring Zion save for a few cheers was highly annoying after great pain
     
  3. Teknobabel

    Teknobabel Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jun 4, 2000
    I'm still examining the whole film in my mind (I shouldn't be, what with exams next week). Certain parts felt to rushed, while other's felt drawn out, it was better than reloaded, but I'm getting the feel that the cgi elements drowned out the storyline.

    The first 1/3rd of the film was definitely rushed, flipping between the train station and Trin efforts to find Neo. I know the plot didn't need to be setup, it being a trilogy after all, but still it went way to fast.

    The attack on Zion was endlessly repetitive and only showed the awesome effects of the cgi crew, but for the purposes of narrative causality (ie: all the small substories that had to occur) I'm willing to overlook the length of the actual battle itself.

    As for the philisophical content, there's a lot to be said about that, so i'm going to give my head a rest and wait until after my exams to sort it out.
     
  4. Darth_Punk

    Darth_Punk Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 12, 2002
    Scream, further to my post in the other Matrix thread, this is what I have a problem with the ending.
    Quote from scream:
    "Well, here is where the interpritations vary somewhat, but after some discussion with those who saw it, i think Drew was closest to the truth. u have to kniow your bible; as ever, the Christian referances are there, and need to be understood to grasp the end. Neo dies. When Smith absorbs him, he has all Neos attriutes. It also gives the Source a direct line into Smith, since it was plugged into Neo. The ending implies Neo will return someday, just like Christ will. Thats a simplified answer, but Im out of time here... "


    This is exactly my point. Interpretations, having to know your bible etc. Sorry, but when I see a movie, I need to be told things and not assume things. I assume Neo is dead, and although I am dead set against another Matrix and they W bros. have gone on record saying that there will be no more, I expected a more conclusive ending (especially as at the end of revolutions it states "to be CONCLUDED")
    What happened to the Matrix? only interpretations not conclusion.
    What happened to Neo? Only inerpretations
    What happened to the people still plugged into the Matrix? Why did Smith die, was it because of the Oracle, or because of the fact that one cannot exist without the other? again assumptions. If Neo knew what he had to do then why could he not share it with the audience?
    Far too many open ends and only assumptions to guess what did happen. Like I say, I wanted conclustion not questions.
     
  5. The_Scream_Man

    The_Scream_Man Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    May 1, 2000
    I prefer not to be spponfed in this kind of film.


    What happened to the Matrix? It's still there, so there are still people in it, otherwise it wouldnt be there. So yes, people are plugged in. Thats logical. What happens to these people? They are given the choice to stay in the Matrix or leave it. The Oracle says so. What the choices of a Billion people or more are, Ill happily just leave up to the imagination.

    Did Neo die? Yes. Again, in keeping with the biblical tone the brothers established, he did. While its not out and out stated, we see him lying there looking pretty dead, after having been taken over by Smith.

    The Oracle did indeed have a part in Smiths death. When he absorbed her, she set him up. She fed him the vision of his 'future' and forced a confrontation that she believed Neo would win.




    When it comes down to it, the Oracle summed it up; Not everythign can be explained outright or can be accurately predicted. Its all about Faith and belief. And like all faith and belief, u have to accept it without knowing all the answers.

     
  6. Ender Sai

    Ender Sai Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Feb 18, 2001
    How they got there I don't know, but their purpose was to make the audience realise that not everythig from the Machine world was evil; They to are capable of compassion.

    Or, Craig, that the machines still had some attributes of their creators left over in a residual sense?


    sun above scorched clouds

    See the Final Renassiance films in the Animatrix.

    Interpretations, having to know your bible

    I'm not Christian, I don't read the Bible nor care for religion in my life, but even I got the messianic under- and overtones of Neo's existence! :eek:

    Sorry, but when I see a movie, I need to be told things and not assume things.

    Then really, you have the Matrix alone for that. The sequels are cerebral films the general public got tricked into seeing - kind of like a sci-fi Mulholland Drive, if you will. The films felt alot like anime films, and even of the first few William Gibson books, especially Neuromancer.

    Did Neo die? Yes. Again, in keeping with the biblical tone the brothers established, he did. While its not out and out stated, we see him lying there looking pretty dead, after having been taken over by Smith

    Not to mention the whole near crucifixion-style pose he adopted when he was in the machine city and plugged into the Matrix - arms spread wide, dying for others to live...

    (Should we refer to Neo as He, then? ;))

    E_S
     
  7. TheOzhaggis

    TheOzhaggis Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 1, 2000
    The sequels are cerebral films the general public got tricked into seeing

    Now see, I'm going to have to disagree there.

    What really happened was the original Matrix gave the W. Bros carte blanche to do what they liked, and the result was pretty much two self-indulgent, pretentious, and pretty tedious films that were trying to shove so much pseudo theo-philosophy into something that couldn't decide if it was scifi or martial arts.

    When the hero is killed in the manner of the crucifix ... you just know they're trying too hard.


    And how many damned times do we need to see a slow motion gunfight rip apart stone columns ?


     
  8. TheMysticForce

    TheMysticForce Jedi Youngling

    Registered:
    Oct 28, 2003
    Well, that's more response than I expected in such a short time, so I shall just have to address a few points in order.

    Scream:
    No, that made perfect sense. Neos power as "The One" had to come, in some way, form the being that in a sense 'created' them all in the Matrix; The Source. Much Like Jesus abilities were Gods power, Neos abilities used the Sources power. It made more sense to keep it vague, than to have any of the number of other theories Ive heard.


    All right, room to use imagination is a positive thing, as evidenced by the first Matrix and the SW OT. Perhaps I'm being pedantic, but I seem to remember the Architect stating to Neo in Reloaded that "Your life is the sum of an unbalanced equation inherent to the programming of the Matrix." This could be taken to mean that Neo's consciousness was defined by the Matrix - thereby implying that he is part machine and thus somehow connected to 'The Source'. Scream, I suspect, would support this view.

    However, my initial interpretation of this scene was that Neo's life - the way his consciousness has been inserted into the Matrix - was a product of the aforementioned equation. Thus, while plugged in he has a rather unique way of interfacing with the system, but while unplugged he remains a normal human. This is supported by the Architect's comment that "While the process has altered your consciousness, you remain irrevocably human." (emphasis mine) This statement also suggests that the final scene, in which Smith copies himself into Neo, is impossible. Therefore, one could see Revolutions as contradicting Reloaded.

    I am not saying that one reading or another is necessarily right, for to do so would itself contradict my assertion that individual imaginative reactions is a good thing. However, the willingness of Revolutions to ignore possible implications of the important scene in Reloaded mentioned above is disturbing.

    Scream:
    In the first 2 themes, it was stated that the first Matrixes were rejected because they were too perfect. Humanity didnt believe it. The architect program cannot grasp randomness. Thus, the oracle provides random aspects into the program to make it believable. Along the way, she came to love humanity.


    Granted.

    Scream:
    Those who want to be freed will be offered a choice, the rest can stay. We've already seen not everyone wants out.


    I agree that this seems logical, but there is no evidence in Revolutions to support such a fate.

    Scream:
    What ramifications? As far as the people of Zion know, Bane went nuts. Only Neo and Trinity know the truth, and they arent gonna be talking to people about it.


    If a computer program can assume human form, can the reverse occur? What does this suggest about the origins of the machines? What implications does this have for Neo?
    (I suspect the answers to these questions are no, nothing and intractable humanity.)

    Scream:
    It was a state in between the Matrix and the Real World. When Neo bridged the gap, it took his consciousness there to cope.


    Not my point. Why is this relevant?

    Scream:
    I didnt quite get why they're allowed to be there either. i assume it was a kind of....Zip Disk if u will. a Storage area for programs between the source and the Matrix. The Frenchman (Im not even goignt o try and spell his name) somehow controls this area, thought the train station.


    Precisely. Relevance?

    Scream:
    How they got there I don't know, but their purpose was to make the audience realise that not everythig from the Machine world was evil; They to are capable of compassion.


    An interesting thought. I think you may be right.

    Scream:
    Trinity was probably the first human to see the sun in hundreds of years. It took her breath away because she knew it.


    This returns to my prior comments on contradictions. If a source of solar power existed only a hovercraft's lift capacity above the lower atmosphere, it would seem more logical for the machines to send ships up to make use of this energy source. Why enslave huma
     
  9. The_Scream_Man

    The_Scream_Man Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    May 1, 2000
    Im so lost.

    Judd, come along tomorroe, and lets talk about it then. i get confused typing stuff out like this, im better in discussion.


    Oz: I disagree with your interpretation. I enjoyed both Reloaded and Revolutions immensely. i didnt find them gratuitous at all. And even if it was, the Wachowskies had total control of their creation, so it wasnt Warner Bros who told them what direction to take one way or the other.

    and the relgious oevrtones are there in the matrix as well. Linda did a paper on it IIRC
     
  10. TheOzhaggis

    TheOzhaggis Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 1, 2000
    Scream: the Wachowskies had total control of their creation, so it wasnt Warner Bros who told them what direction to take one way or the other

    My point entirely.

    Too much control, not enough restraint.


    "When forced to work within a strict framework the imagination is taxed to its utmost - and will produce its richest ideas. Given total freedom the work is likely to sprawl." - T.S.Eliot
     
  11. Ki-Bara-Mundi

    Ki-Bara-Mundi Jedi Master star 6

    Registered:
    Nov 27, 2000
    While I've read everything in this thread, I can't reply to it all without confusing myself and everyone else, so I'll just try replying to a few bits and peices. Here I go...

    Much Like Jesus abilities were Gods power, Neos abilities used the Sources power.

    Probably the best explaination I've heard/read. Got nothing to add, I just thought that was well put. :)

    However, my initial interpretation of this scene was that Neo's life - the way his consciousness has been inserted into the Matrix - was a product of the aforementioned equation. Thus, while plugged in he has a rather unique way of interfacing with the system, but while unplugged he remains a normal human. This is supported by the Architect's comment that "While the process has altered your consciousness, you remain irrevocably human." (emphasis mine) This statement also suggests that the final scene, in which Smith copies himself into Neo, is impossible. Therefore, one could see Revolutions as contradicting Reloaded.

    I thought the same thing about the Architect's statement. I wouldn't go so far as to say that Revolutions contradicts Reloaded, but I would have liked to have had the Architect and his interpretation of the One explained at least a little bit in this movie.

    Scream: Those who want to be freed will be offered a choice, the rest can stay. We've already seen not everyone wants out.

    Mystic: I agree that this seems logical, but there is no evidence in Revolutions to support such a fate.


    I'm pretty sure it's said outright at the end of the movie in the conversation between the Architect and the Oracle. My question is how the hell do you present that choice to people inside the Matrix? "Johnny, it's your 13th birthday, and this is a present I've wanted to give you for years. You see, existance as you know it has been generated in your mind by machines, and they want you to choose between living in the real world or in this world. Now I've got these pills here..." :eek:

    If a computer program can assume human form, can the reverse occur? What does this suggest about the origins of the machines? What implications does this have for Neo?

    Smith didn't assume human form, he was able to take over Bane's mind. Bane was hooked up to the Matrix, Smith copied himself onto Bane, the new Smith leaves the Matrix through the hard line, and in the real world he's basically taken over Bane's mind. It's all to do with the connection between body and mind (eg: you die in the Matrix, you die in reality).

    Scream: It was a state in between the Matrix and the Real World. When Neo bridged the gap, it took his consciousness there to cope.

    Mystic: Not my point. Why is this relevant?


    I'm not exactly sure what you're asking there, but I just assume that the Train Station was a place that programs went to if they wanted to escape deletion. Normally you'd get there via the Matrix (like Seraph, Trinity, and Morpheous did), but since Neo's gone bluetooth wireless, his consciousness jumped straight to the Train Station. The only way I can explain that is because of his connection with the Source. Why the Source took him there of all places is beyond me.

    If a source of solar power existed only a hovercraft's lift capacity above the lower atmosphere, it would seem more logical for the machines to send ships up to make use of this energy source. Why enslave humanity?

    Good point. I think it's revenge for what humanity did to machines. If you watch The Second Renaissance on the Animatrix DVD, you find out that humans treated machines very badly. So much so that a war broke out. To make a long story short, we tried to annihilate them (twice!), then they started using us for energy.

    Yet Smith is still a program and programs have to follow rules. This raises the question - Is Smith still a program?

    Smith is the opposite end of that unbalanced equation. What that means... no idea! ;)

    I'm getting the feel that the cgi elements drowned out the storyline.

    Compared to R
     
  12. Ender Sai

    Ender Sai Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Feb 18, 2001
    Basically, in Final Renaissance, the Humans blacked the sun out to destroy the machines source of power - solar power.


    E_S
     
  13. Dsource

    Dsource Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Jul 12, 2000
    just two points for the moment.
    the station was mobil ave.
    mobil is an anagram for limbo

    the best analogy ive heard for reloaded and revolutions is that they are like breast implants.

    the are both look kind of similar, attractive on the surface but arent so crash hot when you get to the middle of them. and they're nowhere near as good as the original.
     
  14. ROE_Biggs

    ROE_Biggs Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 29, 2002
    looking dead doesnt mean dead :D


    i have one word to sum up the movie.
    GAY!


    i did however llike the real world aspect
     
  15. TheMysticForce

    TheMysticForce Jedi Youngling

    Registered:
    Oct 28, 2003
    TheOzhaggis:
    Too much control, not enough restraint.


    On the surface this does seem to be the case, however I am beginning to wonder more and more whether the W. Bros filmed Reloaded and Revolutions as they did so as to result in widespread discussion - as we are now part of.

    For this idea I must credit Scream. For a movie to provoke so much post-credits debate it has to be at least thought provoking. Unless it breaks the thought provoking mold established in the prior two movies and is merely being discussed as an aberration.

    Either way I wouldn't hire Joel Silver as producer on another Trilogy any time soon.

    Ki:
    I thought the same thing about the Architect's statement. I wouldn't go so far as to say that Revolutions contradicts Reloaded, but I would have liked to have had the Architect and his interpretation of the One explained at least a little bit in this movie.


    I think the ending of Revolutions missed an opportunity to do this. I would like to think that the very interesting discussion between Neo and the Architect was more relevant than Revolutions made it out to be.

    Scream:
    Those who want to be freed will be offered a choice, the rest can stay. We've already seen not everyone wants out.

    Mystic:
    I agree that this seems logical, but there is no evidence in Revolutions to support such a fate.

    Ki:
    I'm pretty sure it's said outright at the end of the movie in the conversation between the Architect and the Oracle.


    I am thinking back to the ending and I do believe you may be right. It was rather brief though. Anyway, this seems to support the idea that humanity was just enslaved for revenge.

    On another note about the ending: I just realised that the Oracle's confidence of seeing Neo again ("Oh, I'm sure we'll be seeing him again soon") leaves one with the expectation of a return on behalf of a saviour figure who had just saved humanity, and kept 'evil' at bay for the time being, by sacrificing himself.

    The sun then rises.

    Good and evil coexist for now in a truce of undefined duration.

    One has to presume that for Neo to return the Matrix must continue to exist. Thus, the truth remains hidden from most of humanity.

    Am I the only one noticing that the parallels to religious symbolism here border on theology?

    Ki:
    Smith didn't assume human form, he was able to take over Bane's mind.


    Good point.

    Ki:
    I'm not exactly sure what you're asking there, but I just assume that the Train Station was a place that programs went to if they wanted to escape deletion. Normally you'd get there via the Matrix (like Seraph, Trinity, and Morpheous did), but since Neo's gone bluetooth wireless, his consciousness jumped straight to the Train Station. The only way I can explain that is because of his connection with the Source. Why the Source took him there of all places is beyond me.


    The Oracle explicitly states in Reloaded that exiled programs return to the Source - as an alternative to being deleted. Unless I have misinterpreted that discussion between the Oracle and Neo, the Train Station is not an integral part of the overall system. If the train man built it, one must ask why he did so and for whom. I'm sure there is a good explanation - it was just lacking from the film and that made the whole scene seem an irrelevant excuse to meet the Merovingian again.

    Ki:
    Good point. I think it's revenge for what humanity did to machines. If you watch The Second Renaissance on the Animatrix DVD, you find out that humans treated machines very badly. So much so that a war broke out. To make a long story short, we tried to annihilate them (twice!), then they started using us for energy.


    A very logical thought.

    Ki:
    Smith is the opposite end of that unbalanced equation. What that means... no idea! ;)


    No idea what that means either, but that's the most singularly eloquent answer I've seen to any question so far.

    Ki:
    They did promise us a conclusion and an end to the beginning, but I'm still filled with unanswered questions. They g
     
  16. Darth_Punk

    Darth_Punk Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 12, 2002
    On another note about the ending: I just realised that the Oracle's confidence of seeing Neo again ("Oh, I'm sure we'll be seeing him again soon")


    Exactly. Was there any need for this line? All it does is add confusion to the story. This is what I would call leaving a loose end. This implies that Neo might not be dead, and leaves it wide open for more things instead of conclusion.
    I really think that the Revolutions, where it should have given us answers left us with more questions, exactly like the X-Files movie, which advertising was something like the truth is here, which in actual fact when you saw the movie it left more un answered questions than answered questions.
    I expect to have to think about things, for instance with the Usual Suspects, but this is Sci-Fi at the end of the day, and really I would class myself as your average movie goer.
    I am do not try and over analize the movies I watch and put deep meaning into everything that everyone does, so therefore perhaps I need to be "Spoonfed" but I am sure I am not the only one.
    And again it leads me onto the end of Reloaded, with to be CONCLUDED at the end.


    I didnt think Revolutions was a bad film, just disapointed with the lack of answers at the end, and like I say I really dont have the time in my life to over analize the story on chatrooms, when in reality I should have known the answers at the end of the movie when I walk out.
     
  17. Teknobabel

    Teknobabel Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jun 4, 2000
    To quote from one review I read.......

    The final exchange between the Oracle and the Architect was one of the most bull**** "let's wrap it up fast" moments in the history of cinema. It went something like this....

    Oracle: It's you.
    Architect: Yeah. It's me. Happy?
    Oracle: Sure.
    Architect: How long do you think peace will last between us and the humans.
    Oracle: I dunno.
    Architect: Well, either way. If they get uppity again, we'll just stomp them out of existance.
    Oracle: What about the humans that are still plugged into the Matrix.
    Architect: Meh. They can go home.
    Oracle: Really?
    Architect: Yeah. We're switching over to Hydroelectric power. The whole thing was just a big misunderstanding.
    Oracle: Sweet.


    I can't think of a better way to put it than that.
     
  18. Kalor_Voe

    Kalor_Voe Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Jul 10, 2000
    Attention armed forces the world over: If the enemy begins to pull back, it means the entire war is over. Announce this to all your comrades and throw down your arms immediately.

    PEACE /= TRUCE!
     
  19. ROE_Biggs

    ROE_Biggs Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 29, 2002
    no sense i just did.
     
  20. Syrix_Kahl

    Syrix_Kahl Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 25, 2001
    I didn't like Revolutions as much as Reloaded. It wasn't what I was expecting. I think "bland" is the word I'm looking for. It certainly didn't offer any of the mind-probing questions of Reloaded, and other than the final Neo vs. Smith showndown, the action didn't really offer anything we hadn't seen before.

    If it wasn't for the sprinkling of ideas/themes (eg: Neo as Jesus) then Revolutions could easily be just another mindless Hollywood Blockbuster.

    Then again, maybe I need to watch all the movies again and see how they fit together, etc.
     
  21. TheMysticForce

    TheMysticForce Jedi Youngling

    Registered:
    Oct 28, 2003
    It seems like my original impression that responses to Revolutions are varied is, in fact, true - there are some people who just think it goes against the style of the previous Matrix films.

    This makes me wonder if the W. Bros were deliberately trying to challenge assumptions built up about what a Matrix film should be. If this is the case, then I have to say they are incredibly stupid - one does not make an art film where the situation calls for a blockbuster.
     
  22. Ki-Bara-Mundi

    Ki-Bara-Mundi Jedi Master star 6

    Registered:
    Nov 27, 2000
    I think the main thing that bugs me now is that they hardly addressed the whole issue of previous versions of the Matrix and how Zion's been destroyed before. I thought that was a huge revelation in Reloaded, and it certainly made for interesting speculation after seeing the movie with film geeks. For me it's the equivilant of having Vader reveal that he's Luke's father in ESB, and then only have Luke briefly mention it in ROTJ.
     
  23. Syrix_Kahl

    Syrix_Kahl Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 25, 2001
    Yeah.

    In addition I was thinking today about a few small things... The Ghost Twins, for example. Along with Persephone and Merv.

    Now I know we saw the later two in the movie at least. But I mean, We can assume that Smitch must have assimilated them at some point, right? I don't think he would give in without a fight of some sort.

    And stuff like that. It seems the more we think and talk about it, there's more stuff that's just been glossed over in exchange for a simple action film.
     
  24. Ki-Bara-Mundi

    Ki-Bara-Mundi Jedi Master star 6

    Registered:
    Nov 27, 2000
    Smith VS the Twins. Now there's something I would have liked to have seen.
     
  25. The_Scream_Man

    The_Scream_Man Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    May 1, 2000
    The Matrix Revolutions: the abridged script by Diego Doval










    INT: Inside the Hammer Hovercraft. We begin were Reloaded left off six months ago.





    CARRIE-ANNE MOSS
    Come on Keanu, wake up.





    SOME MEDICAL OFFICER
    His brain pattern looks as if he's jacked in to the Matrix. Even though it's ridiculous, since there is no way that could happen, that seems to be how things are. That's okay though: who even remembers that we're in a ship called the Hammer, if we only refer to it by name?





    CARRIE-ANNE MOSS
    I'm still worried about Keanu.





    SOME MEDICAL OFFICER
    Yeah. I would be too.




    They exhange SERIOUS GLANCES. The Medical officer leaves. Laurence Fishburne SHOWS UP.




    LAURENCE FISHBURNE
    Let's go see the Oracle. She's always fun.



    CARRIE-ANNE MOSS
    Ok.




    They go see THE ORACLE.






    INT: The Oracle's crappy apartment.




    The Oracle looks DIFFERENT. It's ANOTHER actress.




    CARRIE-ANNE MOSS
    Who are you? And where is Gloria Foster?



    NEW NEW ORACLE
    I am the eventuality of an anomaly...--- no, no. Strike that. I'm the Oracle, like Gloria Foster was, but there was some kind of thingamagic that turned me younger. Or I was deleted and subsequently rebooted. Or something.





    CARRIE-ANNE MOSS
    Ok. (doesn't believe her). Where is Neo?





    NEW NEW ORACLE
    Neo is in a train station. The train station is used by programs who want to escape from the Matrix.





    LAURENCE FISHBURNE
    What? And where do they go?





    NEW NEW ORACLE
    Beats me. But the Merovingian is involved, which is handy since his contract hasn't run out yet. So you have to go see him to a nightclub. This guy here (points to the Seraph) will go with you, since his contract hasn't run out either.





    LAURENCE FISHBURNE
    Ok.





    NEW NEW ORACLE
    Beware.





    LAURENCE FISHBURNE
    Why?





    NEW NEW ORACLE
    There will be lots of leather, plastic, and S&M stuff.






    INT: The train station. All white and clean. Kinda comfy.




    Keanu Reeves WAKES UP. There's a LITTLE GIRL standing NEXT TO HIM




    LITTLE GIRL
    Hi, I'm Sati. I am an all-powerful entity disguised as a child. This helps us pretend that this whole thing is still mysterious. Somehow.



    KEANU REEVES
    You're not as bad acting as that kid who played Anakin Skywalker in Star Wars Episode I, are you?





    LITTLE GIRL
    No.





    KEANU REEVES
    Yes you are.




    The little girl's FATHER shows up. Her MOTHER too.




    LITTLE GIRL'S FATHER
    Hey, long time no see.



    KEANU REEVES
    Do I know you?





    LITTLE GIRL'S FATHER
    Sure you do. I appeared for a split-second in Reloaded, remember?





    KEANU REEVES
    Ah, right. I remember you. (he doesn't).





    LITTLE GIRL'S FATHER
    I am a program, as is my wife. But we had a child anyway. Thought it would be fun. All you need is love, like John Lennon said. We are waiting for a train to let our child escape, and only she will go, but inexplicably we will get on the train with her. That aside, we are here for no particular reason.





    KEANU REEVES
    Cool.






    INT: Garage, the entrance to the Merovingian's club, ominously called Club Hell.




    SERAPH
    Although it looks like a nightclub, this is a heavily armed facility full of deadly programs. We're going to get through them anyway after fighting them upside down.



    They DO get through them. The upside down FIGHT looks COOL. They reach the MEROVINGIAN.




    CARRIE-ANNE MOSS
    Give us Keanu.



    MEROVINGIAN
    Ok. But you have to give me the eyes of the Oracle in exchange.





    LAURENCE FISHBURNE
    She's a program. It's all a simulation. How could I give you the eyes of a piece of software? Read the script goddamn it!





    MEROVINGIAN
    Oh, well, it was worth a try. Nevermind.




    Something HAPPENS. Carrie-Anne Moss gets the UPPER HAND. Apparently. She points a gun at the Merovingian but has 20 guns POINTED AT HER.




    CARRIE-ANNE MOSS
    I said, give us Keanu, or
     
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