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  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

Star Wars contradicts itself so much....

Discussion in 'Star Wars Community' started by use-the-force-luke, Dec 12, 2002.

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  1. royalguard96

    royalguard96 Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Aug 13, 2001
    My proof is in the New Essential Guide to Characters.

    Is that so? Hmm, let's see what the source has to say, shall we?

    "Some said he was Jaster Mereel, a journeyman proctor from Concord Dawn, who'd been exiled for killing a fellow officer. Others pegged him as an adult during the Clone Wars, fighting as one of the supercommandos on the planet Mandalore.
    The true facts, buried beneath a mountain of falsehoods, are that Boba Fett was an unaltered clone of his father, Jango."

    Here's another portion which mentions the ficitonal Jaster.

    "...Boba Fett became what he'd been bred and trained for. He possessed Jango's reflexes, Jango's ship, Slave 1, and a set of Mandalorian armor that had once belonged to Jaster Mereel, his father's mentor."



    So what do we learn from this source? That the true facts state Boba was a clone of Jango Fett, that Jaster Mereel was his father's mentor, and that one of the "falsehoods" circulating was that Boba WAS Jaster Mereel, which naturally isn't possible, since Mereel was actually Jango's mentor. Sorry Bib, looks like you'll have to come up with another source. But naturally, I'm sure I'm wrong and await your as-always correct reply.
     
  2. Bib Fortuna Twi'lek

    Bib Fortuna Twi'lek Jedi Youngling star 10

    Registered:
    Jul 9, 1999
    Jaster was the name of Jango's mentor, true, but Jaster was also an alias that Boba Fett took on while on Concord Dawn, probably to track a bounty anonymously. The real Jaster Mereel had died several years before. I think one of the Jango Fett comics goes into details about how Jango tracked down his mentor's killer.

    The entry does not state which stories about Fett's past are lies, so we cannot say for certain which ones the entry is referring to. Tales of the Bounty Hunters shows that the story is true. And since Jaster Mereel is obviously not his real name, it must be an alias.

    Since Boba got exiled from Concord Dawn after Episode 3 ("I could always go join the stormtroopers."), nothing about it conflicts with AOTC.
     
  3. Plo_Koen

    Plo_Koen Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    May 23, 2001
    EU: The first planet destroyed by the deathstar is Despayre.

    Movies: The first planet destroyed by the deathstar is Alderaan.


    surprise me...
     
  4. Bib Fortuna Twi'lek

    Bib Fortuna Twi'lek Jedi Youngling star 10

    Registered:
    Jul 9, 1999
    Despayre was a test firing. Once it was certain that the superlaser worked, Tarkin was able to show it off to the galaxy. Alderaan was the first "public" target, since no one knew about Despayre.

    Think of it like the end of Raiders of the Lost Ark. If the Nazis had simply brought the Ark to Hitler and opened it there and nothing happened, then heads would roll. If, however, they opened it themselves beforehand to make sure that they had the treasure they were seeking, then they could bring it to Berlin without fear. Of course, if they had brought it to Berlin, then Hitler would have melted with everyone else, but that's beside the point.

    The gunners had to be sure that the superlaser could blow up a planet-sized object before it could be publicly demonstrated. If the Death Star had showed up at Alderaan and the superlaser didn't work, the gunners and engineers would then be subject to the wrath of Vader and Tarkin, and it would have given the Alderaanians time to evacuate while they fixed the superlaser.
     
  5. royalguard96

    royalguard96 Jedi Knight star 5

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    Aug 13, 2001
    For what it's worth:

    "There's my world, which is the movies, and there's this other world that has been created, which I say is the parallel universe"
    - George Lucas on the EU
     
  6. Bib Fortuna Twi'lek

    Bib Fortuna Twi'lek Jedi Youngling star 10

    Registered:
    Jul 9, 1999
    Of course, that is really irrelevant to SW contradictions. Please only make relevant posts and don't try to fog the issue.
     
  7. royalguard96

    royalguard96 Jedi Knight star 5

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    Aug 13, 2001
    Well I did provide factual evidence that like it or not, points out an actual contradiction. I'm sorry if you can't deal with it.

    And my Lucas quote was shown to illustrate the movies operate along one plane of "reality" while everything else is on another.

    Perhaps when I can up my post count in the line by line threads, I'll be as enlightened.
     
  8. EmpressPalpatine

    EmpressPalpatine Jedi Youngling star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 31, 2001
    I love how convoluted the little "fixes" the LFL puts out to deal with the contradictions presented by the movies seem a lot like they will do or say anything to keep people buying their books...

    but then again, Parallel universes don't usually connect, unless you're trapped in a bad Trek episode...


    Please only make relevant posts and don't try to fog the issue.

    [face_laugh] Boy, I darn near choked reading that, and then I choked again when I realized he is serious.. man, the irony here is overwhelming...
     
  9. Bib Fortuna Twi'lek

    Bib Fortuna Twi'lek Jedi Youngling star 10

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    Jul 9, 1999
    It's amazing how many people don't know what the definition of parallel is. Parallel means two lines running in the same direction alongside each other, not getting close to one another, and not getting farther apart.

    ------------------->
    ------------------->
    Parallel

    <------------- ------------->

    Opposite

    Many people interpret Lucas' parallel quote to mean that they're opposite universes. They're not.

    royalguard, you haven't shown any contradictions yet. The Fett thing is well-known, and it's been around for years, even before we learned that he started out as a clone.

    Empresspalpatine, the topic of this thread is contradictions in the Star Wars universe. What Lucas thinks about the EU is completely irrelevant, and contributes nothing to this discussion.
     
  10. EmpressPalpatine

    EmpressPalpatine Jedi Youngling star 4

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    Mar 31, 2001
    It's amazing how many people don't know what the definition of parallel is. Parallel means two lines running in the same direction alongside each other, not getting close to one another, and not getting farther apart.

    Many people interpret Lucas' parallel quote to mean that they're opposite universes. They're not.


    exactly, Bibby, I think you almost got it. Luxcas knows exactly what parellel means. It means that the EU universe never intersects, crosses, touches, or has any impact on his Universe. a totally separate entity, not part of each other.

    boy, I knew there was a reason they made us take geometry in high school. [face_smile]
     
  11. Greesha

    Greesha Jedi Youngling star 3

    Registered:
    Mar 4, 2002
    [rant]
    This thread is sadly humorous. That people would spend so much time arguing over something so incredibly stupid! It's a FRICKIN MOVIE people! Sheesh!
    [/rant]
     
  12. Esplin9466

    Esplin9466 Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Oct 27, 2002
    Bib, I'm afraid EmpressPalpatine is correct in her definition. Still, 999 out of 1000 isn't bad. ;)
     
  13. Esplin9466

    Esplin9466 Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Oct 27, 2002
    Hang on a minute. Parallel can also mean:

    -To equal; to match; to correspond to.
    -To be parallel; to correspond; to be like.
    -Conformity continued through many particulars or in all essential points; resemblance; similarity.
    -To place or set so as to be parallel; to place so as to be parallel to, or to conform in direction with, something else.
    -To make to conform to something else in character, motive, aim, or the like.on a minute


    Courtesy of The2ndQuest. :)
     
  14. QuiGonTim

    QuiGonTim Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 29, 2002
    I have been following this thread for some time. And I have to say Bib has done an incredible job, taking on all challengers who think they can find contradictions that can't be logicaly explained. One man has taken all of you on. I tip my hat to him.

    Now if your still in need of a challenge, can anyone explain why Pando Boba has three different types of hands. The humanoid type you see on him, the furry claw that Obi-wan cuts off . and the flippers he has when he dances with Bea Arthur.

     
  15. Durwood

    Durwood Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    May 18, 2002
    While I'm not much of an EU fan (nothing against the stories themselves, I just think the actual writing is appallingly bad) Bib has done an admirable job of reconciling supposed contradictions.

    Something for some of you to keep in mind: Just because a source doesn't specifically say that B is true, it doesn't mean that taking A and C and arriving at B is invalid. It is acceptable to use logic and reasoning to take two facts and arrive at a third, unspecified fact. It's not fancy foot work or anything like that but completely acceptable argumentative technique.

    As for Lucas' comments, he has made it clear that he is in no way bound by the EU, and the official statement from Lucasfilm is that the movies take precedence over everything else. So anybody who thinks they've found a genuine contradiction between the EU and the films, well, it doesn't matter since the films always take precedence anyway.
     
  16. Bib Fortuna Twi'lek

    Bib Fortuna Twi'lek Jedi Youngling star 10

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    Jul 9, 1999
    Ponda Baba is a Quara, one of the two subspecies of Aqualish. That subspecies has fingered hands, and comprises about 10% of the Aqualish population. The remaining 90% are called Aquala, and they have flippered hands.

    The Aqualish dancing with Bea Arthur isn't Ponda, but rather some random Aquala.
     
  17. aguywithabiggun

    aguywithabiggun Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 27, 1999
    <<Every one of Bib's responses is either "No, it isnt," or ,"Whats wrong with that?">>

    No, it isnt.


    Sorry. Could't help myself. Please, continue. This is great.


     
  18. Plo_Koen

    Plo_Koen Jedi Padawan star 4

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    May 23, 2001
    What's the name of the "E.T." species and their planet?
     
  19. Bib Fortuna Twi'lek

    Bib Fortuna Twi'lek Jedi Youngling star 10

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    Jul 9, 1999
    They're called Eetees, and they're from the planet Ouch. :p

    But seriously, no one knows where they're from.
     
  20. Plo_Koen

    Plo_Koen Jedi Padawan star 4

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    May 23, 2001
    But the film E.T. is part of the SW canon, right?
     
  21. PMT99

    PMT99 Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    Nov 23, 2000
    "why owuld palpatine want anyone to know he is a Sith?"

    To give the Rebels a reason to oppose him and the Empire.
     
  22. Esplin9466

    Esplin9466 Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Oct 27, 2002
    >>"why owuld palpatine want anyone to know he is a Sith?"

    To give the Rebels a reason to oppose him and the Empire<<

    Why would he want to give the Rebels a reason to oppose him and his Empire? ?[face_plain] Besides, I think there's enough already.


    >>Um, just because our good buddy Dooku cuts Anakin's hand off in Episode II doesn't mean that the Emperor can't cut off Vader's replacement post-Battle of Yavin.<<

    And don't forget how Luke cuts it off again in SOTME. Dooku, Palpatine, Luke, Luke... Vader goes through right hands at an alarming rate.


    >>"Consider R2's jets."

    So they break in the 20 years between III and ANH. A lot of thinks break after 20 years. Or amybe someone removes them, possibly the people the C3P0 mentions in ANH was their previous owner.<<

    This was explained in The New Essential Guide to Characters under R2-D2. One of the several owners Artoo and Threepio had between Episodes III and IV removed the jets.
     
  23. Bib Fortuna Twi'lek

    Bib Fortuna Twi'lek Jedi Youngling star 10

    Registered:
    Jul 9, 1999
    The movie E.T. is not a part of the Star Wars canon, because it doesn't have a Star Wars label on it. There just happen to be some aliens in the Senate that look like a character from that movie.
     
  24. Plo_Koen

    Plo_Koen Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    May 23, 2001
    I beg to differ.

    See my comments on the E.T. issue here

    ;)
     
  25. Esplin9466

    Esplin9466 Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Oct 27, 2002
    This oughta clear up this E.T. topic:

    >>E.T. came from the GFFA to study Earth. He accidentally dropped a copy of a GFFA history book, "The Journal of the Whills" - a 9 chapter saga about a period a long time ago in his galaxy - in the hills of California. One day an aspiring movie director, George Lucas, is taking a hike and discovers an odd book written in some weird code. Eventually, after serious study of cryptography and linguistics he manages to decipher the alien language and then read what he considers to be an excellent story...exactly the kind of thing he's looking to do for a new movie. The rest is movie making history!

    Also in the book are genetic samples of Luke Skywalker, data disks containing the memories and personalities of C-3PO and R2-D2, along with schematics for the manufacture of lightsabers and droids. In preparation for the making of the Star Wars saga, two clones of Luke Skywalker are created, one is named Luke Skywalker, the other Mark Hamill. They are raised thinking they are identical cousins, yet Skywalker has memories implanted in him concerning the original Luke's exploits in the GFFA via a "Clockwork Orange"-type screening of Star Wars and TESB hundreds of times. The droids are recreated and given to Luke. After the TESB movie is released, Luke and Mark are given guest spots on the Muppet show. Therefore E.T. is real, the Muppet SHow episode is canon, and the history of Earth is canon.<<

    Courtesy of DarthKevin. You just can't argue with this logic. ;)

    By the way, E.T. wasn't from the planet Ouch, he was from the Green Planet, as stated in Universal's E.T. Adventure ride. Now, it just so happens that the Green Planet was a name from one of Lucas's original drafts. Coincidence? I don't think so. :)
     
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