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  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

ST Star Wars Episode 7 Plot Ideas

Discussion in 'Sequel Trilogy' started by DarthRuss, Oct 31, 2012.

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  1. bneg82

    bneg82 Jedi Knight

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    Dec 12, 2009
    I'm really really hoping for more but i think in the end the story will be your simple Hollywood plot line. Film starts bad guy kills people, good people find out about the bad guy, groups up to stop bad guy, bad guy twists their emotions to justify him killing people. The good guy in fighting starts, in fighting is fixed and everybody groups up again, travels to bad guy's base and kills him, the end. That is the one thing about not having George involved that scares me, George is a good word builder at a high level. I don't think JJ thinks from the big overall universe just a picture by picture basis. Hopefully Lucasfilm will help some of that.
     
  2. hamad138

    hamad138 Jedi Knight star 1

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    Feb 25, 2014
    Wtf Plaguies did harm the Medi Chlorians? How did he do that, thats hax....
     
  3. Echo Base

    Echo Base Jedi Master star 4

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    Jul 21, 2013
    Maybe it will be something as simple as following the plot established by the Matter of Britain (the King Arthur myths):

    In other words, in the prequels we have had the forefathers ruining Britain (Palpatine and Vader being very, very loosely analogous to Vortigern and Uther Pendragon).

    In the OT, the son realises he is the chosen one under the tutelage of a wise old wizard (Merlin/Obi-Wan - who had also prophesied the disaster that would befall the previous generation). When the son triumphs, Camelot/the New Republic is established.

    In the ST, the hero's nephew (Mordred) betrays him. (Of course, in some versions, Mordred is born of an incestuous relationship between Arthur and his sister Morgan Le Fey, which is analogous to Luke's OT relationship with Leia - sorry, that bit was just a little joke!!! ;) )

    Jests aside, a betrayal by a nephew would fit the few facts we know and tie in with Lucas' love for archetypes. Also, if the script rewrite was to ensure there was more focus on the Big Three, that would make sense as it would allow them to dwell on Luke at the peak of his powers and the glory of "Camelot"/the New Republic before the ambitious nephew brings it crashing down.

    Thoughts?
     
  4. Mystery Roach

    Mystery Roach Chosen One star 4

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    Mar 10, 2004
    bneg82 What the hell? I feel like I'm looking in a mirror!
     
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  5. DarkGingerJedi

    DarkGingerJedi Chosen One star 6

    Registered:
    Nov 21, 2012

    I would love a Once and Future King / King Arthur influence. Luke is like Merlin. Hunting for other new jedi. But is looking for a new King. A new true leader for the republic, to usher in a new camelot, golden era. Add in a love story, or betrayal too.
     
  6. Ace08

    Ace08 Jedi Master

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    May 24, 2002
    I'm hoping for something that strays completely away from "a simple Hollywood plot line".

    I think it would be fascinating to see Luke follow his dad's footsteps and turn to the darkside. It would definitely take a dramatic turn of events but every man has a boiling point...especially if you're a Skywalker.
     
  7. Echo Base

    Echo Base Jedi Master star 4

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    Jul 21, 2013
    Yes, that is another possibility. I am looking more at the downfall of the Camelot - in fact, we may never see its golden age on screen if we jump from the end of Jedi to the start of new turmoil. I doubt they will end the trilogy on a pessimistic note, though.
     
  8. DarkGingerJedi

    DarkGingerJedi Chosen One star 6

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    Nov 21, 2012
    I see it as possibly building to that golden age. It starts out still bleak. But by EP 9, the New Republic and New Jedi Order are finally established, finally ushering in a new era (that we never really truly see on screen during this saga)
     
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  9. Echo Base

    Echo Base Jedi Master star 4

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    Jul 21, 2013
    The most commercial film franchise of the lot? You won't get it, mate. :(
     
  10. Ace08

    Ace08 Jedi Master

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    May 24, 2002
    Maybe, maybe not. I have a ton of faith in Abrahms....you take a director that talented and put him in the sandbox universe he himself loves as much as most of us fans do, and I think we'll see great things.
     
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  11. Echo Base

    Echo Base Jedi Master star 4

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    Jul 21, 2013
    Hmmm. I have to confess I don't have that much faith in Abrams but, regardless of that, I am thinking more of Disney. They will want to play it safe with their multi-billion dollar investment and, "if it ain't break, don't fix it" so I think they will stick to the established formula. Also, if it is based on Lucas' ideas, it will be more of the pattern previously established,

    I *do* have a bit of hope based on those very old quotes that the sequel will be more about exploring philosophical ideas but ultimately, it will still be a Hollywood family blockbuster, so there is only so much they will do with that strand of it.
     
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  12. Ace08

    Ace08 Jedi Master

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    May 24, 2002
    I know in many ways Disney represents the worst things about Corporate America ....but I think there's also a large enough sample size to say they are capable of stepping the hell out of the way and letting creative minds do their thing. I think what they've done with the Marvel movies is proof of that.

    But yeah I guess a lot of it comes down to what you think of Abrahms. I always hated Star Trek growing up...but the Abrahms versions were great for me. I loved Super 8 as well. I think he "gets it" and I can't help but wonder what might have been if Abrahms would have done the prequels instead of Lucas.

    Next time you get a chance go back and watch the first of the 2 Abrahms Trek movies and focus on the scene where Kirk is born. You've got this crazy space battle going on, a woman going into labor in the most dire of circumstances....and all of it is strung together with great classical music in the background combined with the ultimate sacrifice from Kirk's father...no words necessary since all the emotions are pretty much already captured by the events leading up to the moment.

    Then compare that moment to Luke and Leia's birth. An awkward scene with a metal robot hovering over Padme uttering "OOOOO-BAH" followed by a horribly conceived spur of the moment naming of the kids that comes across as completely unbelievable. We are then fed the line that they are "losing her cause she's lost the will to live"

    Compare that train wreck of a scene to what Abrahms did in the Kirk birth and ask yourself....wouldn't it have been epic if those were the conditions were BOTH Luke/Leia were born AND Anakin turned to the dark side.

    I guess what I'm trying to say is I think that for better or worse (and a lot of this depends on your personal bias) Abrahms style is going to be completely different than Lucas'...and in my opinion that's a great thing since I'm one of those that thinks the Prequels are 3 of the worst movies ever made.
     
  13. JediJurist

    JediJurist Jedi Knight star 1

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    Apr 30, 2014
    With the Sith presumably erased after RoTJ, a New Republic is formed. Yet a new Jedi Council is not.

    Jedi are largely viewed as a threat to the New Republic since the elder statesmen know that Vader was once one on the greatest Jedi but turned to the dark side. To be safe and prevent another Jedi from turning into a dark lord again, Jedi training is banned.

    Luke reluctantly agrees to not train new Jedi and turns into a recluse a la Obi Wan. Even so, in his old age, he's taught a few Jedi tricks to his kid(s), Solos' kid(s), and /or their friends.

    A new Sith threat arises and the kids are forced into action before their training is complete because they are the only remnants of Jedi left in the universe, and the only ones remotely capable of defeating the new Sith threat.
     
  14. Echo Base

    Echo Base Jedi Master star 4

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    Jul 21, 2013
    Okay, yes I haven't seen any of the Marvel films so perhaps I am not in the best position to judge.

    I have seen new Trek though and I don't like it. In fact, my feelings towards the scene of Kirk's birth were the exact opposite of yours: I felt it was cliched to have the hero "born in the heat of battle" and emotionally overwrought. I respect your opinion though. :)

    The rest of the film was too frenetic for me with no pauses/breaks for moments of character development or intimacy and, like many people, I was repelled by the "war crime" ending where they open fire on Nero's ship. Technically, the use of handheld cameras and lens flare were overdone, IMHO, though admittedly he toned them back for the second film, so perhaps he has learnt his lesson there.
     
  15. Ace08

    Ace08 Jedi Master

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    May 24, 2002
    That's cool...to each their own. The fact the things you cited as negatives I found as wonderful tells me we are on opposite ends of the spectrum. I thought that Kirk birth scene was one of the best scenes I've ever seen in a Sci-Fi/Fantasy movie.

    Just curious....did you like the Prequels?
     
  16. Echo Base

    Echo Base Jedi Master star 4

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    Jul 21, 2013
    Hmmm..... Hard question. I disliked them when I first saw them but aspects of them have grown on me since that time. I was actually doing a writing course when Phantom Menace was released in the cinema, so all of Lucas' elementary mistakes stood out glaringly to me at that time and have always coloured my subsequent viewings of it.

    On balance, I think they are weak with some strong moments.

    Okay, out of curiousity, do you like the prequels? :)

    EDIT: To elaborate a bit more, some set pieces I thought *did* work well were

    a.) the opera scene, where Palpatine's discussion of Plagueis creating life is mirrored by the "sperm" dancing in the "egg" on stage,

    b.) the chilling scene of the mass production of an army on Kamino, with the chief cloner saying how they will be perfect soldiers because of their weak wills and ability to follow orders,

    c.) the follow-up scene at the end of Attack of the Clones where aforementioned army is boarding the proto-Star Destroyers whilst Palpatine and his advisors look on coldly

    d.) for sheer beauty and taking me back to the magic of the OT, the Bongo voyage through Naboo's core.

    EDIT 2: One more point about me probably being on the opposite end of the spectrum is that I still regard "Star Trek: The Motion Picture" as the best Trek film. For all of its wooden acting and the fact that I acnknowledge it is very much a "poor man's 2001" I found the symbolism beautiful and consider it to be a better film than Abrams' efforts. :)
     
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  17. Ace08

    Ace08 Jedi Master

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    May 24, 2002
    Other than the horrible acting, atrocious dialogue, constant awkward moments, screwing up of critical moments Star Wars have long been waiting to see on film (Twin's birth, Anakin's reason for falling), and the ill conceived plot.....yeah they were fantastic :) Don't even get me started on midichlorians.

    Not gonna lie...between those 3 train wrecks and Kingdom of the Crystal Skull I've lost all faith in Lucas. I was thrilled when Abrhams was named the director and it gives me hope these movies won't suck.

    I think the fascinating part of all this is the fact that it's becoming pretty clear that while everyone loved the OT...the fan base has become pretty split on the Prequels. Star Wars in general has become a pretty polarizing topic. The simple fact the fans argue amongst themselves about Canon, midichlorians, Jar Jar, and who shot who first....it tells me the more they follow the spirit of the OT, the more likely that a wider range of Star Wars fans will enjoy the movie.

    So selfishly I'm hoping for something completely new (and as far removed from Lucas' version as possible), I agree with your original statement that they may end up going "safe." I just hope it's OT "safe"...not PT "safe" :)
     
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  18. Echo Base

    Echo Base Jedi Master star 4

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    Jul 21, 2013
    Fair points but I wonder if the ST will redeem the PT in some way. For instance, some new twist on midichlorians that somehow puts them in a new light perhaps in relation to Plagueis' life experiments. I agree that there is a lot of work they would have to do to redeem them in the eyes of many fans, though.
     
  19. purplerain

    purplerain Jedi Knight star 4

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    Sep 14, 2013
    One thing that can be redeemed is the flawed Jedi Order. The ST can make it clear that it's a product of Jedi arrogance, not of bad writing and/or of GL's philosophy.
     
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  20. Echo Base

    Echo Base Jedi Master star 4

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    Jul 21, 2013
    Yes, if they want to do some political commentary, perhaps they can discuss the nature of the pros and cons of close ties between religion and the state. If anything, GL was too subtle in this regard and didn't bring the issue to the fore as much as he should have done.
     
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  21. Ace08

    Ace08 Jedi Master

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    May 24, 2002
    I see what you're saying, and it's possible the "concepts" might be redeemed...

    But outside of an eventual total reboot....nothing is going to redeem the quality of how all those awkward moments were delivered in the Prequels. I think it's pretty clear Lucas is an idea guy. He's great at creating universes and setting up the "sandbox" to play in....but he should be outlawed from ever writing specific dialogue or overseeing how scenes are delivered in the final product. In my eyes he's a great "architect"...but a below average writer and even worse director.
     
  22. Force Smuggler

    Force Smuggler Force Ghost star 7

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    Sep 2, 2012
    Well if the ST is bad then people might be forgiving of the PT. Maybe.
    Please make the NJO better than the OJO!
     
  23. Echo Base

    Echo Base Jedi Master star 4

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    Jul 21, 2013
    That I can agree with.

    I think Lucas is like Terry Nation in that regard: Terry came up with the idea of Blake's 7 but (most) of his episodes are very workmanlike. It took Chris Boucher to come along and really see the potential of the characters, their inter-relationships and develop the dialogue for which the show was renowned.

    Likewise with the Daleks. The idea of robotic mutants as an allegory for Nazis was a sound one, but most of Nation's early Doctor Who scripts are terrible to the point of being virtually unwatchable today.
     
  24. Ichthyocentaur

    Ichthyocentaur Jedi Padawan star 1

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    Apr 25, 2014

    How was Star Wars not a simple Hollywood plot line?

    It's taught as a literally textbook example of the Campbellian hero's journey, which is sort of the uber-archetype of Western fiction.

    Sometimes you don't need a complicated plot to make a great film.
     
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  25. Mystery Roach

    Mystery Roach Chosen One star 4

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    Mar 10, 2004
    If there's one part of a trilogy that can and maybe even should be "safe", it's the first part.
     
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