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Books A/V STAR WARS: ROGUE #$^$%&ING ONE: A STAR WARS STORY

Discussion in 'Literature' started by CooperTFN, Mar 12, 2015.

  1. BobaMatt

    BobaMatt TFN EU Staff star 7 VIP

    Registered:
    Aug 19, 2002
    What I'm talking about is there's a weird redundancy of design. I don't mind new species but it's odd to me to create a new species that's a lot like one that already exists instead of creating a new (often more prominent) character from that pre-existing species.
     
  2. CooperTFN

    CooperTFN TFN EU Staff Emeritus star 7 VIP

    Registered:
    Jul 8, 1999
    Oh, I'm sure they all look the same to you, huh? [face_shame_on_you]

    But seriously--if there can be seventy almost-human species, I don't mind there being more than one Ithorian-esque or head-tailed species.
     
  3. Taalcon

    Taalcon Chosen One star 4

    Registered:
    Jul 12, 1998
    "All those damn big-ear yodas." - Some human, probably.
    [​IMG][​IMG]
     
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  4. sidv88

    sidv88 Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Aug 22, 2005
    In the EU, in-universe characters mistook Yoda for a Lannik and Duros for Neimoidians as seen on Holonet news.

    Coleman Trebor: "They have Master Yoda's species listed as Lannik, and his midi-chlorian count at 4 million. That's just ridiculous!"

    Sent from my SGH-M919N using Tapatalk
     
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  5. Grey1

    Grey1 Host: 181st Imperial Discussion Group star 4 VIP

    Registered:
    Nov 21, 2000
    Gand pilot? On a Rogue mission? You've got really strange ideas.
     
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  6. Schwarma

    Schwarma Jedi Knight star 2

    Registered:
    Oct 30, 2012
    Agree. It was one of the things that bothered me about TFA. I don't think it would've harmed the movie if they'd put a few from the PT and OT in the background scenes, say at the cantina.
     
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  7. AdmiralNick22

    AdmiralNick22 Retired Fleet Admiral star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    May 28, 2003
    It's too soon to judge Rogue One based on alien diversity, specifically the potential mix of PT, OT, and ST species.

    We know that there are new species, plus the BTS confirms the presence of several Mon Calamarians. So we've got at least one OT species, though I fully expect to see more. Given the potential inclusion of Rebel leaders like Bail Organa, what stops them from using other known Rebels like Cham Syndulla? Or that they will include a handful of Sullustans?

    --Adm. Nick
     
  8. CooperTFN

    CooperTFN TFN EU Staff Emeritus star 7 VIP

    Registered:
    Jul 8, 1999
    Thrawn will have killed Cham by then. :p
     
  9. Taalcon

    Taalcon Chosen One star 4

    Registered:
    Jul 12, 1998
    Or, you know, maybe Saw did. You know, 'acceptable losses' and all that.
     
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  10. BobaMatt

    BobaMatt TFN EU Staff star 7 VIP

    Registered:
    Aug 19, 2002
    Again, this isn't super duper what I mean. I'm not worried about the introduction of new species so much as I am that if we're going to create a character with a craggy head and beady eyes who needs a breathmask to breathe oxygen, it might be a better idea to create a major Gand or Kel Dor character for the films rather than create another species just like them.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  11. AdmiralNick22

    AdmiralNick22 Retired Fleet Admiral star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    May 28, 2003
    I can sympathize to a degree, but this is a large Galaxy. The number of species we've seen should in reality be a scant fraction of the overall mix of aliens in the Known Galaxy. So from a rational standpoint, more aliens is logical.

    The real truth, most likely, is that for each movie the folks that run the various Creature Shops are more interested in developing new aliens. Can you blame them? How awesome would it be if the director picked your design and suddenly it went from some random concept drawing to a part of the Star Wars canon?

    Of course, if I were in charge (What, I'm not already?), I'd mandate that each movie hit an appropriate mix. Half familiar OT & PT species, half ST or new species. That way everyone wins!

    It's also gonna boil down to what characters/species are iconic to the writers & directors. Afterall, JJ Abrams included Ackbar and Nein Nuub because to him (as a fan), these represented iconic aliens that would fit in perfectly with the Resistance. Who's to say that Gareth Edwards doesn't have a Gand in the background cause he loved the bounty hunter scene in TESB?

    Time with tell!

    --Adm. Nick
     
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  12. BobaMatt

    BobaMatt TFN EU Staff star 7 VIP

    Registered:
    Aug 19, 2002
    For me it's less about having a mix as it is saying, "Hey, we've already got species that fit this description and don't have much in the way of canon development. Use them or go in a different direction."
     
  13. Havac

    Havac Former Moderator star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Sep 29, 2005
    Yeah, I haven't been impressed with the alien design overall, for either film so far. There are none that really stand out. Almost all of them just look like various forms of beige lump. I'd like to see more creativity, to make something that's visually distinctive, rather than just looking like a colorless version of an existing species (or a colorless blob with maybe some colorless hair glued on), which is what I think Matt is getting at. New aliens instead of just existing ones are great -- so why not make some that actually look new? Instead of an indistinct beige lump with a breath mask, why not, like, an alien with bright parrot feathers? Why not a big blue lizard with a beak? Why not a furry rodent alien with six arms and a weird mohawk hairdo? Why not a purple insect with six legs and four arms? Why not a bat-type alien with big wings and black fur? Why not a red-faced baboon man? Why not a huge cat-man with black-and-gray tiger stripes and a big lion mane that's all braided? Why not some tall thin angular alien with weird-jointed legs and arms?

    I'm talking about having original ideas, creating striking new designs, the way Wookiees, Aqualish, Rodians, Givin, Mon Cals, Twi'leks, Hutts, Dugs, Kel Dor, Nautolans, Zabraks, and whatever the hell Yoda is were originally striking. Go look at the behind-the-scenes features on AOTC and look at how much time the art team and Lucas spent on getting the look right for Dexter Jettster, a one-scene character -- the right combination of crest and pouchy throat and arms -- and all the different designs they threw away.

    Look at this collection of beige blobs:

    [​IMG]

    And look at this collection of weirdos:

    [​IMG]

    The prequel aliens really look like something. They look weird and creative and they stand out. The sequel aliens . . . don't. I mean, the featured aliens of TFA were Maz Kanata, who's basically just an orange prune -- she's the only alien design that really worked and even that was only barely -- Snoke, who's the world's most generic gray prune, and this dude:

    [​IMG]

    A beige melty-faced blob. Like, that's the guy you stick three rows back in the crowd at Jabba's palace. That shouldn't be the best work you can highlight. That's not an Admiral Ackbar, Jabba the Hutt, Greedo, Bib Fortuna, Sebulba-level featured design. It's not even a Bossk, Kit Fisto, or Garindan-level highlighted extra design. I'm just massively disappointed in the art department for the Disney movies so far.
     
  14. CT1138

    CT1138 Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 4, 2013
    I think the idea is they're trying to mimic the OT, which was mostly a collection of beige, grey, and faded colored aliens:
    [​IMG]

    I do agree, though, that the designs themselves could be more interesting. Lucas went in and found some of the wackiest Halloween masks to use for his OT aliens. I think the problem is they're trying to hard now. They're not keeping it simple. Sometimes simplicity is best. It reminds me of the Halloween films: as the movies went on, they tried more and more complex ideas with the costumes and kills, when what made the original great was a spray painted Kirk mask and a dirty old pair of mechanic's coveralls.
     
  15. Revanfan1

    Revanfan1 Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Jun 3, 2013

    I have to agree with you here. There's too much generic brown. If there's anything I dislike about TFA, it's that. I think Maz looks fantastic, honestly, but other than her there are no really exciting standouts. At least R1 has Bistan, who looks exciting and at least he's gray instead of brown or beige, I guess. But overall, there have not been any species that have been instant classics like I feel about Mon Calamari or Togruta or others.
     
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  16. The_Forgotten_Jedi

    The_Forgotten_Jedi Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    May 12, 2010
    Hopefully we do see some more varied or exotic alien designs in the next film. Still, I think there a couple new species that stand out: the Abednedo, Tarsunt, Dowutin, Frigosian, and Culisetto are the top five new species IMO. However, I would only put the Abednedo on par with species like the Mon Calamari, Twi'leks, and Togruta.
     
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  17. Revanfan1

    Revanfan1 Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Jun 3, 2013
    Abednedo aren't bad. Also, Sarco Plank at least has more color than the rest of the aliens.
     
  18. Todd the Jedi

    Todd the Jedi Mod and Loving Tyrant of SWTV, Lit, & Collecting star 6 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Oct 16, 2008
    All this just strengthens the case that it's criminal that Constable Zuvio was cut from TFA. [face_shame_on_you]
     
  19. jSarek

    jSarek VIP star 4 VIP

    Registered:
    Feb 18, 2005
    Either the lighting in that image is wonky, or the photo is faded. You've got a Duros (which, as we all know, is a character who is blue skinned with red eyes), a stark-white whatever-Tork-is, a green Rodian, a blue Cathar, and an ebony Dashade in that pic, but they're all too washed-out to tell.
     
  20. Dawud786

    Dawud786 Chosen One star 5

    Registered:
    Dec 28, 2006
    I just want to say I am super excited for the planet Jedha, and am really looking forward to seeing it on film and what they say... and the eventual expansion of it in the lore.

    Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk
     
  21. BobaMatt

    BobaMatt TFN EU Staff star 7 VIP

    Registered:
    Aug 19, 2002
    That's half of what I'm getting at. The other half is that we have so many cool aliens already that we only get to see one or two representatives of, most of those not particularly well fleshed out, and most of those not on the big screen, so if someone said, "I want to make a pilot that's kinda short and batlike from this brand new species..." I'd say, "That sounds like a Chadra-Fan, actually. Would it ruin anything for it to be a Chadra-Fan? That might be cool, to have a Chadra-Fan..."
     
  22. Vthuil

    Vthuil Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Jan 3, 2013
    But I can easily see someone responding to that with "it's a new movie, why not come up with a cool new design?" It'd be an easier argument to stomach if I didn't agree with Havac that most of the new designs have in fact been bland beige blobby things instead of cool, but it's not hard to understand why the creative people might be more interested in creating than in using continuity.
     
  23. BobaMatt

    BobaMatt TFN EU Staff star 7 VIP

    Registered:
    Aug 19, 2002
    ...yes, but if you're gonna create a little bat person, we've already got little bat people. Use the little bat people, or make a parrot person.
     
  24. Dawud786

    Dawud786 Chosen One star 5

    Registered:
    Dec 28, 2006
    How about sole evolutionary offshoot of Chadra-Fan. That's what the EU would do!

    Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk
     
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  25. Taalcon

    Taalcon Chosen One star 4

    Registered:
    Jul 12, 1998
    Thing is, often the designers are just designing the things they think are cool, without direction, and the filmmaker goes, "Yes, that one and that one look great. I want those." - rarely are they giving specific direction for background creatures.