Discussion in 'Star Wars And Film Music' started by Strilo, May 9, 2016.
More I listen the score, more I love it ...
I strongly believe that this is one of best compositions John Williams has made in a long time. Love this score.
There's about 40 seconds of original material in that medley of OT themes.
There's nothing wrong with that. Most of the best tracks in Star Wars are build ups and arrangements of other themes (see Leia's theme being developed and becoming Han Solo and the Princess in Empire Strikes Back).
The arrangement is what is new and what is so so good.
Agree to disagree?
Cuz Rey's theme, Kylo Ren's theme, March of the Resistance and the music for the Ahch-To island are all from the OT?
it's a cool moment in the film, and the music fits perfectly, but even the original music in this track is dubiously similar to some of JW's previous SW scores. This score suffers in its originality from how RJ had JW score the film. They foregoed a spotting session as traditional for Star Wars and RJ lined up a temp score of previous SW music for JW to draw inspiration from.
This is clearly the temp music RJ inserted at this moment for JW to score from. The scene in RoTS itself is basically a reversal of what happens in TLJ. Instead of Anakin dramatically walking in to the Separatist holdout and slaughtering them all, we get Luke dramatically walking into the Resistance holdout to save them. Good usage, but again, not very original.
You're concerned about 4 seconds of similarity? That happens all over every single film score composer's catalogue. It's just part of their overall style. Those moments are everywhere.
Fascinating. I wonder why RJ didn't do a spotting session with JW. But then again, doesn't JW usually write themes for the movies just based on reading the script (rather than watching a cut of the film)? If that was the case with TLJ, the lack of a spotting session (and its being supplanted by a JW-SW temp track) could explain some of the underscoring being unoriginal (though I'm not sure I agree it is that unoriginal), but I'm not sure it would explain the dearth of really memorable new themes. I for one really enjoyed a lot of the dramatic underscoring in TLJ. I have been listening to the titular track over and over again; it really sells the sheer power of Luke's actions in that moment for me. The movie feels so unlike other SW films at times and I think JW's music really captured that weirdness. I have been curious to know what JW and RJ's working relationship was like, and your point kind of confirms the hunch I had that they might not have worked particularly closely. Whereas Williams was so effusive with praise for JJ during the scoring of TFA, he's said literally nothing about Rian (though it might just be that his age has meant he's not able to do press anymore).
I'm not concerned, or bashing it, at all - I liked it, but I just don't think it was original - which I think a lot of us are hoping for when it comes to new Star Wars scores. I was only referring to "The Spark" - not the whole score. Though there are many "aha!" moments where you hear close similarities to the OT and PT scores, particularly the PT scores. I find enjoyment in picking those moments out.
For an example of an OT similarity, the Imperial March undertones in that bit from "The Spark" and the part from "The Rebellion is Reborn" that isn't Rose's theme or the Luke on Ach-To theme (two original themes) are obvious.
:48-1:38 should be very, very familiar after listening to "The Rebellion is Reborn"
Again though, I like this. I think it's an appropriate callback to the second film of the OT, this being the second film of the ST. It provides a sense of familiarity in a film that is challenging to accept for some long time Star Wars fans.
John Williams is a freaking genius and as I said, JW on a bad day is still J-effin'-W. I wouldn't crap on his work but TLJ is all quite derivative. TFA's score is one of the best things about it, it's full of original (for Star Wars) themes, and memorable ones at that - Kylo and Rei's themes are very worthy additions to the canon. I can't think of any new tunes in TLJ that pass the whistle test though.
The score isn't exactly the only aspect of the film that I feel short changed by, so maybe my judgement is a little clouded, I don't know.
Rose's theme, Luke's Ach-To theme and this Supremacy theme stood out to me as hummable/whistleable. I think people are misidentifying this as a theme for Holdo. It actually first appears in the track "The Supremacy" so I think it's a theme for the Mega Star Destroyer or even The First Order itself. It's also laced with the First Order motif we got from the Force Awakens which pops up a lot over the course of TLJ.
1:04 is where we first get it chronologically. I'll have to rewatch the film to see if it pops up when the Supremacy appears, which is before we get Holdo on screen.
Holdo's resolve -- perfection.
And battle of Crait ranks up with battle of both for me -- soundtrack wise
Sideshow Sound Theater score guide for The Last Jedi: