Superman Returns

Discussion in 'Star Wars And Film Music' started by General_Quenobi, May 15, 2006.

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  1. General_Quenobi Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Nov 11, 2004
    star 1
    Hello,

    This is the place to discuss the latest news and thoughts regarding the music in the upcoming Superman Returns movie. John Ottman is doing the score. However, the main fanfare is going to be used for the credits and throughout the movie from what I understand.

    I have heard the music on the full trailer and some of it sounds like it is really very beautiful and epic. Also, the tracking of the JW fanfare seemed cheap to me but i liked that they are not shying away from it and I do expect that it will be rerecorded for synching with cues and to match sound quality so as far as the soundtrack goes I'm not worried. However, the action cues are gonna be what can break this I think. Sure, the underscore and fanfare seem good so far, but action music can't just be the fanfare...so I hope they choose to opt for a melodic rather than percussive style that is repetitive ala Baldelt/Zimmer. Not that I don't think their material isn't enjoyable (sometimes) but I think consistancy is the key. You don't want a neo-JW-esque score mixed with something that sounds like POTC or LOTR action cues IMHO.

    Well, that's my 2 cents. Please post when updates come your way and if you feel your opinion is worthy of your time to write it.

    Peace. Out.

    GK edit: Sorry, only forum modreators can make threads "Official". And I thought we already had a new Superman thread going about a month ago, but I'm not spotting it. I'll leave this open in the meantime.
  2. Well_Of_Souls Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 26, 2001
    star 5
    Well, the trailer didn't actually use any Ottman music, so I wouldn't base my predictions for the score off of that.

    I'm very excited for this score, though, and I've been listening to the original a lot to get pumped for its release. Afterall, Superman is in my top 3 scores of all time.

    I have high hopes for this score and after reading various interviews with Ottman about the project, I think he can pull it off.

    EDIT: Also, Ottman is not only using Williams' Superman March but portions of the Love Theme, the Krypton Theme, and the Smallville Theme. There will also be new themes for Luthor and a more emotional theme for Supes.
  3. General_Quenobi Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Nov 11, 2004
    star 1
    I read he decided that the love theme wasn't going to be used because he thought it wasn't the right mood for the contemporary setting. I could have sworn only the fanfare was to be used. Also, the trailer didn't use his music? What was it from then?
  4. The-Tennis-Ball-Kid Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2004
    star 3
    The non-JW trailer music was from Brainstorm (Horner) and The Thin Red Line (Zimmer).


    Check out this report from soundtrack.net.




    ttbk
  5. General_Quenobi Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Nov 11, 2004
    star 1
    Thanks TTBK! That was awesome. I was surprised to hear that the proloque would be changed. However, maybe it will be for the best, after all it isn't the 80s so lets try something fresh, but like the report said faithful.

    I am glad that the other themes will be used also. It will help audiences connect to these new actors playing old familiar characters (something the Star Wars prequels could've used a little more of I think). That is cool that Don Williams (brother to John) played timpani for the Superman Returns score!
  6. Well_Of_Souls Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 26, 2001
    star 5
    I really hope that they still use an arrangement of the Main Title March in the prologue of the film. It just wouldn't feel like a Superman movie without it.
  7. mverta3 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Oct 7, 2003
    star 1
    Since we're talking about Superman music...

    This little sketch isn't for anything; just practicing. I did this yesterday afternoon after seeing that one shot from the Superman Returns trailer where he's looking down at the Earth.

    I got to thinking about Superman contemplating his life, and learning to accept his destiny, and I've always loved the Americana/Copland-esque music of the small farm town. Seques into the Main Title theme with a sligthly different build because... well, it's the return of Superman, right?

    Anyway, enjoy...

    Superman's Decision

    _Mike
  8. Mastadge Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 4, 1999
    star 7
    I don't care one way or the other about this score yet. If I love it in the film, or it gets great reviews, I'll check it out, but Ottman has yet to impress me at all. He writes serviceable but not exceptional scores and I've yet to hear one that's compelled me to go out and buy its score album.
  9. Zarm_Rkeeg Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jan 9, 2003
    star 3
    Very nice, Matt! I like! =D=
  10. Indiana_Fett Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 12, 2004
    star 4
    And he stole from James Horner.
  11. mverta3 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Oct 7, 2003
    star 1
    Was that supposed to be for me?

    _Mike
  12. Zarm_Rkeeg Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jan 9, 2003
    star 3
    Ummmm...

    Dang.

    Sithspawn.

    Shoot.

    [face_worried]

    Yes, Mike. It was.

    I blame cold medication (which I'm sure I must have taken sometime within the past year,) sattelite interference, and/or a spell-checker posessed by Satan. :oops:
  13. mverta3 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Oct 7, 2003
    star 1
    No worries...

    ...glad to hear you liked it, anyway!


    _Mike
  14. SWJaggy Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 9, 2003
    star 4
    Mike that is a good version. I'm listening to it now. It kind of has this "TAKEN" vibe to it while at the same time has that great Superman effect. Nice.
  15. Well_Of_Souls Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 26, 2001
    star 5
    Apparently this Thursday Soundtrack.net will have a "First Listen" with sound clips from Superman Returns.

    Just a heads-up.
  16. mverta3 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Oct 7, 2003
    star 1
    Heard it already; blows.

    _Mike
  17. Well_Of_Souls Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 26, 2001
    star 5
  18. mverta3 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Oct 7, 2003
    star 1
    If you're asking how I heard it, I know people in production (I created the first 'S' logo for the film).

    _Mike
  19. Well_Of_Souls Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 26, 2001
    star 5
    I was actually referring to how it "blows".
  20. Well_Of_Souls Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 26, 2001
    star 5
  21. mverta3 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Oct 7, 2003
    star 1
    Toldja. I love how the main titles are like 15 bpm too fast; classic Ottman. When you have no craft, you have no sensitivity to the fact that march tempos have a sweet spot where they're most rousing. Williams does, of course, which is why when you check the original Superman or Raiders marches, they're not particularly fast. Too fast and you ruin them; too slow and you ruin them. Like Ottman did. The only way you could possibly screw up a Williams cue and he did it.

    I was trying to think, talent-wise, if there were two better examples of "opposite ends of the spectrum" than Williams and Ottman. I almost said Williams and Zimmer, but Zimmer doesn't write his legendarily cheeseball music, his ghost writers do, so that doesn't count. A hack with a choir does not a classic filmscore make. You can go to a remote jungle in Africa and the natives will be humming Star Wars, but you can go to New York and put a shotgun to somebody's package and they still won't be able to sing you Spiderman, or X-Men, or X-Men 2, or X-Men 3, or King Kong, or any of the blockbusters all of whom have utterly forgettable, pos music.

    You should try that; ask one of your regular, non-musical (or musical, for that matter) friends to sing you Raiders of the Lost Ark. Then have them sing you X-Men or King Kong or Spiderman. You won't get a note. You can add to that: sing me anything from Superman Returns that isn't Williams...

    _Mike
  22. Emperor's Prize Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 17, 1999
    star 4
  23. Indiana_Fett Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 12, 2004
    star 4
    Embarassingly enough, the Island theme from King Kong (Newton Howard) reminds me of a theme from the first Pokemon movie.[face_worried]
  24. mverta3 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Oct 7, 2003
    star 1
    Don't worry.. lots of that was ghost written, too. A friend of mine was assisting him while that was going down - he was a last-minute replacement for Howard Shore, and he couldn't even be at most of the recording sessions. He was in Santa Monica with his ghost writers, still writing cues while the orchestra was recording up at Todd-AO in the valley under a different conductor. There was a tremendous amount of material to get done in a short time... that's a nightmarish, rough gig no matter how you cut it. I may not be the biggest JNH fan - he always does a "good" job, imo - but that's just one score you have to cut the guy slack on. Not that the audience knows that, of course... they just see one giant name up there 12 feet across, and the score is forgotten before the credits have finished rolling. It takes time to really do things right, and that's assuming you've got your craft together.

    _Mike
  25. Well_Of_Souls Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 26, 2001
    star 5
    Ok. So Williams should score every film that comes out then in order to get a "memorable" score, because that's all that matters as far as film music is concerned. If you can't hum it, it ain't worth a damn, huh?

    Oh, and those "pos" scores you mentioned? I hum them all the time, save for maybe the original X-Men.

    I'm sorry, but just because a score isn't necessarily hummable does not automatically make it a "pos". I enjoy Williams, yes, but he is not the be all end all of film music.

    And for the record, I enjoyed the Superman Returns clips. Bring on the album and bring on the movie. I must know nothing about music to have liked it, though (which isn't at all true), right? But, really, I don't give a damn.
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