Superman Returns

It's actually the Love Theme, but it is always called the Can You Read My Mind theme.

 

Does anyone know exactly why John Williams wasn't
chosen to make the new soundtrack instead of Ottman?
I've looked but haven't found anyone who knows why
he wasn't chosen to come back with the new movie.

 

I'm not sure why, but I could tell you that Williams' usual salary for a film might have something to do with it.

 

Ottman came close to overkill with that main theme during the film. Thankfully it's an enjoyable theme to listen to, otherwise...

I don't remember much from Ottman's original portions of the score, thought I do remember liking some parts that weren't Williams related. Though I can't remember what they were. I guess I can get the soundtrack.

 

http://latinoreview.com/films_2006/wb/superman/btssupermanscore.wmv

As for my earlier question about trumpets, that clip above kind of answers it. The orchestration calls for a mix I guess, as I see Bb's mostly and a cornet. I think there might be a C in there somewhere, but I think it's all Bb's.

Taking a listen, the orchestra performance is ok. There is definately a little magic missing from it, which I suspect comes from the dynamics more than anything else. There are small little things that come out of the color of the title that bother me, like a few snare hits. again, mostly conductor issues.

Looks like a pretty young leadership crowd. I'm not surprised the quality isn't quite there.

~JW

 

don williams??

and around the one minute mark is that a baritone right? at first i thought it was a wagner tuba.or is tit?

and the piece mmmmh well i didn't like the fact that it kind of rapidly moved away form the actual march statement to the love theme.

 

Well, now there are 4 movies where my favorite part is just the pleasure of seeing and hearing the opening titles in a big theatre, regardless of what the words actually say.

Singer dropped the ball, and Ottman just never had the skill to hold his ball in the first place.

 

I saw it today. The acting/animation was AMAZING. They followed the storyline and the love between Lois Lane and Superman very well. I just thought the Chorus was very repetitive.

 

That's because everything outside of Williams' original themes was forgettable.

 

I must say....truly awful. The only thing good about the music was anything by Williams that Ottman decided to use. I can't think of anything he wrote that I could hum right now.
He had a great opportunity here..and he blew it big time. The Plane Sequence could have been outstanding but....BORING!!

Never been a fan of Ottman..not even sure what he's done besides x-men 2( and Kamen's X-men score was better there also)..but this seals the deal for me.

A wasted opportunity.

 

I think the best parts of the score were the choral moments...other than that, nothing really stood out to me, besides the John Williams themes.

 

Ottman overused the Superman theme. Normally, I would have no problem with this, except for the fact that it was just the main title march on repeat. Listen to Superfeats. This is Superman Action Music. Ottman butchered the Love theme. I would have liked to hear March of the Villains as well.

 

Well I must be the very very very vocal minority in this forum. Despite being an ardent fan of William's score and the first two films in the series, I honestly think that Ottoman's updated and modernized, albeit less classical and more supporting than starring, score was a triumph.

I was happy that the score didn't try to just imitate Williams, but rather form its own score using only Williams' themes as a beginning point.

And yes the score is definitely not the stuff of concerts or possibly for listening raw without images, but the sheer raw emotive power of the score made the film work on many levels for me.

And the new Personal Theme for Superman (notably played when he's floating in space and listening to the sound of the earth), with those beautiful choirs, are equally on par with the original Williams cues. That cue alone made the whole experience of watching Superman Returns work for me.

I know a lot of people were expecting the score to be basically fanboy puppy love for Williams, but for me I really enjoyed the direction which Ottman took the score and frankly I think its far more suitable for the new film than the quirky, off-beat and cartoony score that played more to the strengths of Donner's directing and Reeve and Kidder's performances.

And the action cues, again not really listenable on their own, were amazing in terms of the support they gave to the action sequences in the film.

I also thought that Ottoman and Singer used the William's material appropriately and in appropriate sections...I always felt that the Superman theme was always severely over-repeated in the original films (again just my personal taste here).

 

NZPoe, you're not entirely in the minority. I too thought the score worked well in the film - it had it's share of problems, but it isn't anywhere near as bad as most people are making it out to be. In all honesty, Ottman was trying to fill some BIG shoes considering that the classic score is so iconic.

Of course Ottman's score won't become a classic, but it did it's job in the film and makes for a fun listen on CD as well. Although, I do agree with Indiana_Fett that the Superman theme was overused in the film, but I'm not sure why you think he "butchered" the love theme -- it may not have been quite as magical, but butchered is a pretty harsh word.

 

Exactly my feelings on the score, except I don't think the Superman theme was overused.

 

I'm listening to How Could You Leave Us? from the score, and I must say that it's a very beautiful piece.

 

Not overused, more...Just the same thing. The orginal score by Williams had the theme in variation, making it a joy to listen to, while Ottman just had the same thnig plazying every time.

 

I think "Memories," "Rough Flight," and "I Wanted You To Know" are excellent cues. Ottman certainly has talent. However... in general, the score is derivative and boring. He used the Superman theme well, but I would have liked the "march" in addition to the "fanfare." The love theme - not as "butchered" as it's made out to be, as the chord progression is actually unchanged except in the two fuller statements (which I quite like).

 

I'm not sure why, but I could tell you that Williams' usual salary for a film might have something to do with it.

The movie had a 260 million dollar budget and they'd worry about paying John William's salary? I seriously doubt it. Warner Brothers didn't mind paying Williams his salary on two Harry Potter films. And they had to pay him something anyway for reusing his themes from 1978, why not go ahead and hire him to do the whole thing? He's still actively
composing for major films. If there's two things I wouldn't skimp on for this film, it would be music and effects.

 

It may have been up to DSinger, who has worked with Ottman before. Williams said he felt emotional after Reeve's death and said he didn't want to score the film because of how much Routh looked like Reeve.

 

I think the biggest problem was that the Williams music didn't really fit with the movie Singer made. Most of the film was too dark and moody to earn the joyous heroism of the March, and the romance was so nonexistant between Supes and Lois that Can you Read My Mind (aka the love theme) wasn't really appropriate either.

Singer was way too concerned with being taken seriously and with beating the audience over the head with Christian symbolism. What he missed out on was the essence of Superman: FUN. Come on, it's the story of a guy who can fly and stop bullets. The idea that 'it sucks to have superpowers and be the only one who can save the world' is part, but not the main thrust of Superman (if Singer wanted to make a moody pic about 'aw, being not-human is hard' then he should've made X3).

 

The film was a flawed masterpiece. As for the score, it worked well in the film and it's an enjoyable album experience, but certainly not up to the standards set by Mr. Williams almost 30 years ago. But who was really expecting that to happen anyway?

I didn't think the Fanfare was overused, but I do wish Ottman had varied it's performace a little more. Almost every time we hear it it's exactly the same, aside from maybe the addition of a chorus. Superman's Personal Theme is good and to my ears memorable, as is Luthor's Theme. Ottman's handling of the Love Theme was well integrated as well, I thought, although it could have had more air time in my opinion.

My biggest complaints stem from Ottman's obvious lifting of ideas from James Horner's repertoire, especially the string motif heard near the end of "Rough Flight" as Supes is holding the wing. Listen to a minute and a half into "Samuel's Death" from Legends of the Fall and tell me they aren't pretty much identical. Also, moments in "How Could You Leave Us?" clearly show Horner's influence.

Overall, a decent score. I really enjoy the gentleness and grace on display in the music and the movie. That's definitely how I would describe the film itself: a gentle blockbuster.

 

And that response pretty much gives me all the more reason to stand by my opinion. But of course I shouldn't have expected a more intelligent rebuttal or response from a 15 year old.

 

Alright, so I played the Superman Theme from the 1978 film and the one from the 2006 film back to back. To my ears, they are the same tempo. I don't see how it's played fast in any way.