Saga Suspension of disbelief

Discussion in 'Star Wars Saga In-Depth' started by Oberst Hans Landa, Mar 1, 2014.

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  1. Oberst Hans Landa Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 12, 2014
    star 2
    We all know that there are a lot of movies out there that require you to suspend disbelief. However, I honestly do not think that that necessarily means that screenwriters and directors get carte blanche to do whatever they want and put just about anything in the movie, imo. Don't you guys think that some elements of the Star Wars universe are too over the top and way too far fetched, even if you suspend disbelief?

    For instance, I've always thought that the Empire being able to destroy an entire planet using the Death Star is a little bit non sensical. Like, really? An entire planet?

    I am a fan and all, but even I think that is pushing it a little bit.

    Any thoughts on the infamous Death Star's ray or on any other Star Wars element that pushes suspension of disbelief a little bit too far?
    Last edited by Oberst Hans Landa, Mar 1, 2014
  2. Garrett Atkins Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 11, 2013
    star 4
    Leia being Luke's sister suspends disbelief a bit.
    Pfluegermeister and Granger like this.
  3. CommanderDrenn Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 19, 2013
    star 4
    I suppose that's the disconnect between "Space Opera" and hard Science Fiction.
  4. Cushing's Admirer Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 8, 2006
    star 6
    Yeah, the forced black/white view. It's very annoying. The Empire/Sith ain't black and the Jedi/Rebels ain't white.
    Darth Dnej likes this.
  5. CommanderDrenn Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 19, 2013
    star 4
    It works a bit more for me with the Jedi being proverbially white, more so than the Rebels, because the Jedi are religious Monks, who train from a young age and follow a strict code. I really don't think that a whole faction can be proverbially white. It's like saying America was "white" and England was "black" in the Revolutionary War, for me. It just doesn't work.
  6. Cushing's Admirer Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 8, 2006
    star 6
    Straight up I absolutely agree about the DS 1 as well but it's because Tarkin should never have been made a plant-killer besides the unlikelihood thing. That was simply trying to blackwash him and it doesn't work for me.
  7. darth-sinister Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2001
    star 9
    You do know that the whole point of the Saga was about it being like a fairy tale, with simple and identifiable good and evil characters?
  8. Lulu_Mars Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 10, 2005
    star 1
    I agree with ds. Everything that happens in Star Wars is credible within the framework set up by Lucas. I have no trouble believing in it.
  9. Jedi_Apprentice Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 18, 2001
    star 3
    There are a lot of questionable occurences and coincidences in Star Wars. How far anyone chooses to suspend their disbelief is entirely up to them.

    Singling out the Death Star; let's see. It's quite huge. I don't know exactly how large it is, but Han compared it to a small moon. And there was a drawing somewhere around here where someone estimated it being at least the size of a couple of counties. And that's just the diameter. For the sake of argument, let's say that the Death Star is 50 miles across. Let's suppose that the primary weapon ran from one end to the other at or near the equator. You'd have a fifty mile tunnel for which any sort of concentrated ray or laser beam (comprised of radiation or any other type of focused energy) could be transfered, bounced, and magnified as many times as you'd want before being launched at a specific target. And, if you had multiple such points for which the laser to be intensified in this fashion before it meets with the other points, you'd have one heck of a destructive weapon. Is it enough to take out an entire planet? It would depend on the size of the planet as well as its elemental make-up. I'd say it's definitely possible, at the very least. Even if the tunnel were half that size (or less), you'd still have a very formidable weapon. In those terms, I can see why Admiral Motti may have thought it to be the ultimate power in the universe.
    Last edited by Jedi_Apprentice, Mar 1, 2014
  10. Sarge Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 4, 1998
    star 4
    I'm an engineer by training, so the Imperial walkers push my suspension of disbelief. They're mechanically and militarily impractical. But, seeing how cool it is to watch Wedge lasso it, I can live with it.
  11. Jedi_Apprentice Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 18, 2001
    star 3
  12. MOC Yak Face Moderator, Classic Trilogy

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jan 6, 2004
    star 4
    I recently started a thread on the extent to which a person's appreciation of the more 'fantasy' elements of the saga influences their opinion of various things that take place in the story. I think that many of the main points of debate arise because of the different takes on this. Some people are happier than others with the idea that because it's sci-fi / fantasy there shouldn't be such an emphasis on 'worldly' logic and reason. Without getting into it all again, the will of the force and its implications is a perfect case in point.
    Bail B. Baobab likes this.
  13. Darth Maul Apprentice Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2014
    star 4
    I agree. I've always seen SW as fantasy and not sci-fi, so I give it more leeway than something like 2001. I think when you see SW has an impact too. Seeing the OT as a kid, I wasn't thinking about logic, just getting lost in the story.
  14. Oberst Hans Landa Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 12, 2014
    star 2

    Would you elaborate on that? Sounds interesting.
  15. Iron_lord Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 6
    Irregular Webcomic discusses the issue:

    http://www.irregularwebcomic.net/160.html
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  16. Oberst Hans Landa Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 12, 2014
    star 2
  17. VadersLaMent Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Apr 3, 2002
    star 9
    *handwavium*Hypermatter
  18. fuzzbox77 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 31, 2008
    star 1

    Exactly.

    I'm all for the science fantasy/Space opera status SW has always had. For instance - Fairy tales have always dictated that anything is possible in the hundreds of years they have been told throughout the ages (Hans Christian-Anderson/Grimm and even Disney) mechanical, technological or story matter.

    In the case of the technological impact that SW has - that wouldn't be anything except (as Spielberg puts it) "This is not Science Fiction, it is Science Eventuality." And look how far we have come with weaponry, prosthesis and even animal/DNA based cloning.

    I never attempt to dissect a story at it is make believe. To dissect something like Star Wars is to take away what makes it great in the first place despite how some may see aspects of the story credibility. It's personal judgement.
    Darth Maul Apprentice likes this.
  19. darth-sinister Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jun 28, 2001
    star 9

    I'm going to guess that the problem is that they have those long legs which already makes them look unsteady as they walk. Not to mention the weight of the cockpit, the engines that run it and the space where any troops waiting inside, would be such that it wouldn't take much to topple it. That's why the story is that the Empire used it for intimidation purposes and not for practical reasons.
  20. Granger Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 1, 2012
    star 1
    I thought it was a little far fetched that after they just described how fighters will fly inside the Death Star and destroy it from within, everyone seems really impressed that Han is going to lead a strike team to blow up the shield generator. It just doesn't sound that dangerous compared to what they were just talking about.
  21. squir1y Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 1, 2003
    star 2
    "The thing I don't get about Princess Leia is her sovereignty. I mean, if you were her, wouldn't you be glad when Grand Moff Tarkin blew up Alderaan? I mean, you'd be queen at that point." - Randal
    "Her mom was dead before they blew up Alderaan, so wouldn't she be queen already?" - Dante
    "Ah the whole movie is flawed. Like that lightsaber stuff... you turn it on and it goes yey high. How does it know when to stop?" - Randal
    "Um... the Force?" - Dante
    "Man, that's your answer for everything." - Randal
  22. Sarge Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Oct 4, 1998
    star 4
    Yeah, that's right. If you compare a walker with vehicles that operate on wheels or treads, (or hypothetical anti-grav/hover tech), the walker will be much slower, more expensive, less stable, and a much bigger target for the amount of troops it can carry. I also believe they would require more maintenance and be more prone to combat damage - too many moving parts. Given a choice, I'd much rather cross a battlefield in something with a lower profile.
  23. The_Phantom_Calamari Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 10, 2011
    star 4
    I don't know. If you find yourself unable to get over the conceptual hurdle that is the Death Star, I'm not sure if Star Wars is exactly the right space opera for you.
  24. DarthBarrister Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 16, 2014
    star 1
    Putting aside the other issues you raised, when was the last time the Empire cared about the cost?
  25. Beezer Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 5, 2013
    star 4
    Heh heh... that's cute seeing people in here trying to apply real world physics to the Star Wars universe.... adorable!
    Doop and Oberst Hans Landa like this.
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