Discussion in 'Star Wars Saga In-Depth' started by DarthWolvo23, Mar 13, 2011.
Yeah. Good observations. Padme lives under the shadow of Palpatine, while Leia sorta lives under the shadow of Vader: Mother/Daughter and Master/Apprentice. And like I said, it's Palpatine who indignantly addresses the Senate before Amidala, claiming that "a tragedy has occurred", culminating in the blockading of Naboo via "the oppression of the Trade Federation"; as this oppressed figure is sat right next to him. Very ironic where the focus is in that line. There is actually a lot of this oppression in the PT, with Palpatine and without. Even Palpatine suffers it. A very sharp example occurs in a short scene between Sio Bibble and Nute Gunray, before the film wipes to the scene of Padme entering the cargo hold of her ship, on its way to Coruscant, where she confronts Bibble's (?) hologram message, and then comforts Anakin. Note Sio Bibble's hand as he verbally jousts with Nute Gunray: it's twitching. This is a pretty theatrical gesture; once you notice it, you can't not. The character is having to restrain himself from slapping Gunray or ripping his own face off. And it's not the only time in this film that an older male's hand twitches (check the scene of Palpatine and Amidala in Palpatine's apartment, when Amidala tells Palpatine she's returning to Naboo), nor is it the only time in the PT hand-twitching or nervous hand movements happen (some good examples can be found in AOTC, during the romance scenes in the outdoor scenes on Naboo). How appropriate, then, that the aged Sith characters, Tyranus and Sidious, who feel less constrained by the formalism of the Republic, and rules and procedures in general, shoot LIGHTNING from their FINGERTIPS. The bottled-up, frustrated energy of ALL the characters is, basically, shot through the hands of Tyranus, and especially, Sidious, in their confrontations with esteemed Jedi. The Sith release what other people keep inside, but (ironically) they ultimately trap themselves in the process.
I'm putting my chips on #1.
"Whenever you gamble, my friend, eventually, you lose."
Something I just noticed about Sidious arriving on Mustafar in Revenge of the Sith. Obi-Wan and Padme leave in a Nubian ship from the same platform that Sidious will arrive on (in an Imperial shuttle) shortly after. This could be a hint that Anakin has detatched from Obi-Wan, Padme, and the symbloic ship, his old loyalties and lover being replaced by The Emperor.
Definitely. Anakin severed all those ties with his past when he signed a deal with the devil. As those last and most important elements of his past (Obi-Wan, Padme, R2, and C-3PO) leave him in "hell" (Mustafar), the devil immediately comes in to replace them in the same place... both the physical place and a place in Anakin's heart/soul. The part when we see the shadow of Palpatine's shuttle pass over Anakin as he is lying by the lava river is chilling when viewed from that perspective.
Good points, I noticed that too.
Like I pointed out in my (masking/unmasking) post on page 2, Luke also of course inversely replaces the dark side and the Emperor in Vader in the OT.
Where Sidious takes Vader from "hell" where he was immolated, Luke takes him to cremation and "heaven". And on a very similar ship. I love this nature of Star Wars
Yes, I love how both of those trips that Anakin takes (with Palpatine in ROTS and with Luke in ROTJ) occur on the (almost) same type of shuttle.
Just throwing this one out there, before I hit the sack, and it's kinda connected to the little strand HD just started:
Threepio is tapped on the shoulder by the last Jedi to "deal" with Anakin in ROTJ and ROTS. Obi-Wan gives him a reassuring pat, or whatever, on Mustafar, as Threepio urges him to leave "this dreadful place", and in the final shot of ROTJ, right before the IRIS OUT, I think Luke has a hand on Threepio's shoulder? Someone should check whether it's the same shoulder, too. Pretty trivial detail; but sometimes, the trivial ones hit you "just so".
That's interesting. The ROTS moment feels like a "You're alright" to Threepio IMO. I don't have much to add, but I do like that the two Jedi in question pull Anakin in opposite directions spiritually.
Watching AOTC at the moment, and I noticed something about Beru. She serves them red drinks instead of the A New Hope blue. This is not the only time the red blue contrast is made, so it kinda stands out.
I've said this before but there are parallels in those scenes. Anakin, 19 and Luke, 19 sit at the same place on the table, but with a different camera angle. When their emotions cause them to get up and leave they are asked "Where are you going?". Anakin, wearing black, stubbornly states "To find my mother". Luke, wearing white, declares that he's going nowhere fast. It's a cool contrast.
Also about the Jango/Boba mirrors. There is a lot reversed in these AOTC and ESB scenes.
Firstly the good guy in AOTC tracks the bad guy, which is reversed in ESB. Both the Slave 1 and the Millenium Falcon move into asteroid belts to escape their pursuer. Jettisoned Star Destroyer junk helps the Millenium Falcon escape, where Obi-Wan uses jettisonned material to escape a missile. And the shot of the Millenium Falcon hiding on the Star Destroyer matches the shot of Obi-Wan's star-fighter hiding on an asteroid.
Cryo, perhaps you can explain the meaning you gather from this, you are far better at it than me...
Off the top of my head one of the things I always liked is how Palpatines shuttle at the end of ROTS is symbolic of the "angle of death" sort of thing. The way it shadows over anakin on the lava bank was a nice little touch.
Very tru, I don't think we will ever see another well connected saga again. Its a very artistic series that many will watch over & over
It really is amazing how to this day I can still find out things about the saga like the things in this thread that I have never even realized before. There truly is a unique brilliance to this Saga that you just dont ever see anywhere else in film. This kind of thing can only be done by George. Its totally all him.
There is so much great symbolism in Star Wars and, what's sad about it, hardly acknowledge by the public.
Don't know if it has been mentioned before, but I really like that Anakin halts at this moment and rethinks if he really wants to leave his mother when he is about to leave the "room".
I also like the vast Coruscant skyline behind Obi-Wan when he reveals to Padmé that Palaptine is behind "all of this".
Excellent observation! I love subtle little things like that too.
Am I crazy or is there a heart visible at their wedding?
If I am not crazy (and that's what I hope ), could this be intentional?
I mean...Hayden's height, Natalie's height, the formation of the branches and leaves...all a coincidence?
What do you think? Do I have to look for a doctor?
Some would have you think you are, but you are NOT.
This is the exact kind of stuff im talking about in my thread:
and exactly the kind of stuff being disscused in this thread:
And both of those threads are not at all the first of their kind on this site and many others.
There is a lot more going on in and throughout these films than people seem to want to give them credit/recognition for.
I see no heart, sorry.
I like to watch Star Wars in black & white, it gives it the 1950s noir look. Most people need the special effects & visuals to enjoy the films, but to watch the movies with no color really makes them look more classic. 6 films 1 story. The saga should have its own book.
Perhaps we'll know for sure when we see it in 3D.
I do this now too. It has its drawbacks, but it's still worth a try. For one thing, since the special effects don't beg to be seen, your eye notices different things like faces or sometimes details in the background that you normally don't notice. Another thing I've come to realize is that the prequels look very paint-by-numbers in color, by removing this everything looks more believable.
1.) Two pathes
2.) One way to go
3.) Turning away from light
The duel on Mustafar. A wasteland full of fire and lava everywhere, where the person (vader/anakin) who made a deal with the devil (Palpatine), must descend to hell and pay the conseqeunces for his pact-disfigurement, immolation, a burned, bald, face and trapped in a robot body for the rest of his life. He only meets his children as a cyborg, and their enemy. He is forced to serve the devil (emperor), until somehow he finds a way out (Luke begging him to turn to the good side), and salvation in the end (eternal life in Jedi heaven as sparkly glowy handsome younger version of himself with all his jedi buddies)! And hopefully his wife. Also, at the end of his life, he turns to the good spiritual side, the Force. He joined the darkside (ie, similar to demonic and the devil), in a deal to achieve a dark power to save his wife and possibly immortality.
He almost lost eternal life (sith can't get eternal life, only jedi can retain identites in the Force), as part of his pact with the Devil figure-the Emperor, for a temporary goal/desire, to save his wife, kind of like how people are eternally damned in these kinds of stories.
He remains trapped in his deal, as cyborg vader, and had a deep desire to be redeemed and get out. Similar to christian redemption, a person who did so many evil things like Vader turned to the light side of spiritual power and got eternal life in the end.
It's strikingly similar to faust and a pact with the devil.
Part of the consequences of his dark deal was the transformation, that he had to live with for the rest of his life. He also lost the deal and his wife died. Look below. Normal Vader/Anakin to cyborg Skywalker.
Darth Vader's helmet is just a helmet that Hayden Christensen's face was hiding under.
The greatest documentary on Star Wars that exists.