Spoilers TCW bonus material episode discussion (spoilers)

Discussion in 'Star Wars TV' started by KED12345, Mar 11, 2013.

  1. TheAvengerButton Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 11, 2011
    star 1
    Seeing as this could potentially be untrue, I am going to sit back and wait to see what comes of all this. If this is true, then I will officially be extremely angry.
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  2. hlc88 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 3, 2012
    star 4
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  3. Gallandro Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 8, 1998
    star 4
    Posted this in another thread but I think it applies to the "fan reaction being tepid" response from the Lucasfilm insider:

    I gotta love how Lucasfilm throws the fans under the bus, as if the response was tepid. Well, they did that to themselves, there was virtually no information about what was going to happen to the show post-Disney buyout. In fact most early reports were the show would simply move to Disney XD, so that really doesn't create a sense of urgency about the fate of the show. It wasn't until a few weeks before the cancellation that rumors began to circulate that the show was going to be dropped... that's when the fan response started.

    Hell, all one has to do is look at Star Trek Enterprise and Season 4. Paramount and UPN made it pretty clear early on in Season 3 that the show would likely NOT return for a fourth season due to ratings. Fans started a letter writing and internet campaign fairly quickly, and this was well before the advent of social media. Fan response finally came to a head with a "Save Enterprise" gathering outside of Paramount studios. Paramount relented and Enterprise completed its fourth season.

    Had Lucasfilm been more forthcoming about the fate of the show I'm sure the response would have been not so "tepid." Heck I have friends who regularly watch the show and were shocked to learn the show would not be returning to Cartoon Network. But Disney played this well, they want a Star Wars drought so people are itching for more Star Wars... stupid in this day of Star Wars being a part of the contemporary lexicon and a regular fixture on social media, but I'm sure some bean counter thinks this is the best way to drum up interest in the next installment.

    Yancy
  4. Jedi Master Chuck Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 19, 2013
    star 1
    Fan campaigns can definitely save a show given enough warning...I know, I've been a Chuck fan since season 1 XD We made it all the way to season 5 even though the show was on the chopping block at the end of season 2!



    Thank you cast / crew of Chuck and Subway! lol


    If it meant keeping Chuck, I really wouldn't mind seeing Jabba scarf down a few Chicken Teriyaki subs....
    Last edited by Jedi Master Chuck, Mar 23, 2013
  5. Asharak Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 23, 2003
    star 4
    They canceled TCW out of nowhere two weeks ago, despite claiming there were many stories left to tell and that the show was far from over in a bunch of interviews right before that. When were people suppose too have a chance to really react to this? Dave has time and time again given the impression we didn’t need to worry about the future of the show, what the hell? Tepid, I don’t feel particularly tepid right now.
  6. Gallandro Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 8, 1998
    star 4
    Yeah, if you don't tell the fans that there's a possibility the show might not return, or you stay mum on the future of the show and give vague hints that suggest all is well; "just be patient, we will make an announcement later," it's kind of hard to blame your fans for their "tepid" response. Most viewers are simply not that engaged or up to date on the latest rumblings over social media.

    Yancy
  7. KED12345 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 10, 2012
    star 4

    I agree this is suspicious, we know for a fact we were supposed to get the Clovis arc last season, there's one arc.

    We know of an arc with Fives and Trench, and another with now - supposedly - Bounty Hunters.

    There's no way in hell they're going to let Maul's story go unanswered. That's kinda, erm, major.

    Then we also know that most, if not all, of Season 6 was finished by the time of cancellation. What's the point of sweeping it all under the rug like that?

    Right now, as it stands, I'm calling BS on this report. Besides, why waste an entire arc if we're getting only two on Bounty Hunters? Why do we need a conclusion to Bane's storyline and not Maul's? Bane escapes, and he keeps on rolling, eventually making deals and bounties for the Empire. There's not much more to say, same with Aurra Sing. And Boba Fett? Odds are we're getting a Boba Fett spinoff movie. There's no need to flesh Boba out any more before that.
    Last edited by KED12345, Mar 23, 2013
  8. kubricklynch Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 10, 2012
    star 2
    Well, I think people hoping for 20-40 more episodes had their hopes way too high.
  9. Circular Logic SWTV Interview Host

    Game Host
    Member Since:
    Mar 3, 2013
    star 4
    Actually the report stated that an arc that would cover the fates of Cad Bane and Aurra Sing in Season 6 will be cancelled. So we will NOT see what becomes of these two in TCW (frankly I felt their fates were better left to EU or perhaps a Dark Times show, if that ever comes up). This leaves the possibility for a resolution to the fates of other characters like Rex, Fives, and perhaps Maul; although this report does seem very pessimistic about the chances at a proper resolution to the fates of Rex and Maul, the two characters whose fates I feel need to be revealed before the show ends. At this point we can probably expect only 10-12 episodes in the bonus content, and this is likely going to be disappointing unless these episodes really blow us away in concluding the series. I'm not holding my breath on that possibility.
    Last edited by Circular_Logic, Mar 23, 2013
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  10. Feng Shui Engine Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 24, 2013
    star 1
    Yeah, just two arcs is not a lot at all. And who's to say those arcs will be the ones to answer the questions fans have.
  11. Kualan Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 4, 2008
    star 4
    So the two arcs in question are the Clovis and Trench ones presumably. Which means only one arc from the "actual" Season 6 was completed at this point? Surprising to say the least.

    There is a very slim chance that, as they have all the recordings done, we'll have some kind of audiobook release of the other episodes, spruced up with some special effects. A mini Shadows of the Empire project - an audiobook, an accompanying comic and maybe novel tie-in, that sort of thing to tie up the Maul, Bane, Boba, etc arcs.
  12. KED12345 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 10, 2012
    star 4
    Wow, you're right. I totally misread that, thanks for the correction.
  13. quigonobi3 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 5, 2012
    star 1
    Will they show this on Disney XD or will we have to wait for the DVD release(and they are being a bit vague about that ) ? Out of the arcs i wanted to see was the Clovis arc and to see what happens to Rex(as he wasnt in Episode 3 alongside Cody). I love the comment about fan reaction being "tepid" this smacks to me being a sports fan of a head coach thats lost the loyalty of the entire team or as we say it here in the UK of a manger that lost the dressing room-i was totally livid even my mum was upset for me and she,s a non fan methinks they dont know their fans=((BTW if i wanted to vent my true feelings on this the mods would not be pleased with my language and they probably do to me what the jedi order did to Ashoka!!!
    Last edited by quigonobi3, Mar 23, 2013
  14. Darth_Harmon Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 4, 2005
    star 3
    While I was never in the 20-40 more episodes camp, I did believe that given how TCW production operates, we'd see at the very least four more arcs (about 18 episodes) not including the Clovis arc.

    I don't know, TF.N seems to have some good sources and some crappy sources. For example, remember this?


    http://theforce.net/topstory/story/The_Clone_Wars_Team_Reportedly_Being_Disbanded_150781.asp

    Then it was added that a different source stated that "fans should still expect to see the promised story arcs from The Clone Wars' canned sixth season". So it went from not seeing it at all, to definitely seeing it. Hmm.

    Now to me, "two more arcs" doesn't match up with what we know about production and doesn't quite fit with what the cast and crew has been telling us. Some are saying that the cancellation has been known about for a while internally, given the action figure line being cancelled. But Dave himself was working right up to the week of cancellation, with the voice actors even noting that they were in the studio just a week before.

    So I gotta wonder, at this time last year how much of season five was completed? Because whatever that answer is should give us a good idea of how much is completed right now. That mention of a near completed Boba Fett/Cad Bane arc is strange to me. I mean, if they poured the time and effort into nearly completing it, why not complete it?

    I'm gonna wait for an official statement, because this fan site info is very hit or miss.
    Last edited by Darth_Harmon, Mar 23, 2013
  15. Kualan Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 4, 2008
    star 4
    Remember that each episode's workload is done in "layers". So you have the guys who write it, then the guys who voice it, then the guys who build the character models/locations, then the guys who animate the scene, then the guys who sort the lighting, then the guys who do the sound editing, and then the final edit.

    So for all we know, they might have 22 episodes that have reached the final stage or two, with only the lighting and sound editing (let's say) needing to be done to bring a large number of episodes up to speed - that's the kind of stuff that can have a whole season's full of stuff done in the traditional between-seasons gap, it doesn't need to be done nine months in advance.

    But if those sound editors and lighting experts have been told "Don't report in next Monday", then those episodes don't get the final polish they need for airing. TFN's report even eludes to this, with talk of arcs like this Boba Fett being "almost done".

    The harsh reality is that no matter how close the episodes are to completion, if people have been laid off then there is nobody there to finish the job, hence we miss out on a lot of potential content.
  16. 07jonesj Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 16, 2010
    star 4
    Wasn't there are an article that claimed a skeleton crew was being kept on to finish things up? I can't remember where I read that...
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  17. Darth_Harmon Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 4, 2005
    star 3
    Though given the "layers" of production (which I am aware of, thanks to watching too many bonus features on CG animated shows/movies) wouldn't a skeleton crew be able to work on the finishing touches? I'm just thinking it would be very foolish to get to the final stage of production and then toss a full story arc in the trash.

    I don't doubt that some episodes were not that far along, and won't be completed, but again I gotta ask at this time last year, how much was completed? Was TCW crew really only finished with the Maul arc and the Onderon arc in March 2012 (given the teasers we saw around this time last year)?



    The RFR facebook page used the term "skeleton crew":
    #SaveTheCloneWars - We are learning that the creative team is being dismantled this week and a skeleton crew will remain to complete a few eps. We shared the bad news with our friends at Jedi News and they are, once again, being instrumental in getting the word out!
    Last edited by Darth_Harmon, Mar 23, 2013
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  18. Kualan Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 4, 2008
    star 4
    I'm with you 100% ; the decision to cut off production with at least an arc's worth of episodes almost done is stupid, and I imagine was a top-down decision from some Disney marketing "guru".

    It all depends on who is in this "skeleton crew". If it's just the editing team, then they're cutting together what they have with no new stuff coming in.

    Hopefully with stuff like this Boba arc being "almost done", a skeleton crew might be able to do something with it in time. Perhaps they're as uncertain as we are if they'll be able to in the time they have, hence this talk of only two "confirmed" arcs.

    But on the other hand, I wouldn't blame these guys if they didn't do any more than they had do, and just finish work on these confirmed arcs. The guys are being laid off, they're (rightfully so) not going to be feeling particularly motivated to throw anyone a bone.
  19. Darth_Harmon Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 4, 2005
    star 3
    Warning, lots of dates and numbers:

    Looking at some season 5 concept art, I'm seeing stuff for Revival dated April/May 2011 with the production code 426. Tipping Points has concept art dated January 2011, with the production code 418. Jumping ahead, Necessary Bond (final Young Jedi) episode is dated April 2011 (code 425) and Point of No Return (final D-Squad arc) has concept art dated July 2011 (code 507).

    So based on this, I have to wonder if at this time last year, they were already at the concepting stage for 3-4 arcs meant for season 6. And I also have to wonder how many episodes are left from the season 5 production season. Wookiepedia has D-Squad, Maul/Mandalore and Ahsoka Arrested arcs taking up the first eleven episodes of production season 5. Were episodes 12-26 of production season 5 completed? Or were they told to "wind down" before completing production season 5?

    Again, using past episodes to compare, production season 4 episodes 12-26 were Nightsisters arc episodes (12-14), Onderon (15-18), Clovis (19-21), Young Jedi (22-25) and Revival (26).

    Nightsisters arc episode Bounty (412) had concept art drawn up on November 2010 and the episode released March 2012. Revival (426) had concept art drawn up April 2011 and the final episode released September 2012 (August 2012 at Celebration).

    So comparing all that to production season 5, episode 512 should have been concepted around November 2011 and should be ready to release now (the Order 66 Trench stuff may be the 512-514 episodes, given their complete nature). 526 should have been at the concepting stage April 2012 and the episode would have been a late season 6 or early season 7 episode (could this be the Boba Fett/Cad Bane arc?).

    It should be noted, however, that the Clovis arc shows that this 16 month timeline between concept art and release isn't that reliable a time table to use as a way to predict what episodes we may see. The Clovis episodes appeared to be finished ages ago and still has yet to release. It would have been an early season 6 episode, despite the fact that episodes produced just after it were shown as early as August 2012 (Young Jedi teaser at Celebration).

    A Necessary Bond (425) had concept art being drawn up April 2011 and the episode was shown in a finished state in August 2012 (16 months), yet Clovis was probably being concepted just before or around April 2011 and it is March 2013 and we have still yet to see the episodes (nearly 2 years at 23 months!)

    ---

    So the real question is: from the concept art stage, how long does it take to complete an episode? Could an episode that has concept art being drawn up in April 2012 be completed by March/April 2013? If the answer is "yes", then we should have 15 unseen episodes completed (about 4 arcs) by now (not counting Clovis, which have long been ready for viewing). If the answer is "no", then the last few arcs of production season 5 are in jeopardy.

    Anybody know when Revival (426) was completed internally? Because that might be the key to knowing if 512-526 would be completed by now.

    Edit: It should be noted that in May 2012, Star Wars Weekends showed a season 5 trailer with completed footage from the Maul/Mandalore arc. These episodes were production season 501-503. So again, comparing last year to this year, it is possible that episode 526 is near complete or even complete right now in March 2013 given that in May 2012 Lucasfilm was showing completed clips from the equivalent to episodes 601-603. Basically, a month from now final footage from episodes beyond the 526 that I'm asking about would be in a finished state (though how complete is still the big question).
    Last edited by Darth_Harmon, Mar 23, 2013
  20. Dark Lord Tarkas Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 29, 2011
    star 4
    Two arcs? I wasn't as crushed as I might be that there wouldn't be anymore TCW in regular television season format because I assumed there was at least another season's worth of material we'd get another way. And I was really looking forward to some Obi-Wan/Anakin episodes with no Ahsoka. But just two arcs? That is some horribly depressing news. At least they're not wasting one of them on bounty hunters (sorry bounty hunter fans), but it's inevitable I'm going to be pissed about something. Virtually certain we'll never get anything on why Mother Talzin did everything she did or even a passing mention of Mortis. It will be outrageous if they never finish up Maul's story line. Bringing him back seems like much more of a waste now than when it seemed the show would last longer.
  21. 07jonesj Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 16, 2010
    star 4
    Don't be so pessimistic yet Tarkas, it's just a rumour, and unlike the one claiming the show was being cancelled, has only been seen on one site; TFN.
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  22. Darth_Harmon Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 4, 2005
    star 3
    I have to wonder if TF.N misheard the two arc rumor, and that Lucasfilm are only completing two arcs from production season 6, while episodes 512-526 are already completed. So there are more than two arc to be seen in the "bonus content", but two of the arcs are from production season six.

    Perhaps the Boba Fett/Cad Bane arc was meant to be around episode 608/609 and they are not completing it? I mean, like I said in my long post, in May of 2012 finished scenes from episodes 501-503 were being shown while the full episodes were finally released in January 2013.

    I just find it hard to believe that they only made it up to production season episode 518 by this point, given that last year we were seeing completed clips from episodes that would be eight out from the number TF.N is reporting.

    It makes more sense that they have up to 607 in the final stages now, rather than working on 518.
    Last edited by Darth_Harmon, Mar 23, 2013
  23. agentkrycek Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 4, 2012
    star 2
    Its really disapointing sitting through so many pointless episodes in Season 5 only to hear about the awesome storyarcs that will now never see the light of day. I was really looking forward to the Boba Fett/Cad Bane arc and the return of Aurra Sing. I guess not seeing Aurra's fate is a good thing though. There was always the chance she could have gotten the Adi Gallia/Even Piell treatment. And Bane now has the potential to appear in future solo movies.
  24. Ani501st Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 18, 2013
    star 3
    Same thing for me. In the interview of JAT in IGN does not give the impression that they are only 2 arcs so it's hard to believe that there will be only 2 arcs.
  25. Barriss_Coffee Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 29, 2003
    star 6
    @Darth_Harmon: Thanks for the analysis -- if we can determine what the production order codes are for the bonus content once those episodes are released, we'll probably have a good idea as to how much we're missing.

    Obviously production code does not necessarily = completion date, but it's something to work from regardless. And frankly at this point, I don't trust the news we're getting. Based on the rate they were finishing episodes over the last few years, they should have a lot more than two arcs completed (or 99.9% completed) at this point. Heck, the Clovis one has to be done.
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