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Technology Comparison

Discussion in 'Archive: Games' started by Kier_Nimmion, Jan 1, 2003.

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  1. Kier_Nimmion

    Kier_Nimmion Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Aug 9, 2000
    I found this on-line a few days ago, some of you may have seen it, but I think it's very interesting. This guy does an piece by piece comparison of both the PS2 and the Xbox.

    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    The CPU
    Of course, the Central Processing Unit, the heart of every computer or console. Most of the calculations take place here. The XBox has a Intel processor which runs at a clock-speed of 733MHz. That's a lot higher than the 300MHz at which the PS2 CPU is running. But does that make the CPU better? Not at all...
    Here's why the PS2 CPU (Emotion Engine) is a lot more powerful:

    -Data bus, cache memory as well as all registers are 128 bits on the PS2 CPU while the XBox CPU is 32 bits.
    -It has a max. performance of 6.2GFLOPS while the XBox CPU can only do a bit over 3 GFLOPS.
    -It incorporates two 64-bit integer units (IU) with a 128-bit SIMD multi-media command unit, two independent floating point vector calculation units (VU0, VU1), an MPEG 2 decoder circuit (Image Processing Unit/IPU) and high performance DMA controllers. Yes, this is all on the emotion engine itself.

    Okay now what does this mean? It means that the PS2 can handle heavier physics and 3D engines (and can do more accurate realistic visual effects like splashing water and explosions). It also means that the PS2 can handle a lot more sophisticated Artificial Intelligence programming so that you have intelligent human-like opponents. And with a floating point calculation performance of 6.2GFLOPS/second, the overall calculation performance of this new CPU matches that of a super computer. This is a completely new CPU architecture especially designed for sophisticated graphics and physics while the architecture of the XBox CPU is pretty old and simple (it's a little less powerful than a standard PentiumIII processor). The architecture of the Emotion Engine really is very sophisticated so I'm not going to explain it in detail here. But simply put the main advantage of the PS2 CPU is that it is subdivided into lots of other tiny powerful processors, all of them designed to do a special task and almost all of them can work independently from eachother. And another thing... the processor inside the box does not say "Pentium III" anywhere. It simply reads "Intel". The XBox's processor is NOT an Intel Pentium III, as Microsoft would have you believe, but in fact a Celeron II. It is a 700mhz Celeron, complete with 128kb of L2 cache (P3 coppermines actually have 256kb L2 cache), but overclocked to a 133mhz FSB, resulting in PIII/Celeron hybrid. What makes it a Celeron II is the fact that it is still using a Coppermine Core, with 8 way set associative L2 cache rather than your typical Celeron 4 way set Level 2 cache. What it ultimately comes down to is that this Coppermine core, which allows Microsoft to market the XBox as a PIII Coppermine, is about a 10% speed increase over the Celeron equivalent of this processor. Is the XBox CPU a Celeron? Not really. Is it a Pentium III CPU in the sense that everyone thinks of a PIII Coppermine? Nope. It's somewhere in between and while it is great to run standard applications and some PC games on the side, it's not a good thing to have it as a CPU in a gaming console...


    The Graphics Chip and VRAM
    This is where the images are rendered. The XBox uses an Nvidia Graphics Processing Unit running at 250MHz and the PS2 uses the Graphics Synthesizer running at 150MHz. Again, judging by these specs the XBox looks better. The XBox GPU has a few advantages (or maybe not) over the PS2 GS, for example:

    -The XBox GPU can do 125 million polygons (according to Microsoft) while the PS2 GS can only do 75million polygons
    -The XBox GPU has a max. resolution of 1920x1080 and the PS2 GS can do 1280x1024, the rest of the graphics chip will be comparable to NV-20 chip.

    There are alot of neat effects the XBox GPU can do with its hardware, but all those effects can be done by the Emotion Engine in software too (while the XBox' CPU is not powerful enough to do complex visual effe
     
  2. SirLancelot

    SirLancelot Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Jun 10, 2002
    maybe if i knew what a GFLOP is.....

    i dont know if its complete BS, but alot of the arguements do have basis. however when looking at things like the processor then the shear power advantage of the XBOX will shine through. although things like the data rate and bus speed do make a difference, the PS2 is still 1/3 of the XBOX in power. it would be me saying that my PII 266 is better then my PIV 2ghz siimply because it has a higher bus speed.
     
  3. Kier_Nimmion

    Kier_Nimmion Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Aug 9, 2000



    Mmmm, that's not what he's saying. Basically, he saying that the PS2 does more with what it has- more efficient use of hardware while as powerful as it is, the guys who write games for the Xbox are already running into limitations, even with optimized code.




     
  4. Rabid_Balding_Ewok

    Rabid_Balding_Ewok Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Aug 8, 2000
    >>>There are alot of neat effects the XBox GPU can do with its hardware, but all those effects can be done by the Emotion Engine in software too (while the XBox' CPU is not powerful enough to do complex visual effects in software). But the catch is that these advantages (talking about higher resolutions here) don't make a lot of difference on a TV screen, even on an HDTV screen the difference would be barely noticeable (when the console's hardware is used properly). So, is the XBox Graphics Processing Unit better than the PS2 GS? It doesn't look like it, the architecture of the PS2 GS looks far more advanced.<<<

    Haha, PS2 propaganda. :D Let's let the visuals speak for themselves shall we. ;)

    [image=http://www.bunkasha-games.com/image/screenshot/071.jpg] Xbox version [image=http://image.com.com/gamespot/images/2002/playstation2/wreckless/wreck_screen010.jpg] PS2 version
    [image=http://image.com.com/gamespot/images/screenshots/vgnews/010801/malice/malice_screen001.jpg] Xbox version. [image=http://image.com.com/gamespot/images/2002/playstation2/malice/malice_screen004.jpg] PS2 version.

    Gee, I wonder if the PS2's magical Emotion engine can handle these...

    [image=http://lucasarts.com/products/swkotor/images/screens/6.jpg] [image=http://www.xbox.com/cms/images/games/bruteforce/sim-bruteforce-0017.jpg]

    It's kind of funny that this guy is stateing that the PS2 is as powerful as the Xbox. When in fact the first generation Xbox games like Halo and DOA3 destroyed the graphics on second generation PS2 games. Now if the PS2 can do the same job in software mode that the Xbox does with it's hardware, then by all logic that should never have happened. In fact the PS2's second generation games should have looked much better then Halo yet they didn't. The PS2 is now in it's third generation of games and they still can't touch the graphical might of the first games like Halo.

    -----signature-----
    "Rabid Balding Ewok, you make me sick.
    If there was an enemies list, you'd be on mine."
    [face_devil] [face_laugh] [face_devil] [face_laugh] [face_devil] [face_laugh]

    :::*::(^^) :(^^) :::::::
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    : *:.l##/(*)# (*)\\:::::
    :::/##(###.00#)#I ::::
    ::(___/#*#(XXX)/__) ::
    ::/000{{{{www}}}}\:: Ewoks Will Eat You!
     
  5. portman_is_so_fine

    portman_is_so_fine Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Apr 28, 2002
    Hey Nimmion, do you own a Ps2 or a Xbox?
     
  6. obi_wan_kanathan

    obi_wan_kanathan Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    May 10, 2001
    I've seen both PS2 games and X-Box games and it's obvious that the X-Box is more powerful. Just look at the games.

    BTW, I own a PS2 and don't want to get an X-Box, so I'm not being bias.
     
  7. BoxOfficeMan

    BoxOfficeMan Jedi Youngling star 3

    Registered:
    Dec 26, 2002
    Hey balding Ewok, next time you make a comparison at least make sure that the links work.

    kthxbye
     
  8. Rabid_Balding_Ewok

    Rabid_Balding_Ewok Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Aug 8, 2000
    The purrdy pictures seem to work fine for me, BoxOfficeMan. Maybe your Co/\/\putaR is broke? :confused:

    Now if you can't see this then it's probably trouble on your end.
    [image=http://www.raceworx.com/funnypics/red_x.gif]
    kthxbye

    -----signature-----
    "Rabid Balding Ewok, you make me sick.
    If there was an enemies list, you'd be on mine."
    [face_devil] [face_laugh] [face_devil] [face_laugh] [face_devil] [face_laugh]

    :::*::(^^) :(^^) :::::::
    ::::::/::::^^:::::\ ::*::
    :::::/###-^^-##I :::::
    : *:.l##/(*)# (*)\\:::::
    :::/##(###.00#)#I ::::
    ::(___/#*#(XXX)/__) ::
    ::/000{{{{www}}}}\:: Ewoks Will Eat You!
     
  9. jp-30

    jp-30 Manager Emeritus star 10 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Dec 14, 2000
    RBE's Images work fine for me. Maybe it's your connection?
     
  10. Jirin_Raman

    Jirin_Raman Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Apr 6, 2002
    I saw this "information" posted on a Gamers.com board before----Of course, on a PS2 board. Now I bought an Xbox on Launch Day, and, just about 3 months ago, a PS2. The PS2 has some games that look good, but, as R_B_E stated, even the early Xbox games look head & shoulders above the latest PS2 games, visually. And I believe the Xbox offerings are just going to get better and better, visually. If we could get companies to stop doing straight ports from the PS2 version (**Cough**EA**Cough), then we'll be doing fine. I still believe that the games need to be fun, and not just a visual show, but let's not be naive, the Xbox hardware is much more powerful than the PS2's.
     
  11. Iwakura

    Iwakura Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Apr 2, 2001
    I think it doesn't matter which system is more powerful, when deciding on a console to buy the most important factor is which one currently has or is coming out with the games that you want to play. It doesn't do someone any good if they have this state of the art console, but can't find any games they like for it. So, what does it matter.
     
  12. LottDodd

    LottDodd Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Oct 4, 2002
    I own a DVD player
    I Own A CD Player
    That's why all I need for Gaming is my Gamecube... No space wasted on that other poop. Gamecube is truly superior and as it's library grows it only proves it. ALAS if only KOTOR would come out for the Cube... Maybe if I Just wait six month to a year like with Dead To Rights and Max Paine....
     
  13. Miin_Bodenna

    Miin_Bodenna Jedi Youngling star 3

    Registered:
    Feb 7, 2002
    No space wasted on that other poop. Gamecube is truly superior and as it's library grows it only proves it

    [face_laugh] [face_laugh] [face_laugh] [face_laugh] [face_laugh]

    The DVD player is there so you can have bigger better games. That's why once the really big Xbox games start to come out...Gamecube will be left out on the street.

    As GameCube superior...to PS2 yes.

    To Xbox...well, maybe when pigs can fly.
     
  14. Rabid_Balding_Ewok

    Rabid_Balding_Ewok Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Aug 8, 2000
    >>>I own a DVD player
    I Own A CD Player
    That's why all I need for Gaming is my Gamecube... No space wasted on that other poop. Gamecube is truly superior and as it's library grows it only proves it. ALAS if only KOTOR would come out for the Cube... Maybe if I Just wait six month to a year like with Dead To Rights and Max Paine....<<<

    [image=http://www.alcofielen.com/pics/forumpics/negative/picturemakesmoresense.jpg]
    No offense LottDodd but thats just plain dumb. Miyamoto was saying that crap back at E3 to try to build up the Gamecube. And it was just as stupid back then. Tell me how did that warped reasoning help out the N64.

    PSX = CD player and embraced by gamers and non-gamers. Huge library and tons of great games.

    N64 = No CD player, 7 decent titles and the joke of the console gamers world. How can this be? It was a pure gaming machine. It didn't play poop CD's, why was it not the ultimate gaming machine at the time?


    Hate to be the one to break it to you but Max Payne will not be on the Gamecube. It was passed over because of the way the Cube handles memory. And KOTOR will never be on the Gamecube. You know you wouldn't be so starved for games if you actually did some mulitplatform gaming. ;) One last thing asides from the Nintendo games the Cubes libary is not looking to impressive. And yes I have a Gamecube so it's not like I'm making some outlandish claim. But that is completely off topic, were talking hardware capabilities here, not software.

    -----signature-----
    "Rabid Balding Ewok, you make me sick.
    If there was an enemies list, you'd be on mine."
    [face_devil] [face_laugh] [face_devil] [face_laugh] [face_devil] [face_laugh]

    :::*::(^^) :(^^) :::::::
    ::::::/::::^^:::::\ ::*::
    :::::/###-^^-##I :::::
    : *:.l##/(*)# (*)\\:::::
    :::/##(###.00#)#I ::::
    ::(___/#*#(XXX)/__) ::
    ::/000{{{{www}}}}\:: Ewoks Will Eat You!
     
  15. Tobey-Wan

    Tobey-Wan Jedi Master star 9

    Registered:
    Jun 12, 2001
    Why do they let PS2 fanboys write these stupid things?

    The performance of the consoles speaks for itself: Xbox is tops.
     
  16. SirLancelot

    SirLancelot Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Jun 10, 2002
    prefered platform for gaming: PC

    prefered console for gaming: X-Box


    why is it that i prefer my computer? its still 3 times as powerful as the X-Box, plus i can surf the net on my cable modem, type, and play with more then 4 people at a time. plus the DVD, CD burner, and media players. it still beats any console

    i like the X-Box, because its just plain better. at least you can download things onto your X-Box such as replacment skins and add ons for games.
     
  17. portman_is_so_fine

    portman_is_so_fine Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Apr 28, 2002
    I have a Xbox and Gamecube, too. I can speak for the library also. i only have four Gamecube games and I have 10 Xbox games. but yes this isn't about software so I'll say this, the Gamecube is pretty good, but not better than the Xbox.
     
  18. LottDodd

    LottDodd Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Oct 4, 2002
    I Admit the 64 was a disapointment. Between my friends and I we have all three systems and play them regularly. For sheer Enjoyment I've just got to go with Gamecube.

    I thought I saw Max PAyne while shopping this christmas... Maybe I didn't. I know I saw DOA, Hunter: The Reckonning and other X-box Exclusives. Plus Gamecube has won over Final Fantasy and Resident Evil after time... It will win over other "Exclusives" as well.

    Still I've known 3 PS2's to just break down over the year... I haven't had any bad experiences with the X-box... except the controller.

    And I don't have a broadband connection, why do I need to go online? Pay an extra 30 bucks a month... Plus membership fees per game...
     
  19. Rabid_Balding_Ewok

    Rabid_Balding_Ewok Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    Aug 8, 2000
    >>>I know I saw DOA<<<

    You saw DOA for the Gamecube? When you say DOA do you mean Dead Or Alive? If so then I strongly suggest you put the crack pipe down. :p :p :p

    -----signature-----
    "Rabid Balding Ewok, you make me sick.
    If there was an enemies list, you'd be on mine."
    [face_devil] [face_laugh] [face_devil] [face_laugh] [face_devil] [face_laugh]

    :::*::(^^) :(^^) :::::::
    ::::::/::::^^:::::\ ::*::
    :::::/###-^^-##I :::::
    : *:.l##/(*)# (*)\\:::::
    :::/##(###.00#)#I ::::
    ::(___/#*#(XXX)/__) ::
    ::/000{{{{www}}}}\:: Ewoks Will Eat You!
     
  20. Miin_Bodenna

    Miin_Bodenna Jedi Youngling star 3

    Registered:
    Feb 7, 2002
    And I don't have a broadband connection, why do I need to go online? Pay an extra 30 bucks a month... Plus membership fees per game...

    The 30$ is more then worth it for broadband, and no on-line plan pays membership fee's per game. For the Xbox it's only 50$ for the first year, and with that you get two fun game demos. The PS2 is free for now...but you need to buy the adapter.

    I haven't had any bad experiences with the X-box... except the controller

    If it's too big for your hands get the controller S.
     
  21. Kier_Nimmion

    Kier_Nimmion Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Aug 9, 2000


    Hey Nimmion, do you own a Ps2 or a Xbox?

    I own a PS2, though my primary gaming machine is my PC, but I wasn't posting it for 'Playstation propaganda' or anything like that, I just said it was interesting. I never even said he was right or wrong, nor have I compared games between the two very closely.


     
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