Tell me why half the Episode Two score is from Episode One

Discussion in 'Star Wars And Film Music' started by Grand Moff Lars, May 16, 2002.

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  1. Ekenobi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 4, 2002
    star 4
    There is 15 minutes of music, starting with Anakin and Padme arriving at Geonosis that was tracked directly from the TPM score

    How do you know this? Did you see them copy and paste it? It was on the soundtrack!!! JW recorded it. Geez! How does anyone know TPM music was cut right from the soundtrack. Non one. This is soo ridiculous!! The speeder chase is on the AOTC sound track. The droid factory. Was used from the speeder chase. Adn if some of you may have track 14 the bonus track was use in the drod factory as well.
  2. Ekenobi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 4, 2002
    star 4
    It seems like most of the latter half of the movie is either cues from Episode One or repeats of cues from earlier in the movie. Did anyone else notice? Why?

    Yes thank you. The first part of the droid factory was from the speeder chase. The second part is the bonus track. Track 14.
  3. Strilo Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Aug 6, 2001
    star 8
    There is 15 minutes of music, starting with Anakin and Padme arriving at Geonosis that was tracked directly from the TPM score

    How do you know this? Did you see them copy and paste it? It was on the soundtrack!!! JW recorded it. Geez! How does anyone know TPM music was cut right from the soundtrack. Non one. This is soo ridiculous!!


    Hey brilliant! The music I refer to is NOT on the AOTC soundtrack at all. Much of the score that Williams composed for AOTC is not on the CD. Two hour 20 minute film, 70 minutes of score represented on the AOTC CD. You do the math. That being said, the music I refer to was not recorded for AOTC. I know this because I have HEARD it. I know the TPM score like the back of my hand. Many MANY music scholars including our own TenorAprentice, who has a DEGREE in music, can also vouch for the music that was pulled from TPM, edited and chopped up and used for much of Reel 6 of AOTC. This is documented fact ekenobi. This is not just me spouting my opinions.

    Music from other points in the films has been tracked before. There is even a piece of ROTJ that was scored with a minute of music from TESB. But NEVER has it been done on this scale, with 15 full minutes of score coming from another film.

  4. Sithman Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 6, 1999
    star 7
    GK edit: Please limit your comments to the argument at hand, without getting personal. Thanks.

    As a final comment, I would like to add that either John Williams, George Lucas, Ben Burrt, or someone on the Lucasfilm team stated that they had always planned on using TPM music for much of the Geonosis segment anyways, because it was still in such an embryotic state when Johnny was writing and recording. I'll dig around for that quote and if anyone else can find that quote or link for me as well, that'd be great.
  5. Emperor's Prize Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 17, 1999
    star 4
    As a final comment, I would like to add that either John Williams, George Lucas, Ben Burrt, or someone on the Lucasfilm team stated that they had always planned on using TPM music for much of the Geonosis segment anyways, because it was still in such an embryotic state when Johnny was writing and recording. I'll dig around for that quote and if anyone else can find that quote or link for me as well, that'd be great.

    Confirmed: NO 'Lost' Battle Music for EPISODE II'

    The important quote from this article is:
    Matt Wood, the Supervising Sound Editor for Attack of the Clones, that the plan from the begining was to use music from The Phantom Menace for the 'Clone War' section of Reel 6. He said the Clone War was in such embryonic form when the film was turned over to John Williams that it was decided not to compose any original music for the sequence, but instead to track it with music from 'The Phantom Menace'.

  6. Sithman Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 6, 1999
    star 7
    Thank you very much!

    I looked all over Google for that yesterday and couldn't find it. Thank you! :D
  7. AdamBertocci Manager

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Feb 3, 2002
    star 7
    Thank you for that quote.

    I am now offering ten thousand dollars to anyone who brings me Matt Wood's head on a plate.
    EDIT: Okay, so it maybe wasn't his decision, but haven't ya ever heard of killing the messenger?

    I'd rather have John Williams singing in the shower than those TPM tracks. [face_plain]



    Rick McCallum loves you!
  8. Emperor's Prize Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 17, 1999
    star 4
    Thank you for that quote.
    No problem! That link was pretty valuable to me a few weeks back for a debate I had in a different forum. :D

    I'd rather have John Williams singing in the shower than those TPM tracks.
    Good point. But I think the real tough question is this:

    TPM tracks?
    or N'SYNC?

    [face_mischief]
  9. Strilo Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Aug 6, 2001
    star 8
    TPM tracks.

    or Adam singing in the shower.

  10. Emperor's Prize Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 17, 1999
    star 4
    Adam singing in the shower ... :confused:

    I may have missed it, if it was posted earlier on, but has anything been said about going back and re-scoring the portions of AOTC that used recycled music?
  11. Ekenobi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 4, 2002
    star 4
    The important quote from this article is:
    Matt Wood, the Supervising Sound Editor for Attack of the Clones, that the plan from the begining was to use music from The Phantom Menace for the 'Clone War' section of Reel 6. He said the Clone War was in such embryonic form when the film was turned over to John Williams that it was decided not to compose any original music for the sequence, but instead to track it with music from 'The Phantom Menace'.


    Thanks Prize. At least someone can show me proof and not just tell it is fact without backing that up. So that does nto mean half the Movie is from TPM then. But another question: Who the heck cares?
  12. Sithman Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 6, 1999
    star 7
    "Thanks Prize. At least someone can show me proof and not just tell it is fact without backing that up. So that does nto mean half the Movie is from TPM then. But another question: Who the heck cares?"


    I did mention it. I just couldn't find it. It was there.


    And as for your last comment: Evidently you care, or else you wouldn't make such a big fuss in here. Now that you've been proven wrong, please don't brush it off as though you don't care suddenly; it's obvious that you do care, but have been proven wrong and don't want to admit it. It's fairly obvious what you're doing, and it just comes off as slightly amusing that you think we'll all assume you don't care now that you've been proved wrong. It's okay, everyone's wrong at some point in time, buddy, you can admit that you were wrong and that you care. :)
  13. Ekenobi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 4, 2002
    star 4
    Hey I can admit that I was wrong but still, I do not care one way or the other what was done. Does not change how I feel about the movie one way or the other. nit picking is all this is.
  14. Strilo Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Aug 6, 2001
    star 8
    To me it seems kind of ... presumptuous to come into a MUSIC forum and say "who cares" to a thread where people are discussing the MUSIC. That's kind of the point of this forum and the kind of people who are going to be regulars in a music forum ARE going to care about this sort of thing. Oh and we're also gonna make it our business to know the music like the back of our hand, so next time try not to be so offensive in your posts disagreeing.

    15 minutes of film score from another film is NOT nitpicking. That is glaring, blatent and in your face. In all the films I have ever paid attention to the score, I have NEVER ONCE heard this type of thing being done on this scale. Complaining about 1 minute of music from Empire tracked into Jedi would be nitpicking. This is 15 damn minutes AND those scenes happen to be some of the best action scenes in the film. The opportunity for some awesome action score from John Williams was awesome. Instead we got a very badly hacked up and badly edited lift from TPM.

    As for the title of this thread, the original author was exaggerating. We know that half the score for AOTC was not from TPM. But we cannot change the title of the thread now.

  15. General Kenobi Administrator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Dec 31, 1998
    star 6
    But we cannot change the title of the thread now.

    I can.
  16. Sithman Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 6, 1999
    star 7
    TEH POWARRRR!!!!111!11!1 [face_shocked]


    \\bows and makes ewok noises\\
  17. General Kenobi Administrator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Dec 31, 1998
    star 6
    As well you should. :p


    Seriously, though, one of my dilemmas is what to do with thread titles that don't accurately describe the discussion contained within. I know this one does, albeit an exaggeration. If anyone feels a thread title should be changed, let me know.
  18. TenorAprentice Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 19, 2002
    star 4
    and with that....it dies.

    Good job!

    ;)

    so, perhaps I should start it up again. I know that this isn't exactly on topic, but it is related. My question is this: Obviously if music were tracked on and edited from Indy or Harry Potter, there would be some major issues (not to mention copyright junk). Now, knowing that SW is one story with 6 chapters, should that change what is "allowed" in terms of music sharing. I know that we all would prefer new music, and that is not the question. What I wonder is does the morality of using pre-existing music change because of the nature of SW?

    discuss....
  19. Strilo Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Aug 6, 2001
    star 8
    Perhaps we should change this one then, as it is a gross exaggeration. "Tell me why AOTC has 15 minutes of TPM score track in" perhaps?

  20. TenorAprentice Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jul 19, 2002
    star 4
    I like the tone it has....very in your face.

    and way to ignore my question, stri!
  21. CopernicusDent Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Dec 4, 2001
    star 2
    What I wonder is does the morality of using pre-existing music change because of the nature of SW?

    Yes, because nearly all of the Star Wars scores (all in the original trilogy anyway), is presented in the postmodern neo-romantic and chronologically-symphonic fashion that Williams designed and specified to be what Star Wars music is.
  22. chanster Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 9, 1999
    star 2
    Please music in Star Wars is almost as important as the images. The great god emperor Lucas has even said that. He butchered AOTC, he completly destroyed Williams' score and just used recycled stock music from TPM.

    Not only that, he took cues from the OT that were reserved for certain characters or powers and just trampled them (i.e. the machine belt scene). Its a sick joke.

    When will the apologists admit Lucas is wrong on somethings? Never.
  23. Ekenobi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 4, 2002
    star 4
    I do not think he was wrong or butchered anything. I felt the score was fine. This is one saga. Your are going to hear cues from other parts of the saga. If it was from another movie that was not SW then I would say that is not a good idea. .
  24. Strilo Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Aug 6, 2001
    star 8
    This is one saga. Your are going to hear cues from other parts of the saga.

    No other series of films has done anything like this, to my knowledge. Use of existing themes yes. Arranging the Force theme or Yoda's theme or the Trade Federation march for use specifically in AOTC was fine. Actually using the recordings from TPM, hacking them up and pasting them into AOTC... not fine. Especially not 15 minutes worth. Finish the damn film before it is scored. Everyone else can do this, why can't George?



  25. Ekenobi Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 4, 2002
    star 4
    I am sure he has his reasons.
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