Discussion in 'Lucasfilm Ltd. In-Depth Discussion' started by Doom Trooper, Jan 22, 2018.
I'm pretty sure it has not. Here is the still.
Shame it's never seen release. Would be great if it did someday on a new release. Maybe when Indy 5 is out we'll get new re-issues of the films with new features, which could well include never before released/seen deleted scenes?
I've always liked ToD. It is interesting and quite dark. The insect scenes never cease to amaze in terrifying. The ending bridge scenes are incredible. Always loved all the snakes and alligators too.
Scary to believe cults like the Thuggee ever existed too. That is creepy af. Surprising that Spielberg made a film so dark at that point in his career.
Back in the mid-80s the BBC programme Horizon did a feature on optical effects and matte paintings. It focused on a few films including TOD and Jedi. But in regards to TOD it looks at the mine cart chase and the rope bridge. The playlist is below.
That's awesome. Always enjoy watching vintage making-ofs like that and seeing how they pulled off effects back in the day.
Speaking of the bug chamber scene, what's the name of the big bug seen scaling the wall when Willie's in the chamber? You know, that big, armored one that's somewhat crab-like? Always thought that was one nasty, nightmare-inducing creature. Heck, the image of that bug alone is one of TOD's scariest images, IMO.
Wow, finally there is a TOD appreciation thread . It's also my favorite Indy movie BY FAR. I remember when it came out in summer 1984 I hadn't seen Raiders yet, so I rented a VHS copy just to get into the saga, a few days before watching TOD in the theater. I have to say I found Raiders somewhat underwhelming, never really got the huge hype for it. Then I watched TOD and was really blown away, maybe for the first time since first seeing ANH on the big screen. I think it was also the only time I remember when the audience in the theater actually applauded when the movie was over.
TOD has everything I'd expect from an Indiana Jones movie. I felt there is something missing both in Raiders and Crusade. Raiders was OK, but it just doesn't have that scope of a big adventure like TOD. Also it lacked the originality of Doom. I mean, there are probably thousands of movies where the Nazis are the enemy. But how many shows are there that have an ancient Indian cult sect led by a sorcerer with supernatural powers as the villain, and where human sacrifice is part of the religious ceremony? In an underground temple? Where children are enslaved? Digging for magic rocks that have the power to keep a village alive? Don't remember ever having seen anything like it.
Enough has already been written in this thread about how good TOD is. I don't really have much to add at this point, just that I agree with most of the other posts.
Just a few words on Crusade. While it wasn't strictly a bad movie per se, like TFA was, I think it fails in reproducing the sheer inventiveness, action, suspense, settings and sense of adventure of its predecessor. It often really feels like rehash of Raiders. Yet again the Nazis are the villains; yet again the main goal is to find an object from the Bible; yet again that treasure is found in a desert... in short, too many parallels! The sequel to TOD should have gone in a completely new direction, meaning set it in a new culture and leave the Nazis out for a change. Been there, done that, time to move on! In that respect Crystal Skull was OK, though it has too many other flaws for me to really enjoy it.
TOD, though not the first entry in the saga, for me is THE quintessential Indy adventure. It feels like in Raiders they were only practicing, and finally got it all right in the sequel.
@Sith Lord 2015, have you ever seen Gunga Din?
Nope. I admit I mostly grew up with films beginning from the mid-70s, haven't seen many from earlier eras, 2001 or Romeo & Juliet being exceptions. I'm sure that TOD was inspired by 40s 50s era adventure films. Still, as a teen in the 80s TOD looked pretty fresh to me. At least we don't get those tired old Nazis speaking fake German once again as in Raiders. And to be honest, as an agnostic I don't care that much for biblical artifacts anyway. Never read the Bible so never could get interested much in what is written there. I never before heard of the ark of the covenant so I never cared much if they'd find it or not, not even if the Nazis or the Americans got it. So an evil Indian sect acting in exciting subtropical environments appealed much more to my teenage self back in the 80s
If you can get into an old B&W film, I bet you'd enjoy it. Check it out if you can find it.
Good post Sith Lord 2015.
I actually consider Raiders to be the quintessential Indiana Jones movie, but Temple of Doom, despite being the darkest, is also the most accessible. You don’t really have to know anything about Indiana’s other life as a professor or anything about biblical references, it’s just a straight-up, boys’-own comic book fantasy adventure.
When I was a kid, there were bits in Raiders that I didn’t fully understand (I do now, as an adult) but TOD can be instantly followed and enjoyed. Its story is so simple.
I think what I love about TOD is the bonkers excess of it. The temple itself is amazing, and the mine cart chase is just one of THE best cinematic set pieces ever committed to film. It is wildly inventive, and the fact that it was made without an ounce of CGi is incredible.
I don't think it was in the film but I think it was clearly stated in the novelization that us 80s kids had access to. I read that book over and over.
I agree with near enough everything you say about TOD. You could watch them in chronological order and it doesn't matter about Indys background as they only briefly touch on it in anyway in TOD. Its a damn good adventure thats separate to anything else, which I suppose follows the James Bond formula (as it was back in the 80s) when every film could be watched in isolation without relying on the others.
Whilst Raiders remains my favourite Indy movie, TOD is still an action adventure movie of the highest order that few films reach in terms of quality.
Agreed. Tonally and structurally, it definitely stands apart from the others, but I have always considered it a kind of sister-piece to Raiders. A lot of fans regard TOD as the worst because of its more fantasy-based themes I think, but there is something magical about it for me. I love the now-iconic look of Indy towards the end in the one-sleeved shirt, playing up to the old matinee hero trope. I remember seeing a trailer on TV for it when I was just ten years old, and it showed the clip where Indy does the death-slide stunt from the catwalk right across the mine to land in the cart, and I was floored. I still am when I think of what a huge grin that sequence puts on my face.
Harrison Ford is at his physical here and the look is iconic. I love the swing across the wooden catwalks right before the death slide too.
I always thought the last 20-30 minutes of TOD were terrific. That scene on the bridge is a personal favorite of mine. The minecart scene is great too, and pretty much the entire climax is perfect executed.
Getting to that ending though...kind of a bumpy ride.
There is some great stuff (like the shoot out in the opening scene) but there is also some really bad stuff (I found Willie Scott and Short Round to be insufferably annoying).
Tonally, it was kind of all over the place too. Raiders is straight up adventure with some humor, and Last Crusade is definitely more comedic, but both films are fairly consistent all the way through. Temple of Doom has wacky moments of comedy, then gets SUPER dark, and can't quite find that balance. Well, both Lucas and Spielberg were going through divorces at the time and I guess it shows. They were a tad messed up emotionally, and the portrayal of Willie Scott is something I always found to be tied to what they were going through too. Women are annoying, screeching, self-centered banshees...at least that's how one feels when you've been hurt and you're going through a divorce.
But TOD is not a bad movie, and I can go back and watch it easily and not have a problem with it. Again, I have to sit through some bad stuff to get to the stuff I enjoy, but some film's are like that.
Do you think Indy is trying to save the Thuggee guard who gets pulled into the rock crusher?
It always seems to me like the guard sees his sash trapped and this has a last minute change of heart and Indy tries to stop him being pulled into the crusher, losing his sleeve then getting hauled up on the rope that he seems to try and use to help him.
I always thought he intended to use the guards weight as he’s dragged in to pull him up to the gantries above, at the same time Indy is slapping the guard down in an effort to stop him dragging Indy in with him.
It's my second favourite after Raiders. It's thoroughly entertaining and I like that that it does it's own thing instead of just copying the original.
I think Indy was trying to free the sash from around the guard and when that didn't work he took the up, up and away off the conveyor. 5:07 mark:
I’m sort of torn between your theory that Indy was simply trying to stop himself getting dragged in as well, and saving the guard.
Two words: heart scene.
Big fan of Temple of Doom, the opening may be my favourite Indy opening ever. One question, though, does anyone think that Indy's buddy who gets shot is, like, weirdly super-excited to die? "To the great adventure, Indy, I go first!"
Anyone know what type of bug this is?
So excellently put. You're right about how accessable TOD is despite being the darkest of the series. I like how it was a totally different type of adventure and didn't try to be Raiders 2.0 and it's the one that most embraces the pulpy roots of the character. In both ROTLA and TOD actually Indy is a somewhat mysterious character, you don't really know that much about him in either movie and in TOD it seemed they really tried to embrace the mythic aspects of his character, and it works. I'd like to see them go back to the Indy of the first two movies where he's more of a shadowy, rogue adventurer as opposed to someone bringing his family along for the ride in Indy 5.