PT [TFA Spoilers] Criticism of Anakin vs. Kylo Ren

I guess. It's a grave failing on her part though. Her remark there wasn't the point. She should've later sought help for him. Told his Jedi superiors what happened. Not offered a cliche & then forget about it. Maybe if she'd made the huge deal that the act deserved his eventual turn may've been averted. It was all up to her, she's the only one he told about the women & children (until Palpatine).

 

It's perfectly reasonable to think she may have thought the whole issue would have simply blown over. Not to mention that mentioning it would only grow more harrowing with each passing moment as they became more important (and romantically involved).

 

She hoped that his slaughter of women & children would...blow over? It's something that needed to be dealt with in the most serious way. She & the galaxy paid dearly for her sweeping it under the carpet.

 

Hey, I didn't say it was the right decision.

 

Ok but her approach wasn't perfectly reasonable IMO. It was naive, careless & unreasonable.

 

That's why it wasn't the right decision.

 

We discussed the no-judging attitude of Padme several times in another threads. As if this could help: he already knows that what he had done is bad, so why pointing out that? What he need is a supporting friend not a ‘high moral judge‘. Well he was fortunate to have Padme there.

Speaking of that, I don‘t want to judge Anakin here because I just don‘t want to be in his place. I would say in his place everyone will go mad. Kuro: what I see here, regarding to Sand people is a direct reference to Frank Herbert‘s Dune. There are Sand people there, and Arakis looks like Tattoine (or more precisely, Tattoine looks like Dune). But Herbert‘ Sand people no matter that are cruel and merciless enough, at least are in a primitive form of civilization. Lucas strongly implied-in the movies-that they are mindless, vicious beasts. We don‘t know who did that to Shmi, and why and more: what was exactly. She was beaten, but I only could imagine what more they did to her. Is not strange that Padme is not concerned about them but for Anakin.

 

It is largely about the plot needing the events of AOTC to happen or Anakin would take a LOT more coaxing by Palpatine to turn. As cynical as I'm being by saying that. I also find the dehumanising aspect of it being classed "less genocidal" (not that anyone directly said it like that) is a dangerous train of thought.

But in-universe I like that Anakin seems to have only told Padme and Palpatine. His two loyalties that he apparently trusts more than Obi-Wan. As Padme and Obi-Wan lose him Palpatine draws closer.

He even tells both Padme and Palps he will "do whatever (they) ask." in AOTC and ROTS.
When he says it to Padme it is fairly noble, and Anakin is respecting her decision. When he says it to Sidious he again thinks it is for Padme but this time it is becoming more for himself. That dialogue progression is interesting to me.

 

When you say "he knows what he's done is bad" it sounds like you're referring to a speeding ticket or that he cheated on a school test. He killed women, children & babies. He was unfortunate to have Padme there bcs all she offered him was a cliche line that she read once on a bumper sticker. Instead of arranging the serious intervention & counseling the whole incident demanded. Of course that sort of thing doesn't make for an entertaining movie. In the context of the films she should've at least informed the Jedi Council so they could deal with it. Instead she brushed it aside & married him. We know how that worked out for her.

 

The issue isn't that she should tell him that he did something wrong. It is that she should be a little more worried that he went kill crazy like this. Remember, Anakin isn't just anyone, he is a Jedi and thus he has access to powers that normal people don't have. So if he goes kill crazy he could do a lot more damage than an average person.
Plus there is the issue of the Dark Side of the Force. If Padme knows anything about that then she would have realized that what Anakin did was very dangerous.
So she shouldn't condemn him but she could and to me, should, have suggested that Anakin seek help and tell Obi-Wan about this.
She should not have swept this under the carpet and hoped that the problem would go away if she ignored it long enough.

And in RotS she shouldn't be as surprised because she knows that Anakin is perfectly capable of murdering children.

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It think you are totally wrong with what Lucas intended and I think the films directly proves you wrong.
First, the name, Sand PEOPLE. Not Sand monsters or Sand creatures, but people.
Second, the films clearly show that they are intelligent tool users, they have rifles, can make fire, domesticate animals, build huts and they show cunning when they ride in single file to hide their numbers. All of this is a clear sign that they are NOT mindless.
Third, when Anakin tells Padme about what he did, Lucas chooses to use human terms like, "the men, women and children." And not, "Males, females and young ones."
This was a deliberate choice and for a reason.

We don't know what they look like as we see only masks so how "human" they look is not clear.
They seem to have a language of sorts, sounds like grunts and yells but Wookie language is not that dissimilar.

To sum up, no the films don't support your version of the Sand people. At best only Cliegg Lars has a view like this but given his loss, his viewpoint is not likely to be unbiased.

They are not nice people no and do quite terrible things yes, but humans have done that too and at times even worse things.

As for the Dune reference, the difference there is that the Fremen are human. They have a harsh and somewhat unforgiving culture because Dune is such a harsh place.

In closing, example, say that Superman had done what Anakin did. Say that Superman's mother was taken by some gangbangers and killed. Superman came too late, goes nuts and kills all around him, men, women and children. And then he tells Lois Lane this.
Would she just brush it off?

I think not.
First, she would know that this was a huge departure from how Superman otherwise acts and could be worried about it.
Second, given Superman's awesome power, if he goes off like this it could lead to terrible destruction. Another reason to worry.
Third, Superman tends to obey the law and what he did here was second degree murder or manslaughter and he would normally turn himself in. If he doesn't here, then that is worrying.

Bye for now.
Old Stoneface

 

No one's giving him a pass at all. Those are bad deeds done by a badguy. Maybe as the badguy they should've had him only doing nice things. Wait...that doesn't make sense. I retract that.

 

I don't need to. I already know people including me have said there are no excuses or any "pass" for Kylo or Vader's evil actions. Since very few people think individuals just emerge from the womb as inherently evil we can look at reasons & circumstances that led to their downfalls. In the case of Ben Solo we have to guess & make alot of assumptions since we don't know his full backstory. In any case those reasons don't provide excuses, for either of them. I think I've said that a dozen or so times.