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  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

"That's not true! That's impossible!" vs "Somehow, I've always known"

Discussion in 'Classic Trilogy' started by AdamBertocci, Oct 21, 2003.

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  1. AdamBertocci

    AdamBertocci Manager Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

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    Feb 3, 2002
    Luke is clearly surprised by the fact that Vader's his father:
    "No. That's not true. That's IMPOSSIBLE!"

    Leia does not seem so surprised that Luke is her brother:
    "I know. Somehow, I've always known."

    What do you think explains the discrepancy in their recognition levels of their relatives?


    (1) Vader is evil and Luke could never imagine himself coming from such evil, therefore any subconscious thoughts he might have had on such a topic would have been dismissed as silly
    (2) Luke and Leia spent much more time together than Luke and Vader did; this gave Leia more time to sense something
    (3) The dark side clouds everything: Vader was (deliberately?) (accidentally?) not giving off that vibe
    (4) Hilarious comedic option that only peripherally relates to the topic at hand, available for people with nothing to contribute to the thread to choose and thus up their post count


    Discuss.


    Rick McCallum loves you!
     
  2. ForceHeretic

    ForceHeretic Jedi Youngling star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 8, 2002
    I'd go with number 1

    That or they have a freudian thing going on...
     
  3. the-dork-knight

    the-dork-knight Jedi Youngling star 3

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    Jan 14, 2003
    I also vote 1.
     
  4. Rogue...Jedi

    Rogue...Jedi Administrator Emeritus star 7 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

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    Jan 12, 2000
    I think a combination of 1 and 2. Although #1 probably factored in more than the #2
     
  5. Decapitated-Jango

    Decapitated-Jango Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    May 18, 2002
    Luke "knew it to be true" once he heard it.

    He was just denying it, IMO.

    Leia wasn't told by Vader himself, and she was more interested in their "sibling-ship" and Luke's safety.

    She was disgusted by the truth of Luke's father- (" *Your father!* ") but she believed it sure enough...
     
  6. SLR

    SLR Jedi Knight star 5

    Registered:
    Oct 20, 2002
    I go with 4 and that Carrie Fisher was so coked up during the filming it was the most dramatic response she could muster.
     
  7. darthmace7

    darthmace7 Jedi Youngling star 4

    Registered:
    Oct 15, 2003

    I'm with SLR.

    That's definitely #4, and Carrie Fisher was definitely too coked up to think of anything better to see. Lol, IMO at least.

    Literally probably no reason just what Lucas felt like. Not really a big plothole or anything.
     
  8. SITHlover

    SITHlover Jedi Youngling star 2

    Registered:
    Nov 30, 2002
    Personally, I always thought the "Somehow, I've always known" scene was poorly written and was done just because it HAD to be touched on in this movie. It feels like someone said let's just do it for the sake of getting it out of the way and move on.

    I find it very anti-climatic that the "there is another" from ESB is built up to the awful "somehow I..." in ROTJ. When Luke is first informed of his 'family situation' there is so much emotion but when he tells his sister there is hardly any emotion really. I know the situations are very different but it should have been handled differently.

    I usually don't like to bad-mouth any of the movies but now that you brought it up, that scene was very dissapointing for me. And the fact that she wouldn't tell Han was too 'soap opera like' as well. She just gets a whopper laid on her, Han is totally misunderstanding the situation and for no logical reason what so ever she won't tell Han that Luke is her brother. I know, I know, it sets it up for her to tell Han at the end of the movie, I guess I can live with this one SW glitch ;)
     
  9. WMCoolmon

    WMCoolmon Jedi Padawan star 4

    Registered:
    May 19, 2002
    ...because Leia was going to give Luke the "Let's-just-be-friends-speech". She realized he'd rather spend time with a dying green hermit than with her in a slave bikini. :p
     
  10. MobartZmuda

    MobartZmuda Jedi Padawan star 4

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    Apr 3, 2002
    I totally agree with you SITHlover. I remember even as a young kid watching ROTJ and that was my least favorite scene and I thought to myself, why isn't Leia freaking out about hearing that Vader is her father or that she has kissed her brother on the lips before, lol.
     
  11. Loco_for_Lucas

    Loco_for_Lucas Jedi Grand Master star 5

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    Aug 15, 2002
    Maybe Luke would have believed it if Vader kissed him. That somehow seems to work in the Star Wars universe.
     
  12. Cometgreen

    Cometgreen Jedi Padawan star 4

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    Jul 28, 2002
    Wow, lots of number ones. I always thought it was #2; the two had been close to each other and got to know each other for years, so when Luke said it (and when Luke guessed Leia earlier on), I think they just realized that it makes sense.

    Cometgreen
     
  13. a2dmusic

    a2dmusic Jedi Master star 4

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    Mar 4, 2001
    What about the fact that somehow Leia is more sensitive to the familial connections of the force? She appears to remember Padme better than Luke can... maybe she can also somehow sense her connection to Luke better than he can.
     
  14. arrowheadpodracer

    arrowheadpodracer Jedi Master star 5

    Registered:
    Apr 9, 2002
    1 & 2.
    Lukes first response was denial, but almost immediately he calls him father (on the falcon) so I think he knew it to be true, as Vader said, I just dont think he wanted to believe it.
    Plus, if he felt any "force connection" he might not have understood what he was sensing, being so new to the whole Jedi/force thing.
    In leias case, they just spent more time together and developed a bond. Comparing her feelings between Han and Luke probably helped her figure it out too.
     
  15. Naboo1

    Naboo1 Jedi Padawan star 4

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    Sep 19, 2003
    Well, Obi-Wan did tell Luke that Vader killed his father, Luke trusted Obi-Wan, and was surprised when he found out Obi-Wan lied to him.

    It had nothing to do with Force powers.
     
  16. a2dmusic

    a2dmusic Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 4, 2001
    It had nothing to do with Force powers.

    And you know this how?
     
  17. Esperanza_Nueva

    Esperanza_Nueva Jedi Grand Master star 6

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    Feb 23, 2003
    Luke and Leia shared a bond that Luke and Vader did not, it was therefore easier for Leia to accept that there was more that bonded them than just friendship. Also, when Luke is on Dagobah we learn that he has trouble "unlearning" things that he believes to be true. For years, Owen had told Luke lies about his father. Luke doesnt believe what Obi-Wan tells him about his father at first, just as he doesnt believe at first that Vader is his father. Leia, on the other hand, is more accepting. Unlike Han and others, she isnt skeptical about Luke's desire to learn the ways of the force. This could be because "somehow [she] always knew" that the force existed and existed in her, which could have led her to feel the bond that she and Luke shared.
     
  18. plutoneam

    plutoneam Jedi Youngling star 3

    Registered:
    Feb 21, 2003
    You would have preferred this?:

    "...my SISTER has it. Yes, its YOU, Leia."
    "No, THAT'S IMPOSSIBLE!"


    "Luke, I am your father!"
    "Somehow, I've always known."
     
  19. Jeff 42

    Jeff 42 Manager Emeritus star 5 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

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    Sep 14, 1998
    Bad writing. "Somehow, I've always known." Well, I guess that explains that kiss on Hoth, huh?
     
  20. DarthTerrious

    DarthTerrious Jedi Grand Master star 5

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    May 16, 2001
    Definitely 1 & 2 together.

    Plus at the End of Empire when she actually senses Luke (really good clue which helps ROTJ's plot), she knew then on that there was some kind of connection between her and Luke.

    Thats why when she hears the truth from Luke, she isn't totally surprised but it confirms everything since she sensed his distress on Bespin.

    Vader was painted as the total embodiment of evil by Obi-Wan, Luke was shocked to hear Obi-wan had then lied. He was definitely in denial but he quickly settled to the truth.
     
  21. eaglejedi

    eaglejedi Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Feb 2, 2001
    I am sick and tired of that ******** about Carrie Fisher's acting suffering due to drug abuse during the time period of the filming of TESB and ROTJ. Suspend the bias in favor of this conclusion, and watch the films, and one sees that it is not true.

    It's the same thing as what Eric says about Ricky Nelson, during the episode of 7th Heaven where Ricky Nelson is mentioned and one of his songs played at the end. People get hold of the drug thing and look at everything else about the person through that narrow, foggy lens.


    Anyway, more on topic: Plot-wise, the lines make more sense the way they are, than vice versa.

    Also, concur with above post that Luke is told something else by Obiwan, and he trusts and respects Obiwan, so he is reluctant to believe Obiwan didn't tell him the truth (or at least not the whole exact truth).
     
  22. SLR

    SLR Jedi Knight star 5

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    Oct 20, 2002
    EagleJedi, my response about the coke thing was a joke. In the original post, one of the options was #4 a joke answer. My response clearly states it was #4 a joke response. SOrry if I offended you, but I was just joking. I have no idea if Carrie Fisher is/was a coke head and if it affected her performance. I just thought it would be a funny answer.
     
  23. Bib Fortuna Twi'lek

    Bib Fortuna Twi'lek Jedi Youngling star 10

    Registered:
    Jul 9, 1999
    Leia was more or less in shock, so she didn't react as badly as Luke did.
     
  24. Master_Akwat_Kbrana

    Master_Akwat_Kbrana Jedi Youngling star 1

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    Oct 16, 2001
    I think it might have had something to do with the fact that Vader blew up a planet, almost eradicated the Rebel Alliance twice, captured his friends, torured Han, Killed all but two of the jedi, helped destroy the Republic (which had stood for a thousand generations), is trying to capture him, and is the second evilest person in the galaxy. Oh, and he just cut his hand off.
     
  25. DarthDrew

    DarthDrew Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 26, 2002
    I'd vote for 1 and 2 with a lot more maturity coming into the mix.
     
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