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Discussion The Antagonist's Ideology... what will they be fighting for? (Poll included)

Discussion in 'Star Wars: The Force Awakens' started by Ghost, Dec 29, 2013.

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What will the Antagonists be struggling to accomplish? (see descriptions in post)

The Destroyers 8 vote(s) 14.5%
The Gray Empire 8 vote(s) 14.5%
The Liberator 18 vote(s) 32.7%
The Philosopher-King of Utopia 16 vote(s) 29.1%
Other? (please explain in detail) 22 vote(s) 40.0%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. Ghost Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 13, 2003
    star 6
    [This thread is Mod-approved]



    So, putting aside the debate over the exact identity of the Main Villain... what about their ideology?

    What will the antagonists be fighting for?





    I can see them going one of four routes...

    1. The Destroyers... they want to kill as much life as they can, destroy as many worlds as they can... not even any interest in conquering or ruling, they just want the galaxy to burn, kill all life, and destroy the Force itself

    2. The Gray Empire... "Jedi" and non-Jedi-military who serve a new Emperor who has NOT fallen to the dark side (basically a Jedi Empire... the Old Republic minus the Senate)... perhaps they even view the offspring and descendants of the Chosen One as some sort of "divine bloodline" with the right to rule the galaxy

    3. The Liberator... an idealistic movement that wishes to liberate the galaxy and create something completely new, because the New Republic and New Jedi have the same flaws as the old ones, slavery still exists and droids are still treated as property, and the Liberator feels that Luke/Han/Leia have failed to fully take advantage of the Empire's fall... the Liberator is Force-trained but not Jedi or Sith and not a dark-sider, but she has no hesitation in bringing swift and bloody justice to those she has perceived to be benefitting from all the inequality and exploitation that still exists in the galaxy

    4. The Philosopher-King of Utopia... an enlightened, seemingly-benevolent Sith Lord wants to rule the galaxy because only he/she can truly give them the best existence possible, even be able to give Eternal Life to the common people of the galaxy and Resurrect the dead back to life, to live in a galaxy of Peace and Plenty, a utopian paradise... you just need to accept this Sith Lord as the enlightened philosopher god-king of the galaxy


    Or perhaps some combination of the above Or maybe we'll have more than one group of antagonists too. (For those reasons, I'll make this a multiple-choice poll).



    What do you think?
    Last edited by Ghost, Dec 29, 2013
  2. jedijax Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 2, 2013
    star 5
    I had been thinking that there is a faction, say the Mandalorians, who were once closely allied with the Empire. I use the Mandalorians because of the reference to Fett's armor and Fett being the prototype for the clones which became the stormtroopers and the subtle comparisons to Fett's armor.

    These allies provided military equipment, manufacturing, weapons, and armor for the Empire in exchange for resources needed to sustain their race.

    Well when the Empire was defeated, any ally of them were treated as war criminals. Sanctions over the years led to suffering on their homeworld. They were split into two ideaologies: one was to seek and reclaim what they felt was rightfully theirs and revenge; the other faction wanted to find peace and acceptance with the New Republic. The war-seeking faction turned to piracy and brutal terrorism. This anger and hate attracted the dark side and spirits from the Sith latched onto that hate as they always have to form a brand new alliance of evil.

    The factions of "good" were crushed and became slaves on their own homeworld. The sith simply want to destroy the good side of the Force as always and return from the netherworld.

    So from this standpoint-all of the above is my answer.
  3. Darth Archimage Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 28, 2013
    star 3
    3. The Liberator.

    The Galaxy is finally past the remnants of the Empire and moving toward a strong united government. However, creating this new government has caused redundancy between Galactic positions which take over those same positions of previous local planetary governments. Custom policies that may have just apply to local governments are replaced by Galaxy wide generic policies. The Liberator emerges as a well esteemed and well spoken new leader who gains the trust and the following of a significant portion of the Galaxy, favoring independent systems of government suited for their needs.

    Palpatine sought his power with politics and government. Maybe the Liberator has a different angle and uses a philosophical aspect of the Force to gain his following, a different means to the same goal -- Power.

    EDIT: This is assuming that it has taken the time from since the RoTJ until Ep VII (30-40 years) for the Galactic Government to finally be recreated.
    Last edited by Darth Archimage, Dec 29, 2013
  4. TheBBP Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 6, 2012
    star 5
    The Anti-Christ? Metaphorically speaking only that is. No Biblical precepts intended.
    Last edited by TheBBP, Dec 29, 2013
  5. darklordoftech Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 30, 2012
    star 6
    I'd hate #1. I hate villains who want to watch the world burn.
    DARTHVENGERDARTHSEAR likes this.
  6. Darth Archimage Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 28, 2013
    star 3
    Yes, that's kinda what I was getting at. And to follow your lead, I replaced the word 'religious' with 'philosophical' to stay away from any religious arguments. :)
    Last edited by Darth Archimage, Dec 29, 2013
    TheBBP likes this.
  7. Reveen Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Oct 4, 2012
    star 3
    This.



    Wait, you meant "antagonist" as in "bad guy". Crap.
  8. Mystery Roach Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 10, 2004
    star 4
    I chose the Liberator because it comes closest to my belief, although the description is a little too specific for my taste. I think that the Republic will not yet have learned the lessons of the Clone Wars and fall to the Empire so we'll see it stuck somewhere between the Empire and the Old Republic, which will likely be the main cause of conflict among the political factions who can't agree on what direction to go from there.
  9. Darth Punk Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 25, 2013
    star 5
    Lay off the Russians - at least they send Xmas cards

    [IMG]
  10. niel6658 Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Dec 29, 2013
    star 1
    I hope there will be two antagonists in the new movies. One should fight to bring back LAW & ORDER (Sith-style) to a chaotic Galaxy by brute military force. While the other (our heroes) want to bring FREEDOM & PEACE (Jedi-style) to the whole Galaxy through negotiations and diplomacy.

    The reason is that I don't believe the majority of systems in the Galaxy will be ready for another powerful Galactic government, be it Republic or Empire, only 30 years after the fall of Sidious' iron fisted 1st Galactic Empire. Restoring faith in a new central Galactic government will take more than just a few decades, it could easilly take the better part of a century.

    There should be a multitude of factions and powers at play in the Galaxy now. Remember the Galactic Senate was disbanded in ANH, Imperial governors (Moffs) took direct control of their systems. Everything have to be rebuilt from scratch.
  11. Seagoat Music and PT Section Sentinel (and PT Trivia Host)

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Jan 25, 2013
    star 5
    A destroying, imperial, liberating, king Gamorrean
  12. Jedirush2112 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Apr 10, 2013
    star 4
    The Gray Empire: Basically, the same reason Jedi Master Joruus C' Baoth desired, for the masses to serve the Jedi.

    [IMG]

    MODified: Undid the hotlink in the pic.
    Last edited by A Chorus of Disapproval, Dec 30, 2013
    DARTHVENGERDARTHSEAR likes this.
  13. Darth Punk Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 25, 2013
    star 5
    Maybe the galaxy wide celebrations at the end of ROTJ lasted 40 years, and the Jedi were called in to end them and get everyone back to work. Then a massive war breaks out because of it.

    Episode VII: Fight for your right to party
    LunarMoth and darklordoftech like this.
  14. Ghost Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 13, 2003
    star 6
    I see that @TheBBP, @Dra---, @Immortiss, have voted for "Other."

    I'm curious to know what you guys want to see happen :D
    Dra--- and darklordoftech like this.
  15. TheBBP Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 6, 2012
    star 5
    My vote was a mistake. I enjoy the theory that @Darth Archimage put forward.
    Darth Archimage likes this.
  16. Dark-Vador1138 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 14, 2004
    star 3
    that's a very good question, I hope the story involves the family against each other (as it always has been in SW), father vs son, brother vs sister, the idea of revenge especially if it's personal is always a powerful and moving setting for a movie
  17. Han Burgundy Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 28, 2013
    star 3
    A combination of the last two.

    Whatever villain arrives in the ST should be a direct foil to the heroes, and to the state of society as it stands. Galactic society is recovering from two massive failures in a row. First, their corrupt democracy allowed the galaxy to break out into a massive war with separatists, and then that democracy was transformed into a ruthless totalitarian dictatorship, plunging into an even darker period of oppression and civil war.

    A society on the scale of the GFFA would not recover from all of that very quickly. Firstly, who would take the reigns of government? Would it be the Rebels who overtook the villainous empire? Their hearts are in the right place, but they are fighters, not neccisarily rulers. Aside from the few of them who were former senate members, how many of them really know how to run a galaxy-wide government, one that will give their citizens the freedom that they fought for? Sure, it probably won't take 30+ years to sort out all of their problems, and by the time we catch up with everybody in Episode 7, the galaxy might actually on the upswing, but my point is that it won't be a perfect process. Rome wasn't built in a day, and it won't be rebuilt that quickly either. People will disagree. The New Republic (if it is called that) will be struggling to achieve the glory of its predecessor.

    Which makes this an opportune time for someone with their own agenda to come in and start wreaking havoc in the name of peace, or utopia, or any other desirable goal that might just be a mask for their true, villainous purpose. They might secretly be a Sith, they might be a remnant of the Empire, but whoever they are, they don't truly have the best interest of the galaxy at heart, even if they believe they do. This villain will be persuasive, their cause will become formidable in both size and strength, and most importantly, they will turn the tables on the heroes of the OT (and form a thematic circle with the PT): the rebellion becomes the institution, and they must now crush a rebellion of their own.
    Last edited by Han Burgundy, Dec 30, 2013
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  18. Jedsithor Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 1, 2005
    star 4
    Purity Of The Force. An extragalactic civilisation founded on Force worship that views both Jedi and Sith as heretics and will seek to cleanse the galaxy of all impurities in a massive crusade.
  19. Immortiss Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 10, 2013
    star 4
    Give me time. I'm mulling it over. To speculate on this is a bit more difficult for me.[face_thinking]
    Dra--- and Ghost like this.
  20. -Jedi Joe- Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 6, 2013
    star 2
  21. Darth_Pevra Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2008
    star 6
    A philosopher god-king of utopia would be awesome. I usually really dig that kind of villain, especially if his motives are explored a bit.
  22. Darth_Hydra Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 14, 2001
    star 4
    Voted for Other: I think the antagonist will want either power for themselves or revenge on somebody/something.
  23. darklordoftech Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 30, 2012
    star 6
    To wipe out the Gungans. ;)
  24. appleseed Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 5, 2002
    star 4
    Please, no #1. I like the third option myself.
    darklordoftech likes this.
  25. A Chorus of Disapproval New Films Riot Deterrent

    Manager
    Member Since:
    Aug 19, 2003
    star 8
    I am still holding out belief that if they choose to veer away from familiarity/rhyming that the adversary should be the equivalent of Carthage seeking to take advantage of a weakened "Rome".
    Bob Octa, Spam Bot and Immortiss like this.