Discussion in 'Archive: Census and Games' started by DarthIntegral, Jan 6, 2009.
I'll second that.
And hey, Fever finally gets to beat me. Ah, but tough break that it's in this draft.
Leave it to Fever!
We had a trump limit this time around. You could only have three forfeits, thus you couldn't force teams with four forfeits.
If anyone's losing around here it's me. This is a draft, after all.
Shurron's Anal Leakage: The Team (0) vs EF's Tim and Eric Awesome Team Great Job! (0)
Link (LoZ: Faces of Evil) TRUMPED with Rocky Balboa (Rocky series), Motor Ed (Kim Possible) and Abobo (Double Dragon) vs Hannibal Lecter (Silence of the Lambs) trumped with DNAmy (Kim Possible)(Unprepared) />
Eh. Not the best draw I could've hoped for, but it should work.
Gotta concede the easy win for my trump. Let's move on.
Shurron's Anal Leakage: The Team (1) vs EF's Tim and Eric Awesome Team Great Job! (0)
Link (LoZ: Faces of Evil) TRUMPED with Rocky Balboa (Rocky series), Motor Ed (Kim Possible) and Abobo (Double Dragon) FORFEIT vs Venom trumped with Carnage[/quote]
Shurron's Anal Leakage: The Team (1) vs EF's Tim and Eric Awesome Team Great Job! (1)
Katsuhiko Jinnai (El Hazard) vs Venom trumped with Carnage FORFEIT[/quote]
Shurron's Anal Leakage: The Team (2) vs EF's Tim and Eric Awesome Team Great Job! (1)
Link (LoZ: Faces of Evil) TRUMPED with Rocky Balboa (Rocky series), Motor Ed (Kim Possible) and Abobo (Double Dragon) FORFEIT vs Vicious trumped with Spike Spiegel (Cowboy Bebop)[/quote]
Shurron's Anal Leakage: The Team (2) vs EF's Tim and Eric Awesome Team Great Job! (2)
Link (LoZ: Faces of Evil) TRUMPED with Rocky Balboa (Rocky series), Motor Ed (Kim Possible) and Abobo (Double Dragon) FORFEIT vs Agatha (Minority Report)[/quote]
Shurron's Anal Leakage: The Team (2) vs EF's Tim and Eric Awesome Team Great Job! (3)
Mola Ram (Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom) *unprepared* vs Norman Bates (Psycho)[/quote]
I haven't looked up Mola and Norman - is this another one too easy?
No, this one isn't easy. Although I'd certainly lean towards The Ram in a normal situation, he isn't prepped here and Normie is. Then again, prep is not going to do much at all for our resident schizo, so I probably lean towards Ram anyways.
I'll think this over a wee bit longer and hopefully get to it and movies tomorrow night.
Yeah, I definitely got some things to say on this one. No, it's not an easy match whatsoever, but Norman should definitely win. Probably later tonight I should have the time to lay it all out.
Wouldn't have pegged this match in the finals.
Some people should just retire from GMing...
Pfft. All judge and no play makes Jack a dull boy. And what? I should've stayed out and allowed a draft full of teams with bad (good) picks to fight it out? That I'm actually in a position to maybe win this when most of my team came from the second half of the draft and free agency says an awful lot. I should've had next to no chance.
Anyways, I guess I can see why one would lean towards Mola Ram over Norman with prep at a first glance. Yeah, Norman's crazy, and I guess Mola Ram isn't a small dude. And that heart rip is definitely vicious. But no, Mola Ram sucks just as completely and utterly as Norman does, only... funny thing about Norman. He's actually not as completely worthless in a fight as we've been led to believe so far (not that I'm suggesting he should've beaten prepped Vito Corleone last round).
Think about Mola Ram. Does he have even a slightly impressive combat feat to his credit? No, he doesn't. He ripped the heart out of the chest of a helpless captive. He also... oh, I guess that's it. He relies on his henchmen for everything else. He did make an attempt at ripping out Indy's heart, but, you know, failed. He was able to hang on the bridge after Indy sliced it when others fell to their death right away, but for all we know that was luck (of course, the actual reason is that it would've been anticlimatic had he fallen off right away with the other henchmen, but whatever). But really, actually name something that Mola Ram has done to an opponent that's capable of fighting back. You can't possibly do it because nothing exists. Does he have any actual skill to compliment the heart rip move? There's no evidence that he does.
And yeah, Norman's kind of a skinny little guy, and he's "so psychotic that it's crippling", but hey, that didn't stop him from winning not one, buttwo seperate impromptu fights over the course of those movies. He beats Sam unconscious in a brawl in the original film and then he again wins a fight in Psycho III against Duane. Both times he uses improvised weapons to win, but the point is that he wins convincingly both times. And that's just the brawls he's taken part in. I'm not even talking about the body count he racks up using knifes, shovels and other fun things. Often times those kills depend on surprise, but it's a much bigger known body count than what Mola Ram can boast.
So what about each of those guys that Norman beat unconcious? Well both were bigger than him, same as Mola Ram (Duane in particular looked to be in damn good shape as well), and, well, there's no evidence that either one was a particularly good fighter. So... how is either one much different than what Norman's facing in Mola Ram? Pretty much the heart rip move is the only difference, and Norman should know about that with his prep.
So where's the evidence that an unprepared Mola Ram (no prep so that there's no chance he'll also come into battle using a sword or a bow or whatever, even though he's never been shown using one) has any chance against an opponent who is armed with a deadly weapon, has a much bigger documented body count and who has at least shown to be able to beat people in a fight?
I'm going to wait until Shurron answers EF's counter and confirms that his last post is really what he meant.
Zizz puts it in the net!
Sorry for forgetting about this.
I'm still sort of undecided. First of all, as sad as it is, I wasn't even aware there were even any Psycho sequels. I know about the Van Sant remake with Vince Vaughn (lol), but haven't seen it. So I need to check into those to make sure I'm not missing anything important.
Anyways, first of all; classifying Bates' fight with Sam as a brawl is a little laughable. Hell, so is classifying it as a fight. I'm not sure about the remake, but it lasts for about three seconds in the original, and doesn't really add much at all to Bates' resume. Quick bump on the head with a vase or something? Eh.
I think you're grossly underestimating Ram's stature. Bates entering the match with a knife (or a shovel or whatever) isn't going to end the match immediately. I don't care how many guests he's ambushed in the shower, he still isn't a skilled or strong fighter. And Randy the Ram might have very little to his name, but I'm not completely unprepared to make a few quick assumptions. It's not like he's going to stand in the exact same place for the entire match and make grabbing motions with his hand, in hopes that somebody's torso will wind up in the same vicinity so he can tear out a heart. He's very clearly a strong dude.
Still, I'd like to at the very least research the sequels and perhaps the remake, to see if Norman has what it takes. Were it only original Psycho, I take Mola Ram in a scorcher, based on his obvious height and strength, lack of experience aside. But maybe there's something about Norman that I don't know. If anybody can find some helpful clips, I'd appreciate it.
first of all; classifying Bates' fight with Sam as a brawl is a little laughable. Hell, so is classifying it as a fight. I'm not sure about the remake, but it lasts for about three seconds in the original, and doesn't really add much at all to Bates' resume. Quick bump on the head with a vase or something? Eh.
Okay, looking at it again, that is pretty much it. I could've sworn there was something of a scuffle prior to that. It's still better than the nothing MR can claim.
I think you're grossly underestimating Ram's stature. Bates entering the match with a knife (or a shovel or whatever) isn't going to end the match immediately.
Obviously. I recall saying that this wasn't an easy match. But you're seriously going to pretend that Bates coming into the fight armed isn't a serious advantage in his favor? Show me where MR has shown the skill to disarm someone. Even someone as generally unimpressive as Norman. Or are we just going to assume he has the skill?
And size isn't everything. If it was, then why did you so quickly vote for my wimpy litte trump (of which, only Jinnai would've likely made it to the fight, given the way we're treating incohesivness here) over Dementor? Yeah, he's worthless without prep, but he's got some pretty massive muscules at the very least. And this was against someone who's shown even less in the way of worth than Norman. Where were the assumptions then?
It's not like he's going to stand in the exact same place for the entire match and make grabbing motions with his hand, in hopes that somebody's torso will wind up in the same vicinity so he can tear out a heart. He's very clearly a strong dude.
No. No, no, no, no... no. While it's never explained in exact detail what happened, there is clearly something besides physical strength fueling the heart rip move. It's, without a doubt, supernatural. Something to do with Kali. I'm no doctor, but I'm pretty sure that if someone used brute strength to rip out another person's heart, that heart would not continue to beat. That person would not still be alive (oh, hey, it wouldn't even kill Norman as far as we know), and the heart damn sure would not begin to beat faster as the still living person became more and more afraid, and then start to burn when the body it's no longer attached to caught on fire. There's no evidence whatsoever that MR's heart rip has anything to do with physical strength.
And... I can't believe I actually feel it's necessary to say this, but that one move is all MR has ever been shown to use that's somehow supernatural. He can't throw fireballs, he can't upgrade his normal human durability or enhance his strength or make Norman's head explode with a gesture and a laugh. As far as we know, absolutely nothing aside from the ability to rip a person's heart from their chest as a sacrifice to Kali.
And if we seriously are going to assume any of that, then... **** it. I'm done.
Anyways, as for the Psycho 3 fight, I could only find it in a music video, which doesn't show the entire fight. But in that one, Duane is not taken down by a cheapshot from behind. It was proper brawl and Norman won. Simple as that. And again, as far as muscles go, Duane proves my point about Norman being able to beat bigger, stronger guys. Jeff Fahey was buff, man.
[link=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Val2Q_r3CNI]Start at 3:15.[/link] And yeah, it's a pretty dark scene. And the whole fight was longer than that. But I don't remember the whole thing blow-for-blow. Sorry.
EDIT: And at the end of [link=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=orLmrUZbgTU&feature=related]this one[/link], there's a much better look at Duane in all his buffness. Mola Ram indeed. Assumptions indeed.
No, you're right. I was definitely assuming his ability to fire rounds out of his mouth and ass while peeing lava onto the opponent.
That IJ fact is interesting though. It's been a wee while since I first (and last) watched Temple of Doom, and although I remembered the incident you were referring to, clearly I remembered it incorrectly. I naturally assumed he had torn right through. I'm not even actually sure they showed the heart actually being torn out, but I definitely got a glimpse of Ram holding it triumphantly. I'm trying to find a clip of it, but for now I'll just have to go with what you're telling me.
The Bates clip is more impressive though. Nothing incredible (clearly), but at least something more than a couple of guys more or less high fiving before one smashes the other over the head with a vase. With a knife (and maybe a few handy dining room ornaments lying around), it seems Normie would have what it takes against Ram, if only barely.
Oh, and with what I know now about your stupid Hazard trump, I most likely would have gone with Dementor even without the prep. That was a poorly researched call on my part, although in my defense the draft was in a standstill at that point and I just wanted to get it moving. Clearly a rushed call though. Ma bad.
No, you're right. I was definitely assuming his ability to fire rounds out of his mouth and ass while peeing lava onto the opponent.
Hey, I've lost matches in various drafts thanks to stuff a lot dumber than that. It's amazing what sometimes doesn't go without saying.
About the heart thing, Mola Ram actually does rip right through the guy's chest like he's putting his hand through warm butter. But when you take everything else about MR into account, really, just about the only possible explanation for that is that Kali grants him... some sort of power to perform that very specific act. And nothing else.
If it were just superhuman strength in general that Kali grants him, and he could use that strength to, say, tear people up in any other way (like ripping someone in two with no effort), then it'd cast certain other events in that movie in a really dubious light. Like, why would MR run away from Indy if he could practically liquify him with a simple left hook? Why, then, could Indy actually pull his hand away on the fallen bridge when he tries to rip out his heart? I don't care what kind of adrenaline boost he may or may not have had, Indy cannot physically overpower someone that has the strength to casually put his hand through through a human breastplate as though it were a jello mold (and it wasn't like he even put any force behind it like it was a punch or something, his hand just went through). So the only explanation can be that it had nothing to do with physical strength. I dunno what, exactly, it does have to do with, but it's not strength.
I honestly care very little about winning this. I decided to have fun with it, picking two very powerful characters in FA just because they have terrible cohesion being just one example of that. Please do not hurt your brains thinking too hard about this match.
Yeah, I don't really care all that much, either. I didn't bother signing up in the first place and almost didn't take the spot that opened up, but then I took a closer look at a bunch of the picks that had been made up until then and I guess I just couldn't let it slide. Meh.