The anti-Star Wars media bias continues!

Discussion in 'Attack of the Clones' started by Durwood, Oct 2, 2002.

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  1. anidanami124 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 24, 2002
    star 6
    ok post 700 more like 900
  2. Shelley Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Sep 9, 2001
    star 5
    I bet Peter Jackson wouldn't sayabout Lord of the Rings what Lucas said about Star Wars. I think it's clear that Peter Jackson has lived and breathed nothing but Lord of the Rings for half a decade.

    That's a good thing? Jeez, if it's so, he needs to get a life in the worst way.

    It's one thing to love your work. It's another to live and breathe it. For heaven's sake, it's just a movie series.

    Lucas has better things to live his life for, like his kids.

    Lucas did not insult SW. He said it isn't his life. IMO, it shouldn't be. It's not healthy to live and breathe a movie series.
  3. Merkel Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Aug 21, 2002
    star 1
    Elvisjones attended the seminar, tkae my word for it (it's not very valdi to you, I supose, but I'm telling you the truth).
    No music was composed for the Clone War.
    In Jwfan.net we talked with a member of the choir that performed with London Symphony orchestra in the soundtrack, and she also said that no new music was composed or performed for the Clone War.
    She did say than an alternative ending music (prety awesome acording to her) was composed and recorded, but ultimatly was replaced by the version in the cd and film, that contains the Imperial march when we see the clones boarding the ships in the end.
  4. anidanami124 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 24, 2002
    star 6
    Shelley that is so true.
  5. Only_2 Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    May 21, 2002
    star 3
    The Harry Potter Score is great, [sarcasm]but nobody's even heard of JW, so who cares?[/sarcasm]

    Also if you read what is stated on the JWfan.net site carefully, you will see that there is no actual proof that these pieces were not re-recorded for AOTC. The woman from the LSO did say the themes from TPM were reused, but not actual recorded tracks being reused.

    The same goes for the supposed quote from Matt Stone.

    John Williams that it was decided not to compose any original music for the sequence, but instead to track it with music from PHANTOM MENACE.

    In the recording industry when refering to tracking something for a film this typically means that they are going to record the music to the filmon a soundstage while watching the corresponding portion of the film, hence track it with music from PHANTOM MENACE.

    I know this is getting very nit-picky, but I work in audio production and am aware of the typical use of language associated with production, therefore I am making educated answers.
  6. Durwood Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 18, 2002
    star 5
    O.K., here's a question (since this thread has spun hopeless off-topic!):

    If Lucas is just in it for the money and really doesn't like Star Wars then why did he commit to spend almost 10 years of his life to personally producing and directing the films? Wouldn't it have been a hell of a lot easier to just farm out the franchise to some other director? I mean, it would have made money regardless and it would have given him more time to swim in his Scrooge McDuck-like money bin. So why is he devoting so much of his time to a series of films he supposedly hates?
  7. anidanami124 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 24, 2002
    star 6
    Durwood no one really knows. Oh and yes this his gone off topic. So far off topic that it will never get back on topic.
  8. Mapper Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    May 17, 2002
    star 1
    now wait just a minute, this thread had a topic? ?[face_plain]
  9. anidanami124 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 24, 2002
    star 6
    I think it did Mapper about oh maybe 10, 20 pages back.

    I could be wrong.
  10. DarthTerrious Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 16, 2001
    star 5
    Rebelscumb, I just thought I'd respond to your your elaborated points:

    Why are the seperatist leaving the republic? Who is Jango working for? Why can't the jedi connect simple dots which are apparent? Why can't Padme and Ankin both accomplished pilots fly their own ship to naboo? Why would dooku reveal to poggle that his master is on coruscant? If dooku erased kaminio how did he do this if he had left the jedi order, if he did it before he left the order, why did he do it? Why would the senate suddenly listen to jar jar?

    I'll answer some of them:
    Jango works for Count Dooku
    The Jedi can't connect the dots because the Darkside is clouding their use of the Force.
    The reason Padme & Anakin go as refugees on a freighter transport is because the Jedi still believe she is in danger and they have to remain low key.
    Dooku erased Kamino from the records before he left the Order. That assumes he met with Sidious before he left the Order and he was still able to access the archives and take out relevant info.
    Jar Jar represents Senator Amidala and Naboo, the Senate would listen to him because they assume since he represents a valued member of the Senate such as Senator Amidala then he is worth listening to.

    If you were watching the movie, you'd have realised these things.



    99% of the packing scene is useless dialogue
    -The scene with yodas floating chair does nothing to advance the plot or characters
    -the missing planet subplot is stupid and does nothing to ad to the story, plot, or characters
    -the scene on the refugee ship is pretty pointless, the queen jamilla scene does nothing to advance the characters, plot, story, or even provide enjoyment to the viewer
    -what do we learn in the meadow scene, Padmes first kiss was a guy named palo
    -the cgi pare scene? another pointless scene
    -yoda's beloved fight scene? a completely ridicoulous waste of screen time. I knwo some people find this amusing but come on, if dooku or yoda had been kille dit might make a difference, or if we had learned somehting ala "i am your father" if there was some consquences to this rather boring fight then it might be jsutified, but the movie would be much better off if Dooku removed anakins arm, and then jumped in his ship to escape


    The packing scene dialogue establishes Anakins conflicting emotions and views towards Obi-Wan and also establishes that there is something ebtween Padme and Anakin. So its hardly 99% useless.
    It establishes Obi-Wan's doubts with his Padawan, also tells the audience that the Jedi are becoming more arrogant and that change is in the air.
    The missing planet subplot is quite interesting actually, first Obi-Wan has to go outside the beacon of Knowledge that is the Jedi Temple and use an outside source, then he finds that the planet isn't even in the archives and when he asks fro help he is presented by an arrogant and proud librarian, and when he finally finds the planet he is thrust into something which is so confusing and amazing he can';t believe its gone on without Jedi Knowledge.
    Again the scene on the refugee ship establishes Anakin really digs Padme, and also an important point that Jedi aren't allowed to love. The Queen Jamillia scene establishes some of the situation of the Separatist movement and the problems the republic faces, it also establishes where Anakin and Padme will go next.
    Meadow scene again, advances Anakin and Padme's love, they talk about things which are important and you get an insight into each of their views.
    The point of the dining room scene i believe is to show some symbolism of the forbidden love the two are about to engage in, by using the pair as the forbidden fruit. Once Padme accepts a piece from Anakin and eats it she willingly joins this forbidden journey.
    Well I believe that Lucas wanted to show Yoda fight and not just be a guy who talked alot. If you can't enjoy Yoda fighting then well thats your loss.



    We we know that the only scene with Owen lars in ep3 is at the end when obi-wan brings luke, so when exactly is the whole damned
  11. Kiki-Gonn Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 26, 2001
    star 6
    "Inflated expectations aside, Menace still disappointed due to unnecessarily convoluted plotting and an over-reliance on special effects at the expense of characterization"


    That hits exactly on the bias this thread is about.
    Disappointed exactly who? The movie got 80% thumbs up from the audience surveys (either liked it or loved it) from what I remember.
    It also made $430 M.
    SM, LOTR, HP all make less (domestically) yet I don't see anyone in the media saying they dissappointed.
    That's the bias. Holding the PT to a harsher standard than other movies.
  12. Darth Blasphemous Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Jun 21, 1999
    star 4
    Shelley: I have great issue with you statements about PJ. Let me be brief as I do not wish for this to become another LOTR vs.SW thread.

    PJ chooses to devot a lot of time to LOTR because he wants to deliver a solid set of films for the fans, old and new. Jackson himself stated in an interview that LOTR was not the major film he set out to make, but that he was merely a fan of it and wanted to give it a shot. What PJ is doing is not what I would call "having no life" but rather devotion. Heck, if you make three films at once, each of which clock in at around 3 hours plus you need devotion to a project. Furthermore, it's not like PJ can deliver these at his own leisure. He has to meet his X-mas release deadlines until 2003. GL takes three years between projects and is very much at his own leisure. Go figure.
  13. smauldookie Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Mar 5, 2002
    star 5
    [image=http://dvdmedia.ign.com/dvd/image/ep2clones_30.jpg]

    everybody cool it here or YODA LEE will show you who's boss. [face_laugh]
  14. Mapper Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    May 17, 2002
    star 1
    I thought YODA LEE would be bigger.
  15. smauldookie Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Mar 5, 2002
    star 5
    That's it Mapper you're YODA LEE first beatdown. :p
  16. Durwood Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 18, 2002
    star 5
    "Inflated expectations aside, Menace still disappointed due to unnecessarily convoluted plotting and an over-reliance on special effects at the expense of characterization"

    Yes, this sentence caught my attention, too. In one clear statement he identifies the problem and then immediately dismisses it in order to bash on The Phantom Menace.
  17. Rebel Scumb Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Feb 22, 1999
    star 6
    I'll find the aritcle don't worry, though UK sullistian posted this:

    "Lets say that the Arena battle WAS scored with Cuts and Paste's from unused and used TPM cues.

    (Which it was, incidentally. The JW Fanclub website have matched up the original cues with the AOTC ones)."

    But look at it this way, why would i, and dozens of other people make this up? Is that part of the medi bias as well? Am I in on it?

    Whats inherently wrong with this is we are robbed of the new music JW composed for these scenes. They had JW, what excuse is there for them not use him?
  18. Durwood Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    May 18, 2002
    star 5
    what excuse is there for them not use him?

    Because the scene in question was not finished when it came time to record the music. A pretty logical decision, it would seem.
  19. Kiki-Gonn Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 26, 2001
    star 6
    Movies are big enterprises where all kinds of stuff, including entire scenes... music and all(!), gets left behind.
  20. Rebel Scumb Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Feb 22, 1999
    star 6
    So why didn't they schedule things so that JW coudl see a near finished version for the scoring? thats how its typically done.

    "So if this report is true then we can plainly see that it was a purposeful decision very early in the game rather than a lazy last minute addition made in the editing room. Isn't it amazing how basher allegations rarely coincide with reality? "

    I never said it was alst minute thing, this is you own denile that has lead you to that conclusin, since many of you refuse to believe even the simplist idea that the score is cut and paste, its niether here nor there for me to try and explain why this is aritically lazy.

    "How many songs can he come up with?"

    He's a world class composer, if he is out of ideas he should retire, yet he seems do good work on every other film he works on, and all of the new music for AOTC is quite good, so why is it so tough? Because the descion wa smade for them to use old music for the scene. Its lazy, not for JW, but for the creative team in genral, GL should have taken this into account and either delayed the release of the film, or sped up the process of makin it.
  21. Shelley Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Sep 9, 2001
    star 5
    Darth Blasphemous, I was quoting what Jabbadabbado said earlier, that PJ lived and breathed LOTR, and responding to it. Jabbadabbado was using that comparison to denigrate Lucas, implying that he should live and breathe SW. You seem to be continuing with that, implying that because Lucas takes 3 years to do a SW movie "at his leisure" (although he himself has said it takes ten years of his life to do a trilogy--and he is involved in every aspect of the SW movies), then he isn't as interested in making a quality product as Peter Jackson. If I misinterpreted what you said, I'm sorry, but if I'm not, I don't agree with what you said.

    I don't think FOTR is that high in quality, for one thing, nor do I think living and breathing a movie necessarily makes it higher quality. In fact, it's usually necessary to distance yourself from your work a little in order to put out a quality product, be it a movie, a book, an album, whatever.
  22. Go-Mer-Tonic Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Aug 22, 1999
    star 6
    I think that Lucas plans on rescoring a lot of this for the archival editions.

    There are semi confirmed rumors of rescoring ANH to add things like the Imperial March and a shot of Jimmy Smitts just before Alreaan goes kablooey.
  23. Lagniappe Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Dec 19, 1999
    star 4
    I realize this was raised several pages back, but unlike many of you, I don't have continual access to the NET..nor time to use it if I did. :)

    I wish to address the question of Han or Greedo shooting first (and yes, I know this is off topic but so is much of this thread). Some have suggested that they do not understand why some of us consider this a problematic change...I mean, it is such a little thing, isn't it? One guys shoots first or the other one does? What's the big deal?

    Well, I'll explain the "big deal," at least from my point of view.

    For me, Han always symbolized the flawed man. If you recall, he was only in it for the money. Throughout the film, he makes it clear, he has no interest in being a do-gooder or a hero. He is driven by self-interest. His shooting Greedo first drives this home. He is a ruthless smuggler, and not necessarily a "good guy." He will even KILL to protect himself and his interests, and kill most efficiently and without many qualms. However, duuring the progression of the film, he slowly comes to care for Leia and Luke and their struggles. He comes to realize there is more to the universe than just himself. He GROWS into a more mature, thoughtful, compassionate individual willing to make sarcfifices for OTHERS. He is transformed.

    By having him shoot Greedo only in self-defence, this transformation becomes less pronounced and important. Han's journey of self-discovery...his growth as a person...is lessened. He starts out as a fairly nice guy and becomes a nicer guy - and is it really a surprise at the end when he decides to help out?

    When I first saw ANH, I recall Han's unexpected arrival as being one of the big WOW moments in the film, because you really DID believe he was a rouge only in it for himself. You'd seen him shoot down Greedo...

    IMO, in deciding to make ANH more PC by having Greedo shoot first, GL denied Han the chance to show REAL personal growth... to face a personal revelation about himself and his place in the universe. No longer does his choice to return to help out seem like a pivotal turning moment in his life towards something larger and more important than himself - now it just seems predicatable.

    And that is why, at least for me, it is a "big deal" because it drastically changes the entire motivational arch of a major character in the saga.
  24. Shelley Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Sep 9, 2001
    star 5
    Not really. Han still remains a flawed character who acts like he's just in it for the money, but who proves himself wrong by coming back and saving Luke in the nick of time.

    I fail to see how "Greedo shoots first" changes a dang thing about Han. I personally don't like it because I think it's an awkwardly added effect.
  25. Rebel Scumb Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Feb 22, 1999
    star 6
    I guess a better question is, why SHOULD Greed o shoot first. If it doesn't improve the film, why add it after all these years.
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