main
side
curve

Arena The Boxing Discussion Thread

Discussion in 'Community' started by DarthSubZero, May 15, 2007.

  1. Jester J Binks

    Jester J Binks Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 19, 2016
    When this McGregor v. Mayweather fight became official, I was a bit ashamed that Mayweather would make such a fight. So even though I knew Conor had no serious chance of winning, it would have been fitting to see him get lucky and KO Mayweather.

    But now Team McGregor keeps putting out these edited videos of sparring to pretend he's taking out boxers, only to constantly have the unedited footage show just the opposite.

    First of all, sparring victories are meaningless. The partner is there for your benefit to sharpen up. They will not always fight their style. And you rarely have sparring partners actually trying to *win*, let alone knock out.

    So now McGregor has lost any timid support from me. He's destroyed that "rooting for the underdog" goodwill. Essentially he has become Mayweatheresque. You respect their skills, but you kinda want them taken down a notch for their antics.
     
    Juliet316 and heels1785 like this.
  2. heels1785

    heels1785 JCC/PT/New Films Manager star 8 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Dec 10, 2003
    the true crime of this fight is that it has sucked away the hype from what could be the best fight in 20 years taking place on sept 16th. only boxing fans are even aware of it.
     
    Jester J Binks likes this.
  3. heels1785

    heels1785 JCC/PT/New Films Manager star 8 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Dec 10, 2003
    heels' live scoring of this nonsense:

    1 - mcgregor 10-9
    2 - mcgregor 10-9
    3 - mcgregor 10-9
    4 - mayweather 10-9
    5 - mayweather 10-9
    6 - mayweather 10-9
    7 - mayweather 10-9
    8 - mayweather 10-9
    9 - mayweather 10-8 - this one's just about done, looks like

    Fight called in 10th.

    Mayweather wins by stoppage/TKO.

    Some quick observations:

    1) Conor McGregor's cardio strategy was terrible.
    2) Conor McGregor never learned how to box. Lucky to have a passive referee, he threw about 30 hammer fists that I counted, could have been docked at least 2 points.
    3) This was a stupid fight and an embarrassment for boxing.
     
  4. Jester J Binks

    Jester J Binks Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 19, 2016
    Floyd embarrassed himself tonight.

    This is why even though Floyd has a *great* record with big names, it is all a smoke screen. It is why I could just never call myself a Mayweather fan. His wins crap all over the larger sport of boxing.
     
  5. SergeyX2017

    SergeyX2017 Jedi Knight star 3

    Registered:
    Jan 14, 2017
    Mayweather wins. On his turf, his rules, basically all pre-rigged in his favor lol

    Worthless, pointless fight, in other words. Glad I didn't bother to watch.
     
  6. JEDI-RISING

    JEDI-RISING Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Apr 15, 2005
    ref had to jump in , i mean mayweather's punching power could have done permanent damage :rolleyes:
     
  7. heels1785

    heels1785 JCC/PT/New Films Manager star 8 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Dec 10, 2003
    Conor's collapse was like clockwork. Round 8, as soon as he was out of UFC territory. Very clear that he did not take his training seriously.

    Jester, there is some good news. Now we can get ready for Canelo-GGG. To quote Bart Scott..

    CANT WAIT
     
    Jester J Binks likes this.
  8. Jester J Binks

    Jester J Binks Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 19, 2016
    Conor has nothing to be ashamed about. heels1785 , I think you are being too hard on Conor's possible *bad* training. Anybody that has played a serious sport knows that you grow immeasurably in *actual* events. Yes, training is important, but it is important because you take every mental note you took during the last actual event and work on that.

    Conor gassed because
    1. You can't train for a high profile event without high profile event (boxing match) as your template. You just can't anticipate how to *calm* your adrenaline during the actual event. You can box 48 rounds no problem and then in the live even have an adrenaline rush that you just don't get from training negate your entire conditioning training. Wladimir Klitschko was a great fighter, and that was his Achilles' heel he never mastered.
    2. He came to win and he knew he had to get respect early and even a couple of rounds. If Conor went into round 7 with only 0 to 2 rounds won, he'd have to start taking chances that Floyd would have capitalized on. So all that conserved energy would have been meaningless.

    EDIT: Mayweather should have been in control from the opening bell. Conor's only chance should have been a one in a million shot that catches an overconfident Mayweather early on. Conor surpassed that and then some.

    Canelo v. GGG will hopefully return all the fans boxing lost tonight. I've become so disillusioned with boxing the past couple of years that I'm starting to not recognize the names of the up and comers.
     
    SergeyX2017 likes this.
  9. heels1785

    heels1785 JCC/PT/New Films Manager star 8 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Dec 10, 2003
    Eesh. Have to disagree. Really poor form in Conor's boxing, and the cardio should have been the concern from day 1. He should have enough experience from a handful of big fights in the UFC to know what the adrenaline rush is like, and how his body reacts. He'll get credit for getting in the ring with a 50-0 boxer, but he did not look good, by any stretch of the imagination.

    Floyd did what he always does - if anything, he was more aggressive tonight. It absolutely sucks to watch, yes. It has ruined what could have been otherwise great fights, yes. However, Conor wasn't exactly swinging for the fences in the early rounds, either - just attempts to jab mixed in with hammer fists and attempting to punch Floyd while standing behind him (?) and taunt. Floyd was just being the pompous ass that he generally is, and offered nothing whatsoever in the early rounds - Conor wasn't good, he was just a bit more active than his completely inactive opponent, thus the early round wins. Rafael even gave the first round to Floyd, as did a few others.

    I'm not judging Conor as a neophyte, nor am I grading him on a curve. He has years of experience as a fighter, and sought this fight out on his own. He wrote checks with his bravado that his performance ultimately could not cash. Some on Twitter are saying that this was a "great night for MMA" - it's not. Conor got his ass beat, decisively so, after spending 6 months running his mouth.

    Again, we both said this fight was stupid from the beginning, and I think that's the one thing we can agree on - it was ultimately bad for the sport and rather ridiculous.

    Best moment of the fight was the referee shoving Floyd into his corner. That was worth the price of - watching the fight on Twitch.
     
    SergeyX2017 likes this.
  10. SergeyX2017

    SergeyX2017 Jedi Knight star 3

    Registered:
    Jan 14, 2017
    Mayweather is an abuser of women. That alone makes me dislike the guy...
     
  11. DAR

    DAR Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jul 8, 2004
    Was at a friends for a combo Fantasy Football draft/fight. It was better than I thought it would be
     
    Point Given likes this.
  12. heels1785

    heels1785 JCC/PT/New Films Manager star 8 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Dec 10, 2003
    He is a vile human being. An effective defensive boxer who excelled during an era of lessened competition in the sport. But first and foremost, a vile human being. As is his uncle.

    Conor, to my knowledge, is a fine human being. Family man, young son. Public persona of a brash guy who likes to flaunt wealth, but no evidence of him being a bad guy.

    Neither factored into how I watched the fight, though, from a technical boxing perspective.
     
  13. Jester J Binks

    Jester J Binks Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 19, 2016
    Had this been an MMA fight, do you think Floyd would have lasted until round 4? Do you think he would have performed better than expected? I don't. It would have been a fast and humiliating loss. That is what Floyd had to do last night. He didn't. It should have looked like the Arturo Gatti fight, but maybe even faster and more humiliating. The fact that it went nothing like that is both a credit to McGregor and discredit to Floyd. Floyd's 50-0 really needs an asterisk now. (And people talked about Roy Jones fighting less thans)

    The boxing forum watching round by round essentially had the entire forum embarrassed for their sport as it was happening.

    As far as the UFC preparing Conor for "the event" in terms of anticipation, it can only do so much. You always have that adrenaline rush. You learn to tailor it to the situation. It is why they talk about home field advantage. This was home field advantage on steroids. The ring, the crowd, the spectacle, the climate, the rules, the equipment, the ref, the judging ... just about everything was not "automatic" for Conor. Even the *striking* is different. An MMA strike is quite different from a boxer's punch. I have no doubt that if Conor were allowed to fight 2 to 5 pro fights before his debut at the top level, he would have done significantly better and not lost simply because he couldn't catch his breath. But we both know that Mayweather would then find a way to not fight McGregor under those conditions. Heck, he could have at least allowed 4oz gloves. One concession amongst thousands. It would have changed little on the outcome, but at least would have shown Floyd to be somewhat of a sportsman

    As far as Fat Dan giving Floyd the first round, the fact that the round was even in question is why Conor "won the event" and Floyd lost it. Or I should say, boxing lost it. Conor didn't win the round from a lucky punch. Conor had decent footwork, a decent jab, landed a couple of uppercuts and had Floyd missing. And the fact that we are even talking about Conor's JAB is a testament to Conor.

    Everybody knew Conor had only a one in a trillion chance to actually win. So it comes down to performance expectations. Conor exceeded his and Floyd fell far short.
     
    Lord-Skywalker and JEDI-RISING like this.
  14. Juliet316

    Juliet316 JCC Game Winner star 10 VIP - Game Winner

    Registered:
    Apr 27, 2005
    If this was MMA I doubt this would have even gone past round one, as Conor would have been allowed to do a lot more in there than simply punching.
     
    Lord-Skywalker and JEDI-RISING like this.
  15. Lord-Skywalker

    Lord-Skywalker Jedi Master star 1

    Registered:
    Jul 8, 2002
    Other than the official result, a major win for McGregor and an embarrising victory to put Mayweather in the record books that will always be followed by the word 'but.'
     
    Juliet316 and Jester J Binks like this.
  16. A Chorus of Disapproval

    A Chorus of Disapproval New Films Fearless Vampire Killer star 8 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Aug 19, 2003
    Sorry I missed this post earlier, as it is incredibly accurate. Alvarez/Golovkin is such a monumental bout. We have had a viewing party lined up for months.



    EDIT: The misguided belief that boxing is "simply punching" may very well be the reason an MMA fighter was shocked when an actual boxer completely altered his strategy in the 4th round.
     
    heels1785 and Juliet316 like this.
  17. Jester J Binks

    Jester J Binks Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 19, 2016
    TBH, I didn't know this until you posted it. My initial thought was "well, it is Fat Dan. Somebody that can be quite insightful, but has also shown extreme bias." Rafael has followed up with:

    Who are the few others? If they get paid for their boxing opinions, they should be given pink slips. Too many people set this whole thing up as MMA v. boxing ... one ring to rule them all. It's stupid. I think much of the bias wasn't for Mayweather or Conor as much as somebody like a Rafael thinking his job is to save boxing instead of just giving an honest assessment. The boxing forums were confident during the lead up, scared and embarrassed during the fight and now in hilarious damage control post fight. Everything from Floyd was toying with Conor from the opening bell (he wasn't) to it was scripted (tin foil hat).

    Boxing was hurt last night not because it says anything about the skill and technique of boxing. The #1 reason Conor lost (outside of fatigue) is that having limitations in a sport is an art form. No hands in soccer/futbol. Does that mean it isn't up to par? No. It is a discipline. That limitation of just using your "fists" means you have to get everything out of those fists. That includes feints, misdirection, combo set up, angles, etc. And you have to do all that while maintaining the power of the actual punch. Conor did great on the former, but failed in the latter. His uppercut in round 1 was great skill in the former, but he couldn't combine it with the power that would have immediately stopped Floyd from adopting the low and forward head style. Boxing as a style/technique is still as great as it ever was.

    Boxing the sport was (and has been for a long time) slaughtered. Last night should have been no more than an unofficial exhibition with absolutely no bearing on a win-loss record. It should have been on the undercard of GGG v. Canelo. It can't because of networks and promoters. The business of boxing is killing boxing. It isn't a sport. It is practically "pro wrestling" at this point.
     
  18. bizzbizz

    bizzbizz Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 16, 2015
    conor was much better then i thought he was but his weakness has always been cardio he throws everything and then gasses same thing happened in the diaz fight when he got made to tap

    this fight made floyd look terrible conor was gassed legs stuffed and he still couldn't finish him. as for conors claim it was an early stoppage he does get wobbly when tired and in actual mma fights he has came back and won when gassed before he is also a warrior who doesnt want the ref to end it

    in the end the result says mayweather wins and 50-0 but mcgregor 5 years ago was on welfare and was being supported by his gf and now he just got paid over a 100m for a fight in a sport he had no experience in

    had a laugh about twitter people saying dirty tactics by mcgregor the hammer fist is second nature to mma it was pure instinct
     
    Juliet316 likes this.
  19. MrMojoRisin

    MrMojoRisin Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jun 20, 2005
    Everyone assumed that Mayweather would win anyway. McGregor was out of his element and out gunned. But he held his own for 10 rounds against the best boxer in the last 20 years. I call that a hell of a fight.
     
    Luke02 likes this.
  20. Luke02

    Luke02 Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Sep 19, 2002
    It was though at the end of the day a glorified exhibition which it should been since Day 1. Conor is not a professional boxer no matter what Nevada Athletic Commission says. It was a fun fight and Conor did himself well all things being equal but the fact that fight actually counted for both guys was just silly. Had Floyd lost I would felt the same way too. He should not been 50-0 after this fight just like he should not been 49-1 either.
     
    MrMojoRisin likes this.
  21. Jester J Binks

    Jester J Binks Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 19, 2016
    Let's not get carried away. The fight was horrible. It is only *good* because of the lowered expectations of a non-boxer being surpassed.

    This guy was totally ignored the entire fight
    [​IMG]

    Floyd turned his back on McGregor multiple times a round. The ref should have been warning, taking away points and threatening a DQ on Floyd so he'd stop that BS.

    Then there was the problem of breaking the fighters. The rules are that they are not to be broken unless both hands are not punching. Multiple times, Conor was still punching with his free hand.

    And after rewatching, the stoppage was premature. There was talk of Conor not punching for a minute, but that was a lie. Conor was throwing 13 seconds prior to the stoppage. Neither fight was truly in danger of being hurt. Both were feather fisted (relative to pro boxers).

    If you want to see a great fight, then watch this one.
     
  22. CT-867-5309

    CT-867-5309 Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Jan 5, 2011
    I don't even like Mayweather, but there are some hysterical posts in this thread.


    Actually, yeah, the kind that don't knock you out are the worst kind, because you just keep taking them. It's absolutely conventional thinking.

    It's never really been his style, he often gives away the early rounds, studying his opponent, getting their timing down, finding their openings, staying cautious early on while they still have their best punches. He opens up later when his opponent is fatigued and less of a threat.

    This is how many older, veteran, "slick" boxers fight, including Bernard Hopkins. It's strategy.

    No, it doesn't need an asterisk at all, and it's completely crazy to suggest it does. Like, 100% insane.

    Floyd has never really been a bulldozer, he doesn't run people over. Not his style, and even less likely to happen at 40. Not sure why you'd expect him to suddenly wipe a guy out.



    No, there won't be a but, nor should there be. The guy is, without a doubt, an all-time great, with a singular record.

    The fight went the distance? I thought it was a TKO?

    That's not how this works.

    Wut?

    You know Floyd has done this like a million times, right? He used to do it every single fight when he was young. He used to have conversations with the damn ring commentators. He'd literally turn to them and say something, circle around the ring, come back and finish what he was saying.

    First, that's not true. The last punch Conor threw was a weak little tap to the body at 2:20, and the fight was stopped around 1:56 (1:55 officially, I believe). Second, Conor was completely done and not resisting. Hell, they (probably) would have stopped the fight in the UFC if a fighter looked like that. I've seen it before.

    Being feather fisted doesn't really matter, Conor was completely defenseless, and the punches add up. We know that fighters have been killed going the distance against opponents with little power. Floyd was teeing off. End of fight.
     
    heels1785 likes this.
  23. Jester J Binks

    Jester J Binks Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 19, 2016
    First, you can't compare this fight to recent fights like Canelo and Pacquiao. You compare this fight to the Gatti fight, except Gatti has more boxing skill and quite a bit more stamina.

    It's strategy to take an uppercut-hook combo in round one from a D level boxer? Sorry, but no. Did you see the fight? Conor was showing fatigue as soon as round four.

    Ok. So I'm positive you didn't see the fight. You are talking about a shoulder roll. This is not a shoulder roll.
    [​IMG]

    I don't know if you can comment on people making hysterical posts if you didn't actually watch the fight.
     
    bizzbizz likes this.
  24. bizzbizz

    bizzbizz Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 16, 2015
    yeah the ref stopped the fight because he was gassed not one of those punches did much even wobbly legs floyd still couldnt drop him
     
    Jester J Binks likes this.
  25. CT-867-5309

    CT-867-5309 Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Jan 5, 2011
    I'm not comparing it to any fight, I'm telling you the style Floyd has shown over his entire career, especially as he's gotten older. He has a very long history of giving away the first four rounds, only to win every round after. It's intentional.

    You're the one calling for it to be like Gatti, a fight from TWELVE years ago.

    So, like, the exact time Floyd started winning rounds?


    Calling for asterisks and a DQ on an undefeated, surefire all-time great is completely hysterical.