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  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

Full Series The Clone Wars - 5.20 - The Wrong Jedi (Season Finale) - discussion thread

Discussion in 'Star Wars TV- Completed Shows' started by Seerow, Feb 27, 2013.

  1. Arrian

    Arrian Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Aug 15, 2011
    It is indeed. A bioweapon in fact. She sacrificed herself to save the Chosen One, Obi-Wan and the entire city of Naatan.
     
  2. 07jonesj

    07jonesj Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Aug 16, 2010
    I'm just under 12 parsecs old! :p

    It's a unit of time, not a unit of distance, am I right?
     
  3. ImNotAStarWarsFanboy

    ImNotAStarWarsFanboy Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Feb 25, 2011
    Dammit!
     
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  4. Darth Ibonek

    Darth Ibonek Jedi Knight star 2

    Registered:
    Jan 11, 2013
    Speaking of Yaddle, I'd hate to see a Sith/Dark-sider of Yoda's species ever in Star Wars.
     
    pronker likes this.
  5. phatdude1138

    phatdude1138 Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 2, 2005
    Because I'm awesome :p j/k LOL. Actually I appreciate the kind words. I'm used to getting annihilated in the EP7 forum.

    I totally agree that he has more stories in him. I think we need to see his transformation from being the caring Master, to only caring about his own agenda. We can now start exploring the deeper relationship between him and Padme. Losing Ahsoka will give him more "me time".

    This is why it hit me so hard as well. I don't have daughters of my own, but I'm very close to my nieces. I remember going to see the Special Editions of Star Wars with them in 1997 when they were just 5 years old. Now they are 20 and it's hard to "let them go". Go out into the world and be adults :( Actually my 20yo niece and I watched this episode together yesterday. I had to actually leave the room during the last 5 minutes of this episode because of how emotional it was. When she graduated high school she even said she was my Padawan, and I was her Jedi master. But looking back on that episode now, it's just like real life: we have to let them grow up. My niece and I are optimistic she will survive and have some great stories.
     
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  6. Seerow

    Seerow Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 7, 2011
    Lets focus more on this episode here guys. TY.

    HallowedPhoenix
    Great point about Barriss actually including herself when she was saying the entire order should burn. I forgot about that. Makes me more confident she did not intend to take Ahsoka as a partner actually.
     
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  7. Narutakikun

    Narutakikun Jedi Knight star 4

    Registered:
    Nov 8, 2012
    They know, or should know, that the war is wrong. And it's not whether they know that the government is corrupt, but whether they ought to know. Too much ivory tower; not enough time on the streets.
     
  8. phatdude1138

    phatdude1138 Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 2, 2005
    The more I think about it, it's 100% Barriss had help. She can't manufacture the bio weapons herself. And I'm sure wherever she got them from didn't give them away cheap.

    Since it looks like the Barriss part in this episode seems to be the biggest let down, maybe in Season 6 they can pick up investigating more of where and how Barriss acquired all this and how it was planned without there knowledge. However that is a reoccurring theme in the Jedi Order: they have no clue there is a clone army being produced. The have no clue Sidious is running the show. They really seem clueless.
     
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  9. HallowedPhoenix

    HallowedPhoenix Jedi Padawan star 1

    Registered:
    Feb 18, 2013
    What I think Barriss was looking for from Ahsoka in that scene was validation. Someone else who could understand the immense pain and grief she was feeling, and more importantly, her need to act on it. Ahsoka did not offer this, however, and instead told Barriss straight up that she felt "I have to believe that one way or another, this woman is going to pay for what she did."

    This is important because the person she is referring to is Barriss. She's effectively telling Barriss, though Ahsoka does not realize it, that she wants her to burn for these crimes, that they are wrong. This correlates as well with Ahsoka's disapproval when speaking with Tarkin about removing the Jedi from the Military.

    Looking back, I think that scene was Barriss reaching out for Ahsoka, trying to find something in her friend that could understand why she was doing this, but found nothing. Ahsoka wants the Jedi to remain in the conflict, or at least as much is insinuated, and she thinks whoever is behind the bombing needs to pay for it.

    I think Barriss' last look after Ahsoka in that scene was one of pain, knowing that perhaps her closest friend is so opposed to what she is doing that she would likely be disgusted if she ever found out, and instead of finding some level of validation only served to show that every Jedi, even one she is close to, is exactly the thing she is trying to tear down.
     
  10. Circular Logic

    Circular Logic Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 3, 2013
    Absolutely this. That's also why I feel after all her experiences in this arc, Ahsoka will become an even better Jedi. How ironic because she then chooses leaves the order of her own volition. Despite all she's been put through, she never once gave into despair and she emerges far stronger from it; whereas for all their wisdom, the Council is largely blind to the plight of the greater populace not just in the Coruscant underworld but the galaxy at large. That blindness is just one of the many factors that lead to their annihilation in RotS.
     
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  11. DARTHKANISS

    DARTHKANISS Jedi Grand Master star 1

    Registered:
    Sep 8, 2004
    So did Bariss turn to the dark side? She was pretty excited about the red sabers.
     
  12. HallowedPhoenix

    HallowedPhoenix Jedi Padawan star 1

    Registered:
    Feb 18, 2013
    I don't think so.

    I think as it stands, Barriss is very much in a grey area. She's a bit dark side and a bit light side.
     
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  13. Circular Logic

    Circular Logic Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 3, 2013
    I think the comic Yoda: Dark Rendezvous Dooku speculated that had Yoda ever fallen into the Dark Side, he would have the potential to become even more powerful than Darth Sidious himself. Just think about that for a moment.
     
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  14. phatdude1138

    phatdude1138 Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Feb 2, 2005
    Agree^^^ Bravo, well said!

    In the end this little unassuming Padawan actually "figures it out". Something the Jedi Council couldn't. I would say she becomes the better "Jedi", but Jedi at this point is almost a negative term. She becomes the better person. She's smart enough to get out, why they stay UNCHANGED and inevitably almost all die because of it.
     
  15. StarWarsFan91

    StarWarsFan91 Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Oct 14, 2008
    Yes, she is evil, and because she also so happens to be a force user, making her a darksider.

    What else do you call someone who can intentionally murder innocents just to prove a point, and even accuse an innocent of false wrong, that could lead to said innocents death?

    Though maybe this could lead to a future redemption arc.......

    After all, she could get more character development, maybe she would show regret for her evil actions, if she appears in the possible season 6, and if she is truly sorry for what she did and strives to be a good person, then she would cease to be evil.
     
  16. QuangoFett

    QuangoFett Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jun 11, 2011
    I think it was more that she is conscious of how she has dipped into the darkness through her actions and now "deserves" the red sabres as a mark of what she has become. She makes this remark in bitterness and mocking to Anakin, the arch-militarist thug of the Jedi Order, who she sees as no better than her.

    Crucially, she doesn't exempt the other Jedi from this condemnation of herself. This is largely shown in the episode.
     
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  17. Darth Ibonek

    Darth Ibonek Jedi Knight star 2

    Registered:
    Jan 11, 2013
    [​IMG]
     
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  18. 07jonesj

    07jonesj Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Aug 16, 2010
    StarWarsFan91 In her mind, the longer the Jedi stayed in this conflict, the more people would die, and the more corrupt the Order would become. If you were given the option to kill ten people to save ten million, would you take it?

    Barriss did. Simply calling her a darksider is to be ignorant of her true intentions, I feel.
     
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  19. Circular Logic

    Circular Logic Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 3, 2013
    StarWarsFan91
    I suppose if characters like Darth Vader and Darth Revan can be redeemed, then so can Barriss. This is Star Wars after all.

    07jonesj
    I agree that Barriss is a Well-Intentioned Extremist or Knight Templar, but her actions I feel have already skirted the Dark Side, whether she knows it or not.
     
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  20. StarWarsFan91

    StarWarsFan91 Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Oct 14, 2008
    Sometimes men cause destruction.....believing what they do...is right, that the actions they do, are saving future life, all the while blinded by the evil in there own hearts.

    Most of the time, evil men actually do not see themselves as evil.

    Just because SHE felt what she was doing was right and not evil, doesn't make it so. For many act in the name of good, but are unforuntly creating the opposite.

    And yes she is a darksider. She doesn't need Sith eyes, or to be stereotypically evil, or cackling like a mad man, to show that she is a darksider.

    She is a murderer, who no remorse of her actions. So yes i can call her those names, because that is what she is.
     
  21. Convor

    Convor Jedi Knight star 2

    Registered:
    Feb 25, 2011
    [​IMG]

    I quite enjoyed this arc, and this episode in particular, but I'll reserve my full analysis for the rating thread.
     
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  22. Darth Ibonek

    Darth Ibonek Jedi Knight star 2

    Registered:
    Jan 11, 2013
    I still love how she has a heart on her belt.
     
  23. Seerow

    Seerow Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Jun 7, 2011
    I consider Barriss perhaps well intention. But there is not way one can execute such cold and callous plans and not be brushing the darkside. Even letting Ventress win. She even admits Ventress's lightsabers suit her.
     
  24. 07jonesj

    07jonesj Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Aug 16, 2010
    I have a soft spot for characters who do evil things, knowing full well that the actions they are taking are wrong, to try to achieve a better future. It's a character archetype I think can work really darn well.
     
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  25. StarWarsFan91

    StarWarsFan91 Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Oct 14, 2008
    Even Anakin felt remorse for the evil he caused on the Tuskens, he knew what he did was wrong (sort of shown when in a few episodes ago, he mentioned how wanting revenge was wrong/not the jedi way), unlike Barriss in this episode.

    Denying your evil, and saying said actions were still right, is a sure sign in star wars, that said someone is evil. Anakin not showing remorse or regret after murdering innocents including children in ROTS, really showed that he had become evil.
     
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