Full Series The Clone Wars- Episode 111: Dooku Captured Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)

True, but Obi-Wan has a good amount of skill as well, yet he's not in the same league as Yoda, Mace, or Dooku.

 

High Five!

Less potential =/= Less Power.

RotS Anakin is but a learner next to the mastery of Darth Vader.

You've visited Save Our Darth: Darth Vader in Lit, right?

When Obi-Wan Kenobi leaves the room, apparantly. (Or did everyone just forget about him? )

Anakin, too, I guess since he was also on the Council.

 

And these same debates keep coming up again and again.

If the Force power potential is based on midichlorians, and Vader is "more machine than man", why wouldn't he have less Force power?

We've got that other "who is the most powerful Force user?" thread that continues to lurk in LACWAC for some reason, and it's so obviously down to opinion at this point, it makes me laugh.


I actually think an episode where Kenobi/Skywalker/Dooku have to work together to escape might be cool, but bringing Jar-Jar into it just gives me a bad feeling...

 

Are you arguing that Anakin is more skilled and powerful than Yoda in The Phantom Menace?

 

I had the word "potential" in there for a reason.

 

Exactly.

 

Oh, there's no doubt there.

20 years or whatever (I can never remember) between ROTS and ANH, with nothing to do but practice choking Admirals will do that for you.

Anakin was basically a streetballer with mad skillz, Vader an All-NBA.

 

Why would he?

 

Fair enough.

I was just confused, since M_S and myself were talking about the difference between actualised power and potential and there being no reason for Vader to be less powerful than Anakin just because he, apparantly, has less potential.

Your response was a bit weird in light of that.

 

I don't want to get any farther off-topic, but I believe M_S said "his current view that Vader is less powerful than ROTS Anakin doesn't make sense" or something similar.

It all depends how you define "powerful", I suppose.

At any rate, let's try to stick to Dooku Captured.

Watched it for the second time.



- The animation really is great when Obi-Wan sneaks aboard the frigate.

- I kinda wish they had included the webcomic content in the episode. I think only a very short time has passed since Anakin's capture, which is probably why Dooku hasn't killed him yet. Plus, the fact that Sidious is interested in him might stay his hand as well.

- the banter between Anakin and Obi-Wan is funny, but how many times has Anakin been "captured"? Has this ever happened before? The banter doesn't make sense that way....

- also, wouldn't Anakin be able to sense which path Dooku took on the ship? Or are we assuming Dooku is cloaking himself in the Force?

- Obi-Wan's face looks much better in this episode; less angular, and with more movement.

- nice to see Anakin freaking out for once "He's getting too close!" instead of Kenobi.

- tsk tsk, the Jedi don't have seatbelts.

- did Dooku put on the homing beacon for help, or for the pirates?

- I love how Obi-Wan is cleaning his lightsaber whilst Anakin deals with the Gundark.

- with the whole poison gas thing, it's still weak, but I suppose one could argue that Our Heroes were exhausted from fighting the Gundark and moving rocks, and they couldn't summon the Force energy to hold their breath AND move the rocks away.

- I doubt this will happen, but it would be pretty cool if Dooku made a plea to Our Heroes for them to join his cause. I know he did it to Obi-Wan in AOTC, but he should keep trying. Convince them to join with him to start a New Jedi Order or something.

- ha ha, I missed the Weequay pat the barmaid on the bum, and then she slaps him!

- okay, the next episode might not be as bad as I first thought. I just hope we don't get Jar-Jar bumbling his way around to a ludicrous degree like he did on Naboo in TPM.

 

Loved the episode.

Favorite line: "Is it civilized?" from Dooku. It perfectly captured his
aristocratic semi-snootyness.

Does anyone think that Palpatine sent Representative Binks because he knew Jar-Jar would
screw things up royally and pave the way for Dooku's escape? Or is this some
kind of odd follow up to Palpatine's newly found "respect" for Jar-Jar following
Bombad Jedi?

 

Yeah, I dunno about Jar-Jar. The fact that he was in on the secret discussions with the Pirate King was unlikely in the first place.

But as we previously discussed, there was no one in that scene that we haven't already seen in TCW: Yoda, Mace, Plo, Padme, Palpatine, Jar-Jar, so I assume it's for budgetary reasons.

 

Exactamundo.

 

It makes no sense for the Supreme Chancellor to send the Naboo Representative to deliver ransom money for a war prisoner. This sits completely outside the tasks of a system-specific representative......

 

I think it's the GFFA equivalent of sending the work-experience kid out for a left-handed screwdriver

 

And thus we come back around to this idea that Anakin was more powerful than Yoda in TPM....

M_S was spot on, IMO, because potential and power are two different things.

Haha, fair enough.

I'm actually going to go out on a severed limb and suggest that Dooku, as a Force-cloudy Sith Lord, is responsible for *all* the dodgy stuff with the Jedis' Force senses in this episode.

I mean... Anakin, you fool, if you didn't sense Kenobi's death, why did you think he was dead?

Am I the only person who hopes that they out Jar-Jar as a Force Sensitive?

It would explain a lot.

 

I liked it. I didn't focus on the technical stuff like why Padme was talking with those pirate guys. It did cross my mind though in a "Pfft, who does she think she is?" kinda way, but it was quickly dismissed. I just liked the banter between Obi-Wan and Anakin. I didn't feel like it was much, but everyone's different.

I did begin the episode a little confused. I thought I missed an episode at first when it went on to explain that Anakin was captured and Obi-Wan was flying around in a spacesuit. It was kinda easy to infiltrate that military ship, but eh. I just dismissed that too. I just liked the episode because it gave us another casual day in the lives of Obi-Wan and Anakin.

 

Because he has the same midichlorian count?

 

Kenobi didn't think Anakin was dead when he left Mustafar, he just assumed he would be dead pretty soon afterwards.

I mean, I don't have probems with Kenobi not being able to sense it halfway across the Galaxy.

Shhh! You cannot give away the secret that the counts are per-cell!

 

I was going to respond, but I already warned you guys to stay on topic. Please.

Positive reviews for Dooku Captured:

IO9.COM

IGN

BIG SHINY ROBOT

 

Yay! Another fun episode. I enjoyed this one very much (right up there with Cloak of Darkness)... and it felt very Lucas-ian. LOL.

I loved the opening how it almost seemed like part 2 and we came in the middle of the action with Anakin already having been captured and Obi-wan on his way to get him back. I had some initial reservations about their plan (did Anakin find Dooku's ship? Did he get captured and brought to Dooku's ship?) but I quickly forgot about this as I got caught up in the action. I absoluetly loved the parts with Anakin and Obi-wan on board the Seppy's ship. The dialogue was spot on and matched up with ROTS... right down to the bit with Anakin going "oh, it's you" to Obi-wan. It made me smile and it made the whole elevator scene it ROTS that much cooler when Obi-wan says the same line to Anakin.

The action and space escape was fun, and the little touches like Dooku's pilot droid from the end of AOTC being back briefly. Clearly, Dave has done his homework, whereas someone else might have just substitued another droid.

It was cool to see a Gundark... though I would have admittedly enjoyed the scene more if we didn't seem to have our heroes fighting off some giant monster every other episode. It's getting old and I hope we go a while without seeing another monster fight.

It was so great to have Obi-wan and Anakin teamed up, but (save the exception of Anakin going after Dooku alone at the beginning) it was pretty much the same Anakin from ROTS. I thought we were going to see him mature from AOTC to the man he is in ROTS during the course of this show? Isn't that the point of Ahsoka being there? If he is already that man, why do we need Ahsoka? Still, I did like this Anakin a lot. Obi-wan, on the other hand, I still have issues with. His voice is just not cutting it for me. The accent is good enough, but there is no passion. Everything is delievered in the same tone. Ewan McGregor did have those cool, sly moments of speech, but he also was able to raise his voice and show real concern. The actor voicing him here always seems like he is trying to hard to show how cool Obi-wan is, and it's insulting to the character. He is more than that. I'm not sure if it's the actor or the directing, but.... it doesn't quite work for me yet.

The pirates were great. Though, for me, Dooku gave up too easy. He has to have a plan or something. He just goes along with them... I don't know, something was missing there. And how did he not realize his lightsabers were gone? Was there a deleted scene? And the pirate leader says to Anakin and Obi-wan that Dooku put up a fight -- but when was that??

Anyway, the episode ends a little soft, but I'm excited for next week. At least I was until I heard Jar Jar is going to be in it, which can only mean one thing... total and utter fail. But then again, that's pretty smart of Palpatine to send him to muck things up, isn't it?

 

I do really like that the episode started In medias res.

 

RE: Dooku's capture. I was thinking there has to be some grand plan from Dooku, like he as made a deal with the Weequay for Skywalker and Kenobi.. but perhaps the Pirates have betrayed him and intend to sell him to the Republic and Skywalker & Kenobi to the Seps.

He must have made the deal after they landed and he gave them his "I'm a Sith Lord" speech. Otherwise he went down way too easy -- and it still doesn't explain how he lost his two lightsabers! Did they drug him on the ship? And wouldn't he have noticed immediatly that his two weapons were gone? I would, if I was in hostile territory. It just made him look stupid -- so that was bad writing.

I also didn't like how all the pirates were the same species -- but I'll let that slide since I know how tricky building characters is. But -- guys -- this is SW. It is populated by strange aliens and creatures, so you're going to have to step it up and render some background aliens. It can't just be one alien species of the week. Sorry. I'd much rather see new species then yet another big monster for our heroes to fight. What's the point of this new animation style if you can't do anything with it?!

And you also have to be careful about how the Jedi sense things -- with them missing life forms right around the corner and stuff. It works with the droids, though I still say Anakin should be able to sense droids (it would be a cool trait to show that he really is the best Jedi around if he was the only one who could do that) as it is now he's not that much more special than other Jedi. Anyway, there's only so many times a Jedi can walk into a room without sensing a giant monster before we notice these things and point them out. Kind of like how you used OT dialogue in every episode for a while there.

One more thing: I hear Jar Jar is in next week's episode. I'm not the biggest Jar Jar hater... he was fine in the prequels... but I really think his stuff should be kept separate from the main stuff/main characters... Bombad Jedi is a good example of this. I'm tired of seeing him bubbling around. There is nothing new there. I get that you are on a mission to redeem him but (still reserving judgement until next week) it feels like you are in danger of forcing him down our throats. And I would hate for the enjoyment of this week's part one to be tainted by a bad conclusion.

 

I'm sure that if the Jar Jar episode had much more space between it and the last one (yeah, 3 episodes seems too little, I agree) we wouldn't mind it so much....if that happened, the only people complaining would be the obsessive Jar Jar haters or the people who genuinely think Jar Jar episodes aren't what they like. The rest of us would just watch it without prejudice. Because Star Wars fans are that generous, right? XD

Still. I do hope that we get only a limited amount of Jar Jar per episode. I think that two or three, maybe four at a stretch, per season is enough for him, when you've got over twenty other episodes in the season that focus on other things. If we put things in perspective, and if Wookieepedia's episode guide is dependable, it would seem that we won't be seeing Jar Jar in such a big role for a long time (unless he assists Padme and Commander Fox, and that's six episodes after Gungan General). Not only that, but it seems that the Jar Jar/Others ratio is quite generous to us, all things considered.

So really. I think that we don't have too much to worry about. Chillax and enjoy the show.