The Clone Wars: Episode 208: Brain Invaders Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)

Discussion in 'Star Wars TV' started by Garth Maul, Dec 1, 2009.

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  1. Rogue...Jedi Administrator Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jan 12, 2000
    star 7
    Finally saw this last night... solid episode, I was pretty happy with it. I liked how they showed Anakin's darker side coming out, as well as the interaction between Ahsoka and Barris.

    My parents didn't think much of what they saw, but that's not exactly surprising :p
  2. swcolts1977 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Nov 17, 2009
    star 1
    Not much to add to what everyone's said, but I loved this episode, top 5 for sure. Solid writing, acting, directing, editing, music, animation, sound design, and whatever else.

    It was very creepy and it just felt like old-school Star Wars. That interregation scene was a holy crap moment and the suspense in the entire episode felt real. This episode was a turing point in the series for me, TCW ha finally become the series it was meant to be: a fantastic adventure/fantasy show for kids and adults with more mature themes.
  3. obi-rob-kenobi4 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 17, 2007
    star 4
    I agree that this episode was a turing point in the show and hopefully it will get darker or at least maintain the level set by this episode.

    I absolutely loved this whole 4 episode ark and hope they do many more long 4 and 5 episode story arcs because thats *EXACTLY* what this show needs in order to become engaging. I hope we go right into ANOTHER long story arc after this, that way the show will actually be something to follow like the old genndy clone wars show use to be. I remember it was absolutely unthinkable to miss one episode of that show because each episode was actually "important". It actually led up to something big. This show is getting there though, slowly but surely.

    The one thing i really think this show needs is more focus on the sith and how evil and threatening darth sidious and count dooku each are. There is too much focus on the pawns like ventris and even grevious. For example the holocron heist arc was a step in the right direction but not done in the right way. It could have been saved for the season finally and made a little more important and suspenseful with a sub plot of how palpatine always manages to cover his tracks explaining how the jedi can never find him. Now that would have been excellent.

    They basically just need to make him the puppet master again. I hope somewhere down the line they actually SHOW that it was him that ordered zero the hutt (and poggle & any other sep leaders) busted out of prison and i also hope they take the time to really explain how it has been him manipulating the whole war. These things are important and they have been ignored way too long IMO. [face_coffee]
  4. Garth Maul Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    May 18, 2002
    star 6
    obi-rob (nice to hear from you) - it's funny you say they need these thematic arcs a la the Genndy series, when in my mind, people enjoyed the Genndy series because they were 5 minute bursts of SW fun.

    I suppose you can argue in Genndy Season 2 it was more thematic with Anakin & Obi-Wan, but I think the new TCW series has been much more careful about trying to tie the various themes together. Don't get me wrongo, it's not like Genndy & co weren't sure to imply/outright mention things that would become important in ROTS/OT, he just didn't have time to develop character.

    The question in my mind is: is it more important to tell exciting Clone Wars adventures, or develop the characters? I'd love to see more of: Yoda, Mace, Plo Koon, Kit, Luminara, Aayla, Ventress, Dooku, Sidious, etc., but that necessitates taking away from Anakin, Ahsoka, Obi-Wan.

    I've already commented how Obi-Wan has gone from being arguably the main character in the PT to a character of less importance to Anakin & Ahsoka in TCW.
  5. Strika23 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 2, 2008
    star 2
    Awesome episode, I was amazed at the animation and how far they are pushing this series. Alot of important themes were introduced this episode and overall it felt really dark. Though I knew ashoka and bariss would come out alive, it still kept me on my feet. Seeing seven jedi in one episode was a plus as well!!

    I just hope they keep this "darker" side of anakin consistent with the rest of the series now. (other than prequel episodes that may come up like ep 16 last season where he may be a bit less dark)
  6. fanboyskywalker Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 3, 2008
    star 4
    The only thing I agree with is that we need more Dooku. And don't forget he's a pawn, too.
  7. fanboyskywalker Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 3, 2008
    star 4
    I feel like Anakin should have been the main focus of the PT and Obi-wan got a LOT of screen time, which makes him perhaps feel like the main character, but it's not really his story when you put it together with the classic trilogy. If you were to just watch the PT on it's own you could argue that it's about a Jedi who trains another Jedi and then has to stop him once his apprentice goes dark... but even there it's not quite set-up to be that.

    That said, I was really hoping TCW would give us more Obi-wan stories (because it's not really tied to the film series' drive to tell the story of the rise and fall of Anakin) and more Obi-wan/Anakin stories. But I do find that Obi-wan's gentle playfullness and compassion and understanding for Anakin are often missing, as if they are afraid of making Obi-wan look stupid. They are getting better, but with every two steps forward they take one step back where Obi-wan just seems to bitch slap Anakin for having an attachment. In the PT when Ewan McGregor did that it seemed like it was from a place of caring whereas the voice actor (forget his name at the moment) just seems cold.

    Also why does it have to be characters vs. story? Why can't it be story that serves great characters and we get both done well. Start with a cool premise, write awesome characters and have their actions drive the story.
  8. obi-rob-kenobi4 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 17, 2007
    star 4
    Thanks GARTH, its good to be back:).

    I feel that even though the Genndy series was short bursts of star wars fun there was still a big sense suspense when it came to waiting for the next episode and how what ever happens in that episode might be something meaningful towards ROTS. I also remember when ever Darth Sidious made an appearance it was this big meaningful event. The sith were very menacing in that series so i think it should be the same for this series.

    I have never been a big fan of so called "one-shot" episodes where it doesn't have anything to do with what came before or after it and TCW seems to be nothing but one shot episodes about something new and different each week. For the first season of the Genndy series it was almost totally about the battle of Munalist and the mysterious events surrounding it. Thats why i think the LAST season of TCW will be my favorite because it will actually lead into ROTS and feature major events and not have any room for random one-shot episodes.

    Anyways to answer your question, I think its more important to develop the characters than it is to tell exciting CW adventures. It would indeed be nice to have both tho.:-B
  9. Wookie Pnub Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 24, 2000
    star 1
    Ashoka does indeed seem to call them Ox and Edge...but the two guys from the Flying Hellfish were named Ox and Etch. Did they mean to reference The Simpsons but just got the name wrong, or a weird coincidence? :)
  10. Alpha-Red Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Apr 25, 2004
    star 5
    Am I the only one who wasn't all that shocked at Anakin choking Poggle? I suppose it is much darker compared to the series overall so far, but of all the Jedi on board the ship Anakin was the one for whom it would have been within character. Not to mention that he's done much worse things like killing the Tuskens on Tatooine.
  11. LAJ_FETT Tech Admin and Collecting/Games Mod

    Administrator
    Member Since:
    May 25, 2002
    star 8
    I just caught this episode today here in the UK. Excellent one! Anakin's 'interrogation scene' was a bit of a surprise though.

    The series is now on break here as well - it will resume at the end of January for us.
  12. Subach Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jul 27, 2008
    star 1
    "This is Ahsoka, come in."
    "Ahsoka, those worms are affected by the cold!"
    "Cold?!"


    Heh, it's just like a codec conversation in Metal Gear Solid.
  13. Fistofan55 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Sep 7, 2009
    star 3
    Does anyone feel that Poggle was the stronger character in that interrogation scene? Anakin had resort to the Dark Side, making him lack in power as who he is(as a Jedi). Vader can interrogate Poggle but Anakin can't. The other masters couldn't either. Gunray could hardly withstand Luminara and Bane revealed a little too much when saying "This conversation is over" after Mace brougt up the boss(Sidious).

    I just don't think Poggle has had a lot of credit.
  14. LawJedi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 11, 2009
    star 4
    So you're saying that Vader dominated over both Anakin and Poggle?
  15. dewback_rancher Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 23, 2009
    star 4
    Whoa. Just got a chance to see this episode on the official site. And I have to, again, say "Whoa."

    The brain worms in this episode were DEFINITELY more disgusting than the last one. In fact, I had to continually force my dinner back down every time they were on, whereas I took the worms in 'Legacy of Terror' without feeling the urge to hurl.

    In any case, kudos for them managing to pull stuff like that in a kids' show!

    Also, great to see Ahsoka getting some character development. She's one of my favorite Star Wars characters by now, and it's gratifying to see her starting to be portrayed in a way that's getting her far less flak than she used to.

    And what can I say about Anakin? Man, Vader is my all-time favorite Sith Lord, and I had to go drag my mom over to the computer and watch it again with her. My MOM even agreed that was an awesome scene. The Imperial March there just totally sold it, as did the shading on Anakin's face and the way you can actually SEE him just giving into it all.

    VERY well done moment, perhaps the best so far this season! XD
  16. Fistofan55 Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Sep 7, 2009
    star 3
    HA-HA NO. I'm saying that Anakin's choice of interrogation led to him giving into the Dark Side a little which measures that he is not as powerful as just a Jedi but to resort to darker one. I know that doesn't make much sense but point is, Poggle held out impressively and has been the only compentant Sep. Leader in the series.
    Gunray is greedy, a coward, selfish, and can be an idiot sometimes. Creates good humor though and I still like the character nontheless.
    Tambor is also greedy, selfish, and can be an idiot but doesn't have as much fear.
    Poggle, however, doesn't seem to be any of the above. He is only a coward when he knows he is defeated. He would've died if Anakin kept choking him. :D
  17. Barriss_Coffee Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 29, 2003
    star 6
    I've always held a lot of respect for Poggle. Of course, I'm partly biased because he has a badass history in the EU, but even from AOTC alone, he seemed capable of holding his own. When they bring him back (and I'm assuming they will at this point), I hope they maintain his capable-villain stature. He's really the only separatist we've seen so far who has any kind of a backbone (and I'm not sure he actually has one...).

    We really need more adept villains in this series.
  18. Jeff_Ferguson Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 15, 2006
    star 4
    Hey everyone,

    I'm finally caught up with The Clone Wars, so I thought I would drop by and share my thoughts on the latest episode, and tie those thoughts into my take on the series in general so far. I watched up until Bombad Jedi last year before kind of... forgetting to keep watching, but I found out recently that this series is a great one to watch an entire season of in a short period of time. Anyway, like I said, I'm caught up now, so I'll probably stop by here after every new episode from here on in.

    I really dug Brain Invaders. The standout moments for me definitely involved Anakin; his interrogation of Poggle was chillingly good characterization and a very well-placed departure from the usual (but nevertheless fantastic) heroic general we see him as. The worm infection turning the clones into badguys was a very good departure from the sorely-overdone chopping-droids-up that we've had thirty episodes of so far, and worked as an eerie foreshadowing of Order 66, and the line, "If there's one thing we clones know how to do, it's take down Jedi" was particularly effective in that regard. Even if I?m very hesitant to accept Barriss as being presented at the same age and development level as Ahsoka, it was pretty cool to see a Jedi vs. Jedi lightsaber duel.

    Regarding Anakin: I definitely agree with the sentiments regarding his portrayal in the series as being one of his best. The original trilogy told us tales of this heroic general who people remembered fondly, and then the prequels, and to a lesser extent their surrounding EU, painted a picture of a whiny and inherently dark teenager who nobody but Obi-Wan and Padme liked. Granted, late-Clone Wars EU and Revenge of the Sith did establish that especially towards the end of the war, Obi-Wan and Anakin were the ultimate heroes of the war, and could accomplish any mission that other Jedi couldn?t, but it?s still very refreshing to consistently see that kind of Anakin in action. Throughout season 1 and most of season 2 so far, we?ve seen Anakin heroically leading his troopers into battle, giving out orders and being concerned for each one of their lives, while still being Anakin and interpreting orders from the Jedi Council how he sees fit. And on top of it all, they seem to have a very good grasp of just why he?ll eventually fall to the dark side. Anakin falls because he wants to save everyone, particularly those close to him. And right from the beginning (the 2008 film), we saw Anakin, so blinded with rage when he thought that Ahsoka was dead and he hadn?t saved her, rush right past an Ahsoka who was duelling magna-guards and must have been radiating fear and adrenaline in the Force, without even noticing any trace of her aura. That really impressed me. The writers of this series do a fantastic job of giving us a heroic Anakin who still has all of this eventual darkness simmering beneath the surface --- seeing it come boiling up as he interrogated Poggle was needed, and was done very well (especially with the Imperial March motif playing in the background).

    I think that the series has been doing a good job of cycling through additional Jedi to use as principal characters for an episode or two --- so far, we?ve seen Plo Koon, Aayla Secura, Luminara, Barriss, Ki-Adi-Mundi, Mace, Kit Fisto, and apparently the next episode will give us Agen Kolar (who, groaningly enough, apparently looks like the already-dead Eeth Koth). The same goes for Sep baddies: There have been new ones like Lok Durd, who, as not-brainless-battle-droids, do wonders for validating the line ?There are heroes on both sides (not Durd in particular, but the idea of sentients leading the armies), but we?ve also seen Lot Dodd, Wat Tambor, and Poggle the Lesser, who all went relatively unused in the original Clone Wars EU. And I?ve been a big Gunray fan since 1999, so seeing him and seeing him done so well was a real treat.

    As entertaining as the series is, it is frustrating how obvious it is that there?s no overarching plan. For thirty episodes, it?s been the
  19. AvadaKenobi Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 2, 2009
    star 2
    [face_laugh] That's great, lol. I didn't catch that when I watched the episode, but when I watch it again, I'm gonna listen out for that and laugh myself silly.

    Was that David Hayter who said most of Snake's lines were just him repeating whatever the last person said? When you play those games, you just find yourself going, "Yes, Snake, he said Metal Gear! Geez, didn't you hear him?"
  20. TyvarunArx Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Dec 14, 2009
    LOL! I never noticed that it looked so much like a MGS codec conversation. Haha!

    Anyway, nice episode, nice to see the Padawans handle a zombie ship by themselves!
  21. Ludo_Kressh Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 30, 2005
    star 5
    Finally, finally, finally got to see this on the OS as well. Not as bad as I thought it would be, it had all the right moments of suspense and action and I liked the end.

    I liked how they got the parasites on baord the ship, having the clones maintain some sense of their own personality briefly was good, especially with the clone commander(btw, I liked their armor markings:D ) And I could tell that the padawans didn't want to kill the clones, the commander they pretty much didn't have a choice with because they didn't know what was affecting him. And I thought it was pretty ominous when they subdued Barriss and the clones said they know how to take out Jedi...a subtle foreshadowing to Order 66 perhaps?[face_thinking]

    Ahsoka was actually very mature in this one, her insights into her master actually surprised me, although since she sort of takes after him I guess she sees alot of that in herself. Speaking of which, I thought the Poggle interrogation scene was really dark, I liked how they played Vader's theme in the background as Anakin choked him...very well done.

    "She would have checked in!
    "Oh, like you always do..."
    "Good point..."
    [face_laugh] Gods, I love that Obi-Wan/Anakin banter!

    The end scene, it's good to see Anakin recognize how hard it is to let go of attachments, but will he practice what he preaches? But I agree she did the right thing in regards to that situation for she also could have killed the clones as well.

    Overall, it was a good episode and it did have all the elements of a good Star Wars episode,(right down to the coolant reactor room, which looked like it was from the Death Star.)I'm just glad that the arc has been resolved and they can move on.

  22. fanboyskywalker Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 3, 2008
    star 4
    Has it been resolved? Ended yes, but resolved? There are so many questions I have about these worms I don't even know where to begin.
  23. Ludo_Kressh Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 30, 2005
    star 5
    I meant the story itself...we'll have to wait and see if the worms show up again, but now that they know how to kill them it seems sort of pointless to use them again.
  24. XCell Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 7, 2004
    star 4
    Watched the episode again. No new episodes, so.. additional thoughts.

    -Anyone else think Barriss has weird lips?

    -Or that they were really showing off the Fisto smile in almost every scene that included him?

    -Or find it funny how infected-Barriss sounds when she says: "There you are, you can't get away from meeee". Karina-like?

    -The scene where -infected-Barriss coolly looks at Ahsoka through the laser-map was great.

    -Another great scene, after Anakin has his say to Ahsoka in the clinic, and she looks at Barriss and then out the window while that music plays.. Good stuff.

    So I would've liked more surprise or moments of doubt from the Padawans. I think they're giving them too much edge, making them too grownup. Though I'm glad Ahsoka got a more personal experience in this, in the end, it felt like 'just another mission' with her. And I wonder what Barriss will say about her decision when she comes around?
  25. Gry Sarth Ex 2x Banhammer Wielding Besalisk Mod

    Member Since:
    Jun 24, 1999
    star 5
    No, not me.

    It's always been that way. Everytime Fisto shows up he has to crack his signature smile (might be a nautolan thing...)

    I found that very strange, that's the only moment where any of the possessed characters sound different (apart from the clones speaking geonosian stuff). She almost sounded like Gollum there.
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