Full Series The Clone Wars: Episode 304: Sphere of Influence Discussion Thread

Ahsoka killed the droids and as mentioned she may not have wanted to take on living opponents, especially since the guards didn't come in with guns blazing. At that point they had been recaptured - so even if Ahsoka had defeated the guards they would have still been captured aboard the TF ship - and now with less diplomatic status. Ahsoka would have had to go on fighting and try to escape the ship entirely. I think she stopped because it was better that way - not giving in, but waiting for another opportunity to get out of it (a bit like Padme saying 'They win this round' in TPM). The Neimoidians were there so Ahsoka might have wanted to hear what they had to say and what they were going to do next. And it gave Chuchi a chance to negotiate with them.

 

A few points:

(1) Ahsoka might have simply realized it wasn't a time for using her saber anymore; it wasn't going to get them anywhere;

(2) in terms of Ahsoka easily destroying the droids compared to Di, in addition to the fatigue and terrain factors, Ahsoka has already been set up as an exceptional Padawan, AND, she probably has more experience hanging out with Kenobi and Skywalker than many very experienced Jedi;

(3) there's also the fact that I would wager a large sum of money that Lucas, when he started working on the prequels, thought about hundreds of Jedi killing thousands of troops and realized it might be a little too much for his PG rating, so he came up with the droid army concept; the same logic applies here.

This is something that DBrennan might actually like to argue - nothing wrong with Ahsoka destroying SBDs or child (clone) soldiers in ARC Troopers, but she can't kill a bunch of Neimoidian guards?

 

You made it sound like Ahsoka killed clones in Arc troopers Anyway morality issue is central in Star Wars- and clones aren't exactly normal people- that's why stormtroopers in the old trilogy were supposedly clones from the very beginning (We can argue about that- but official non-eu material from 1970s supports that theory- as well as Lucas' own description- stormies are mostly clones too). But clones and SBD:s are created to fight and die (not even to mention that SBD:s aren't living beings- they've got no soul)

Also we know that Ahsoka really despise killing- look her impression in Lethal Trackdown when she thinks that Aurra Sing is dead. Not even to mention those little hints in Ahsoka episodes - in Lightsaber lost she seems to fear that someone uses her saber to kill people and thinks it's her fault- In Brain Invaders she asks if she should've killed Barriss when she was infected- and says she was not able to do it and in Lethal Trackdown Ahsoka says that she is not a murderer- every single thing tells us that Ahsoka wants not to kill anyone- and you seriously ask why she didn't start to slaughter neimoidians in the episode?!
You have played too much Jedi Knight games i fear- they're fun but they give an impression that jedi's job is to slice bad guys to pieces

 

LOL. I think that mindset is too prevalent.
*omg bad-looking people - slice - slash - lightsaber throw - kill - kill - kill*
I have to admit the first time I watched the episode, that very thought went through my head: Why isn't Ahsoka slicing them to pieces??! But then I realized that such impulsive slaughter mentality is very short-sighted.
Of course, if she had sliced them to pieces, we'd see no end of heated debate of how dare Ahsoka kill living beings! LOL, she can't win!

 

Well... I HAVE played too much Jedi Knight, but I don't think that's it. As I said before, in the movies we've never seen a Jedi shut down his lightsaber out of a conscience when faced with living enemies. Even Luke hacks and slashed his way through Jabba's guards. Sure, I don't think any Jedi WANTS to kill, but they know that in a combat situation you have to do what you must. Of course, when they have to kill their father, their friend or their padawan, they will go out of their way to avoid it, but a bunch of thugs? That's quite unheard of.

 

Perhaps we will see episode with Anakin and Ahsoka fighting neimoidian guards together- Anakin slices them without worries and Ahsoka starts to babble about morality- then Anakin just strikes her head off- there it is- great answer to that FAQ- "What happened to Ahsoka?"

We must remember that Luke was not actual jedi when he killed those guards- he was not representative of Republic or anything... Ahsoka was- and those neimoidians were "neutral" if Ahsoka would have killed them she and Chuchi would have been accused of "attacking neutral TF-ship" and killing "innocents"- awesome opportunity for TF to make jedi and Pantorans look bad- plus we must remember that Ahsoka was there without acceptance of the jedi council....and she has that fear of becoming murderer....

 

Those Jabba guards were hostile and attacking Luke and his friends! Those guards in "Sphere" were just doing their duty and Ahsoka could sense they had no hostile intent! Are you really unable to see that?

 

Fully unable. Jabba's guards were doing their duty just as much as the neimoidian guards. And since when guards rushing in with guns pointing at you have "no hostile intent"? Where they there just to tell her dinner war ready?

 

"Fully unable." You can repeat that again. I'm stunned that you can't realize that Ahsoka senses through her Force abilities that the first TF guy has completely hostile intent and the 2nd TF guy is just responding to a commotion with guards at his back. Truly stunned that you can't understand the difference. At least Ahsoka understood the difference.

 

Review over at Den of Geek:

http://www.denofgeek.com/television/620769/star_wars_the_clone_wars_season_3_episode_4_review_sphere_of_influence.html

 

That may very well be the case. Or, as others have noted it could be that Ahsoka will never attack living beings (as per what Dave said), or it could be that she didn't want to attack politically neutral guards, or it could be that the writers of the show simply can't have such humanoid aliens being hacked to pieces and still maintain their PG rating. If you allow yourself to accept that other opinions have just as much merit as yours, maybe you won't keel over with so many stun shots.

 

Difference between Jabba's guards and neimoidian guards were that Jabba's guys were feeding Luke to Sarlacc (that's a bit hostile if you ask me) while neimoidians were there to check out intruders who attacked securitydroids- they didn't try to kill Ahsoka-it's completely different situation than what happened at Carkoon.

 

In season 1 Ahoka was fired on from both front and behind sides and was fine, I realise character shield but it's still ridiculous. Duel of the Droids I believe, and there were other times I think.

 

About character shields- Chuchi should really be a spy- girlie moves silently and lightningfast- if she would only be quiet when hiding under tables She also sounds exactly like Bastila...same actress...

 

I just had the chance to watch this episode last night, so sorry I'm late to the "party".

Why is everyone geeking out over "Confederacy of Independent Systems" being said/used?

 

You'll have to be more specific than that.

Because it's CANON! Or something...

 

Who would've thought that Uncle George would end up being such an @$$kicker??!

This episode was a fun romp thru the GFFA. Loved the many nods to the films. I found myself staring at the tremendous diversity of character designs and realize how far they've come since season 1.

Have we seen that Peter Lorre-type character before?

 

The more Clone Wars episodes come out, the more I'm beginning to trust Supershadow.

 

I've not seen the episode in some time, but I think before Grievous arrives and they're trying to get to the engine room. When they use droid poppers Ashoka's just standing there deflecting with droids behind her.

Edit-just watched the scene, she's standing there deflecting shots from B1 droids, then some supers approach from behind and she just turns and deflects their shots while the B1 droids continue shooting. Not to mention just pausing the deflecting to look at the door/Rex/R3.

 

I suppose we can split hairs in that Ahsoka only had to deflect a few shots before Rex threw the droid poppers. Master Di also was deflecting lasers with his back turned and he was completely surrounded by droids as well as tanks. He held up for a while,but he had no backup left.

 

THEY ARE AT WAR. Good grief, how nebulous can this concept be? The Republic should be tearing the Trade Federation apart piece by piece. Lott Dod should be languishing in a cell. Nute Gunray should have seen the business end of a sniper rifle LONG before Vader killed him. The Trade Federation is providing droids, ships, and money to the CIS. How the hell are they neutral? They provide no such service to the Republic. If the Trade Federation blockaded a Republic world, the proper response would be to send a fleet, destroy the blockade, and put every Separatist, droid or organic, to death as soon as possible.

 

Oh don't you understand politics at all?!- Half of the senators are bribed by TF and other corporations- senate is leading the republic but it's not working- because it works against itself as much as it works against enemy- This is a civil war- so situation is much more complicated than being at war with another nation- Palpatine arranged situation to be like this and he needs Lott Dod in senate- that's why he cannot (yet) let him or Gunray to be captured or killed- now he can use this situation to gain more power- if Chancellor would get more power (emergency powers aren't enough) he could kick these seppies out of the senate- so he is actually using TF to gain more power- as long as senate has power to decide -Cis-influence inside the chamber will remain. TF is also important organization and most of Republic worlds (including Naboo) still have to trade with it- actually trade federation (and Banking clan) are providing ships and weapons to Republic side as well so tearing it apart would destroy the Republic worlds and people as well...

 

I think they will eventually throw Lott Dod out of the Senate chamber, and Trade Federation is eventually going to defect officially to the CIS, I think. This development is somewhat foreshadowed in the series as in 'Senate Murders' Halle Burtoni can accuse Padmé, Bail, Mon Mothma, and Onaconda Farr of being part of a Separatist conspiracy. If Lott Dod would have still been in the Republic Senate as the Senator for the Trade Federation, he certainly would have been suspected of being a traitor, not Padmé and her circle.

Also, after the Trade Federation and other mega corporations with their own senators are exposed as traitors, Palpatine has the ideal pretext to see traitors everywhere in the Senate, which should enable him to take even more power away from the Senate, and even to refuse to share important details about the war with anyone besides his most trusted inner circle.

The way the Trade Federation acts here reveals two things:

1) That they are really powerful, and that Palpatine really needs to destroy this power by making them a part of the side which is destined to lose the war, or else he might not be able to make his Empire.

2) They are really acting like a corporation, not like a nation of sorts. They try to make profits by dealing with everyone, but are in secret more in the CIS camp because Dooku likely promised them that the order in the GFFA would change to their benefit if the CIS would defeat the Republic.

Any corporation with the size of the Trade Federation would, after Obi-Wan, the other Jedi, and some of the clones revealed that Viceroy Nute Gunray apparently struck a deal with Count Dooku and the CIS, declare him a rebel and traitor, and swear that he did not represent the whole corporation in this matter. And we actually do not know if the Trade Federation ships/droids the CIS uses, were not sold to them before the war broke out (which, of course, would not make the Trade Federation traitors, at least not, if there was no Senate resolution against dealings with the Separatist movement worlds before the Clone Wars began), or were considered to be the private property of Nute Gunray, or simply Trade Federation assets stolen by Gunray from the Federation proper when he defected to the CIS.

 

I like this debate in the Senate...I mean forum.

 

Yes Sphere of Influence happened before Senate murders (it's confirmed by episode guide and we can see Ono in the background) so i think that Palpy eventually was given powers to kick Dod out- or then Dod just left the senate when Sidous ordered him to do so- or some evidence of TF conspiring with seppies was finally uncovered.


But TF-neutrality explains few things in TCW

1) Why all ships and vehicles of CIS are painted blue in TCW- but we can see brown Mtt:s in ROTS
Blue patterns were used to make a difference between CIS ships and "Neutral" starships (as we can see the one that blockades Pantora has no markings- it probably has brown mtt:s and vultures in it's hold and tan Aat-tanks) -But after TF was revealed to be part of seppies patterns had no meaning anymore -and all ships were used mixed (Also ep1-visual dictionary states that brown paint is significantly cheap- and Neimoidians were quite poor at the end of the war.

2) Why Sidious/Palpy was worried about Nute being captured in Cloak of Darkness - he could've revealed something about Trade Federation that would have revealed that Gunray was still it's leader- unlike Lott Dod states....

3) Padmé states in Senate Spy that she have negotiated with Neimoidians in Holonet- that would've been odd comment if all TF-leaders would be considered traitors of the Republic



It is stated in the EU as well that Lott Dod remained in the senate during the separatist crisis and even during the war as wee see in TCW- still Gunray remained to be De Facto leader of the TF but he was considered to be war criminal because he was seen with Dooku in many occasions. To prevent TF losing it's rights within the Republic- Dod stated that Gunray have been using resources of TF without acceptance of it's governing bo