The Clone Wars: Episode 305: Corruption Discussion Thread

Discussion in 'Star Wars TV' started by Gry Sarth, Oct 5, 2010.

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  1. Mond Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 21, 2009
    star 3
    I like stuff like that though for alien ships and whatnot though. It underlines the fact that we are dealing with psychologies that are, in fact, alien.
  2. Barriss_Coffee Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 29, 2003
    star 6
    I think that ship should have had a theme song. Kinda like a techno beat.

    I think it had one going there for about 2 seconds.
  3. Valairy Scot Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 16, 2005
    star 5
    Sure, but that's anecdotal evidence, just as this post is. Personally, I gave up reading EU about the time Luke married Mara, but I devoured the books prior to that. I've seen all but AoTC in their original theater release, I watch TCW, and I spend way too much time on these boards ;), lurking, posting, posting fan fics.

    Oh, in case it's not obvious, I'm female and older (not the target audience, in other words).

    In many ways, I love the prequels more than the OT (since I have the ability to fast foward and skip all the childish stuff I hate) - and I HATED TPM when I walked out of the theater. When shortened :p - hey, it's a fun movie to watch.

    So fans come into the fandom many ways...anyway, to the episode itself, I will need to watch it a second time, but I found it okay. Quite frankly, I've found all the episodes this season less than fully engaging (and a fair amount last season, too, to be fair) for various reasons, quite possibly including the fact that I watched one online because I was out of town.

    But Mandalore - a retcon or not - shrugs. I don't care. I never cared for Mandos and from what I've heard, would not care for Karen Traviss's take on the GFFA.
  4. Swashbucklingjedi Game Winner

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    Oct 3, 2010
    star 5
    Traviss was the one who claimed that there is only 3 million clones [face_thinking] that would make "the clone wars" smaller conflict than WW2.... it didn't make sense- in AOTC kaminoans talk about 200,000 units i think that "unit" means something like 1000 legions with nearly 1000 soldiers....or something.... I'm just glad if Traviss' canon would be overwritten- not completely- but her "facts" were sooooo wrong from the very beginning.....
  5. Swashbucklingjedi Game Winner

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    Oct 3, 2010
    star 5
    Your story really shows that there is many kinds of fans out there-

    I have never read EU thinking that it's "real" Star Wars i have read it like "if it's good it may be "real" Star Wars"

    It's much like historical fiction- there is a real history- which is interesting (I am sort of historyfreak i guess) and historical fiction (like Robin Hood, Pirate movies, Westerns, Indiana Jones etc.) Many of those fictional stories have elemets that are unlogic with real history (like Indy using RPG in Raiders of the Lost Ark:oops: ) I still enjoy historical movies even though i know how history really went (Nazis never searched the Ark)- same with SW-canon (it's completely fictional btw:p ) SW by George Lucas is "real history" and EU is historical fiction in which "real" elements and fictional ones are messed up....
  6. Okko_Fett Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Oct 13, 2010
    Dam you Swashbuklingjedi for making sense !!! 8)

    Placing the EU in the context of Robinhood and other sensationalized myths and folklore is a very interesting perspective. I guess I'm going to have to alter my understanding of all things EU that it isn't written in stone.

    Regarding the episode, has anyone wondered if maybe the Duchess's destruction of the Warehouse was to cover her own duplicity in the matter?

    Also, what was it with the royal guards having riot shields, staffs but no guns? The old addage of "never bring a knife to a gun fight" sticks predominantly in my mind. Oh, and the scene when the royal guard is spinning his staff and blocking laser shots? (cough, coughjedimovecough, and again cough)?
  7. Gry Sarth Ex 2x Banhammer Wielding Besalisk Mod

    Member Since:
    Jun 24, 1999
    star 5
    I firmly believe, ever since Voyage of Temptation, that those mando staffs have some kind of magnetic field of something that sort of attracts nerby blaster bolts towards them. So the guards just wave those sticks around, and any bolt coming towards them gets deflected. Normal people being able to predict a bolt's path and have the reflexes to parry it would be simply ludicrous and diminuish the Jedi a lot.
  8. Swashbucklingjedi Game Winner

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    Oct 3, 2010
    star 5
    I think Satine don't want that her guards carry guns- because they remind her of mandalorian civil war and they are kind of active killing weapons- while staffs and sabers can be used as defense- her guards are quite badass with their staffs... but i don't understand why official site tells that all Satine's personal guards are 1,89 meters tall.... 8-} are they clones or is there very strict standards for their height that they look good when standing in a row... mandopolices have not "height" mentioned in their character card obviously because they are individuals some taller some shorter..... anyway there is something odd in those guard guys because they never remove their helmets- not even in briefing[face_laugh]
  9. koonfan Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 15, 2008
    star 4
    Certainly see our point (though I kinda like the Mandos having a bit more justification for physical prowess), and it's a plausible explanation for the laser deflection. Still, it takes real balls to go up against blasters with something other than a lightsaber, another blaster, or a plot shield. [face_laugh]
  10. Humble_Jedi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 14, 2004
    star 4
    Well, I've read a lot of EU and I disliked most of it. I especially hated the post-RotJ EU and the massively popular 'Thrawn Trilogy'. So, I disregard a lot of EU stuff. Even with EU stuff that I do like, I always keep in mind that it's not on the same level of canon as the movies. Although I don't really care too much for the whole canon debate - it's a fictional universe anyway.

    People complain a lot about Lucas, but from the amount of EU that I've read it's evident to me that Lucas still understands his own universe a lot better than most SW authors out there.
  11. rumblewagon Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 24, 2004
    star 4
    That would be 200 billion clones.
  12. Tzizvvt78 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 12, 2009
    star 4
    Which might be enough to police a few city planets in the Core, like they did on Coruscant. :p

    AOTC:ICS speaks of millions of divisions preparing, with the first few being readied for Geonosis. That would account for all the clone ship crews, pilots, police and guard units, that are not counted as part of the regular army grunts (TCWCG).
  13. Swashbucklingjedi Game Winner

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    Oct 3, 2010
    star 5
    I like Thrawn trilogy- it has too much unlogic things with prequels though- but those are unnecessary mentions and don't really matter- but i agree that most of post-ROTJ Eu is full cr*p....


    George understands his universe best- that's true- but some EU-authors have enough imagination to expand it- Zahn was definitely one of them he have created so much stuff later used even by Lucas (name Coruscant, Rishi....) and in TCW we see Abregado etc.
    but most EU-authors simply take elements from George's star wars and mix them up- making a new story with nothing new- ok perhaps few new jedi or rebel or something but usually there is not much imagination used- upcoming "The Old Republic"- game is one very bad example of lack of imagination- republic soldiers are similar to clones.... sith have droidekas.... bounty hunters are mandos etc. nothing new... Kotor had some new things and own feel- TOR lacks it completely... off-topic... sorry
  14. Swashbucklingjedi Game Winner

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    Oct 3, 2010
    star 5
    that's not even much... considering that ww2 killed 16 million soldiers and 45 million civilians from allied side alone.... 3 million clones sounds ridiculous... they couldn't hold even Kamino's cities if seppies would attack with billions of droids....
  15. MistrX Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 20, 2006
    star 4
    Indeed, there's something special about those staffs.
  16. Okko_Fett Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Oct 13, 2010
    I've read quit alot of the EU. The books that stand out the most are the books detailing the Clone Wars. In the books, clones came in three main forms, regular troopers (most of the clone army), 4 man Commandoes teams and the Officers called Alphas which were often special forces. The writers did a great job of detailing the lives of the Clones, thier relations with their Jedi commanders and the transition from Republic forces to Imperial forces. It would be a dam shame if all of it was discounted.

    Something of note: After watching the 6th movie (episode 3) I found it EXTREMLY difficult to believe that Clone troopers could wipe out the "entire" Jedi order. But after having read the books I came to believe that the Jedi never had a chance. The main force of the Clone army was trained as we saw in the movies mostly using simulators. But if in fact if most of the Clone Commandoes and Alphas were actually taught first hand by actual Mandolorians, then Yes Clones can kill Jedi.
  17. Billy_Dee_Binks Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 29, 2002
    star 4
    I'm pretty late with this one, as I just saw it. Here are some brief thoughts of mine on the episode:

    -The score was OUTSTANDING!

    -Padmé and Satine's facial animation and body language made a huge leap in quality.

    -Padmé's new gown and hairdo caught me by surprise. Reminds me a bit of traveling outfit she wore to find Anakin on Mustafar.

    -Dee Bradley Baker is a very talented voice actor, but it isn't too hard to recognize his voice was sharing by a few too many character in this episode.

    -Now I finally get why everyone's quoting "burn it down". The way I see it Satine was struggling to keep formal and pacifist. Maybe?

    -The Pharaoh aliens and their ship were quite interesting. A bold step into a completely differently influenced direction. Nice.

    -The police chief was quite a cool character. Sounded just like a fast talking pulp action series good cop type thanks to Tom Kane. The individual helmet design was sweet as well.

  18. Obey Wann Former RMFF CR & SW Region RSA

    Member Since:
    Jan 14, 2000
    star 6
    Wow. I'm astounded that some folks liked this one. Good for you. I for one will never watch it again. Worst episode of the entire series, and that's saying a lot. Even next week's looks weak.

    There's really no point in going through what I think is wrong with this one, because the fanboys and girls will squee over what they love about it, and not change their minds. And there's no way I'll like this one. So we'll agree to disagree. :) Here's hoping for a good episode soon.
  19. fistofan1 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 8, 2009
    star 4
    I don't understand why the Moogan design was so evil-looking. Theybwere only greedy, they didn't intentiinally ppison Mandalore.

    You would think they woild use the design for some actual villains. :confused:
  20. Alexrd Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 7, 2009
    star 5
    She used that outfit in the Malevolence episode.
  21. Barriss_Coffee Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 29, 2003
    star 6
    I hope they use the design for something at the very least. On the spectrum of awesome designs this show's produced, they were pretty high. Er, in my opinion. At least. I may be alone on that.

    But yeah, it was kinda disappointing they were only there to... unintentionally poison tea...
  22. Swashbucklingjedi Game Winner

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    Oct 3, 2010
    star 5
    I never found it difficult to believe that clones can kill a jedi- jedi aren't all powerful with their lightsabers and Force powers- video games actually give a good impression of that -even though they are very non-realistic- in many games you're able to control a jedicharacter and your enemies are armed with blasters- just like a jedi you can block their blasts and you're overpowering against them with your forcepowers- still you can die- you cannot block every blast- you cannot kill everyone. And we see how Jango Fett kills a jedi master singlehandedly on Geonosian arena... and they are his clones so EU is not really needed to explain that but of course it makes whole SW-story to have more depth. Their intention- or Lucas' intention is not to destroy the EU- but tell his own version of it- unfortunately some eu-creators didn't get the story right (like Karen Traviss) instead they misunderstood some things- but ultimately those are little simple things- main idea of clones being brothers and being trained by Mandalorian warriors like Jango is not unlogic with TCW- at least yet.....
  23. Swashbucklingjedi Game Winner

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    Oct 3, 2010
    star 5
    "evil-looking" is quite an odd term- i think Mace Windu is actually bit evil looking since he is always so serious.... villains don't always have to look evil- Moogan design was ok -they just looked like that- it has nothing to do with their intentions...

    No she didn't- it was the new oufit he talked about....
  24. Billy_Dee_Binks Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 29, 2002
    star 4
    Yep. I meant her brown evening/ discussion gown with the leather straps and crest that reminded me of her ROTS traveling outfit.
  25. MercenaryAce Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 10, 2005
    star 5
    Kind of late to the party, but, I must say again:

    1. That version of the Mandolorians is every bit a retacon as this one. Even more so actually.

    When Mandolorians first appeared in the Marvel comics (20 odd years ago) they did not all wear armor (even the majority of the soldiers wore jumpsuits and silly hats), they were not all warriors (the majority we saw were slaves of the Empire.), and there were references to a civilian government. There were badass guys in boba Fett armor, but they were rare, the equivalent of Mandalore's Navy Seals. (Imagine someone complaining that not all Americans are Navy Seals.)
    The appearance of the Mandolorians in an RPG module, set before the Clone Wars, follows a similar pattern. The Mandolorians are lead by a Governor and his civilian government, the army is fairly conventional (and used a lot of droids as well), and the infamous armor belonged only to special forces. Notably, the only guy who wore that armor was ranked as Lieutenant.
    TOTJ was the first source to treat them as a bunch of Proud Warrior Race Guys, but that was set thousands of years before the movies. Also, they weren't human in that comic.
    The first source to really give the Mandolorians an in depth look was the article "History of the Mandolorians. According to this article, the Mandolorian warrior culture had completely died out by the time of the Clone Wars (matter of fact, this is consistently said throughout pretty much all pre-Travis mentions of the Mandolorians. The reason everyone could recognize Boba Fett by site was that he was only one who wore that armor anymore.). An insane Clone was hired by the Mandolorian government to restrat the Mandolorian Warrior tradition, and he recruited a collection of policemen, mercenaries and ex-Death Watch terrorists to create a new Mando army. Which was destroyed in the Clone Wars, save for said clone, and a couple of others who would lead the Mandolorian resistance against the Empire.
    Somewhere along the way there was also Jango Fett: Open Seasons, which was about Jango's backstory. In it, the last two groups of Mandolorian warriors (the Death Watch terrorists and the True Mandolorian mercenaries) wiped each other out.
    Only then did Travis come along and decide the Mando warrior culture was still active, that Mandalore did not have a civilian government, that everyone and their dog had a suit of Mandolorian armor and that said crazy Clone was a lazy figurehead at best. She is the one who disregarded the EU, Lucas' version is closer to what they originally were.

    2. The planet itself is more of a difference, but planets are big. They have more than one habitat (the Atlas confirmed there are deserts, farmlands and jungles).

    3. Course, I think one of the best explanations is that the Mandalore in TCW is Kevala and the Mandalore from earlier sources is Concordia (with the two of them being referred to collectively as Mandalore). Conc
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