Full Series The Clone Wars: Episode 316: Altar of Mortis Discussion Thread

Exactly, Anakin could have brought balance in the Chancellor's office, he simply made a selfish/poor decision. The Jedi aren't prefect, but the prophecy did not call for them to be wiped out.

 

Jedi and Yoda as names are very eastern influenced (like yoga) at least -so is this philosophy- it is kinda mixture of east and west.....

but still people are now seeing some kind of 'redemption of the dark side' just because Son says one nearly kind thing (i suggest you take shelter if you wanna live) and because Father says darkness is necessary- if we would believe all in-universe characters Palpatine would be damn nice guy....I just want to add that we have trilogy of this and in the next episode (this one)we can see how this Son who is the dark side attacks his sister, kidnaps Ahsoka, seduces Anakin and Ahsoka and prepares to kill everyone...... he is evil- he is the dark side- father may have been wrong perhaps his compassion towards his son was stupidity we cannot judge whole saga because one episode of series supporting it suggests the idea that darkness may be needed- saga is still above TCW and it gives impression of dark side being evil so if this is not going to make sense this is just worthless it is too late for George to change his movies because of this - dark side may be needed in balance as pointed out but for now it was only father's philosophy- he also thought Anakin would take his place but we know he didn't so he was wrong in one thing at least....
We shouldn't judge the overall logic yet we have seen just one part of the trilogy

 

Come on now, this IS George we are talking about. It is never too late

 

The Sith, not the dark side.

 

Totallly correct and my mistake. The sith (and presumably dark side users in general) act as a cancer on the force increasing the dark side and creating imbalance. That stilll doesn't make the dark side undercurrent equal to the force itself because it appears that only the dark side creates an imbalance. As I said in another thread:

The Force is an energy field generated by all living things. The dark side is the undercurrent of that energy field that carries the negative emotions of all living things. As a form of energy the Force has a natural state that is altered by dark side users who act like a cancer on the Force by increasing its negative undercurrent. This altered state is often referred to as an imbalance in the Force.

So, destroying the sith/cancer would reduce the negative undercurrent and return the energy field back to its natural state, "restoring balance."

Overall though I still think Anakin is experiencing his version of the cave.

 

I'm not reading any of these posts or coming back here till the episode airs because I am anti-spoiler to the extreme, so could someone please PM me and let me know whether this episode is definitely airing tomorrow or if it might be delayed a week? I'm on the edge of my seat for this next episode.

 

I just saw that preview courtesy of MTV. Am I the only one who got goosebumps from hearing Ahsoka talk.

 

Many thanks to fistofan1 for helpin' a brother out. See you guys after the episode airs.

 

That was pretty sweet. The way Ahsoka talked in that sweet voice at the end sent the creepiness factor up to 11.

 

So since Ahsoka will be spending at least a little bit of time on the Dark Side should we have a Sith name for her or just leave it at Darth Ahsoka?

 

Sith =/= Dark side

 

So since I compared Overlords to Shore Leave from the original Star Trek, if Anakin is Kirk, then Obi-Wan must be Spock and Ahsoka is Bones.

So in this episode, Obi-Wan is going to make some dry remark about the situation, Ahsoka will complain about Obi-Wan's lack of feelings, and Anakin will break it up.

Then Anakin will use some bizarre logical paradox to defeat the Overlords.

 

Yes the ?Son? (and thus the dark side) does evil things. However that is an human interpretation of it... really these are just different aspects of the Force. I believe the reason there is a distinction between the ?Daughter? and ?Son? is a metaphor so that our heroes can understand what is going on. In reality the Force is just one Force with different aspects... the Force is creating this vision in such a way that the Jedi can understand... that?s my take on it anyway.

 

wow ahsoka talks in the episode what a horrible spoiler

 

It's probably a version of the cave for all three of them. However, the Father states that they had to remove themselves from the "temporal" world which will likely mean that no time will have passed once the three jedi escape Mortis. Also, Mortis may be different from the cave as Yoda was aware of what was transpiring within the cave while no external Jedi may be aware of what is transpiring within Mortis

 

I've heard what Lucas said at the beginning of ANH VCR release, but I never have and never will consider Lucas' word to be canon unless it is embedded in a source. Also the VCR of ANH is what? 15 years old? Pretty sure that's enough time for Lucas to change his mind concerning what 'balance' means.

On top of that the father does say "too much light OR dark will destroy the universe" makes me believe that Lucas has indeed changed his mind. And I'm perfectly alright with that, since it does not contradict any existing OFFICIAL material.

 

yes but father is in-universe character and not canonical source or Lucas himself....

 

In-universe characters are canonical sources... Or did you think I meant reference books?

 

GM wins 27 (twenty-seven) intarnets.

The Trek parallel does hold... but how is it that this arc is simultaneously more "classic SF" and more "fantasy" than your average SW? Strange times indeed.

 

yes but they are not reliable - Vader didn't kill Anakin as Ben told and Palpatine doesn't love democracy- it is canon that father said so - but it is not necessarily canonical truth- it is father's point of view in canon and not confirmed to be exact truth..... that is what i meant-

 

You need to realize that in-universe characters are canon, but what they say ISN'T always canon, i.e. characters lie.

So, just because the character calling himself father says something, that doesn't make his view of the force canon.

Think about all the other EU force "heretics" and their differing views. They are all canon characters, but their multitude of views aren't canon.

Do you really think that the views of a character in a 3 episode arc of a cartoon would replace the views of the main good guys (i.e. Jedi) in the 6 episode movie series?

 

well said i meant just that

This father character is obviously bit unreliable- he cheated Anakin when he said he could save only one of his friends he knew he is the chosen one and would be able to save them both- so he lied at least once already..... also his view of the prophecy was obviously somehow wrong since Anakin didn't fulfill it so- he didn't remain there so something in father's conclusions must have been erroneous in the first place

 

To be fair, Father never said that Anakin could save only one, he merely asked "which one will you chose to save". That's not really lying, and if Anakin were not the Chosen One, he really could not save more than one.

 

that depends on one's point of view- he didn't tell that chosen one would be able to save both so if that is lying then he lied if not then he didn't- but "which one you choose to save" gives impression that another must die just like "men are hard to control" gives the impression women wouldn't be-

but I think father lied when he teased Anakin like that- he should've told that real Chosen One can save them both - and he didn't- damned liar!

 

He would influence the test if he said that. Only the Chosen One would ever try to subdue both, anybody else would side with a particular side.