The current membership of the AC

Discussion in 'Communications' started by EmpressPalpatine, Jan 26, 2003.

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  1. EmpressPalpatine Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Mar 31, 2001
    star 4
    Please see my last post on the last page in regards to why this thread is locked. If you're looking for discussion on whether or not the AC is necessary or useful, please head to this thread by Master Salty. Thanks - Vertical

    Folks,

    There's a pattern forming with the Advisory Council that concerns me. First of all, I'm sure anyone that visits the YJCC or Comms is now familiar with the off-shoot board Dantooine Base and who some of its
    members are. Here at the JC we also have a newly formed Advisory Council that incidentally enough, is made up almost exclusives of Base members. While this
    used to be a point of pride for us at DB, in that we felt that we had among or members so many quality posters whose opinions and input were sought by the administration, it has now recently become a matter of
    some concern to both members of DB and members here at the JC.

    Jokingly, some friends of mine have begun to refer to me as the Mother Hen of the AC, as I am the de facto leader of Dantooine Base Well, this is a nickname I myself no
    longer finding amusing. You may think I liked this for some reasons having to do with "power" or "drama" or whatever nonsense. Neither of those are the case. I
    think it's a bad thing for the JC in general to have the entire AC come from such an exclusive group. What brought this on was that, until recently, I was under the impression that the AC is supposed to be representative of the general
    populace here on the JC, but this clearly is not the case, as was pointed out to me by a permananent AC member recently, in that they feel they do not. ( "The AC is just a place for a few members to have an
    opportunity to interact one-on-one. They have no obligation to represent anyone other than themselves" - " I'm an individual, and I have been afforded an opportunity to give the Administration my own personal advice on the way things should be done." - "The AC is
    not meant to be a sounding board for the masses. The masses have Comms."
    ) As you can see this was rather a surprise to me, as I was under the impression that the
    AC was here to represent all of us, not just
    themselves.
    To me, it has become painfully obvious that the AC no longer fuctions as it was intended to, and now, it seems that those in charge of the AC have seen fit to use the Base as
    their own proving grounds to pick AC members in an effort to consolidate their own "power" and to try to exclude those whose opinions do not fall in line with
    theirs. One example of this would be the ousting of Farraday, because he refused to kowtow to the Mods, was known to be in disageement with the Adminstration several times, and on a variety of issues, and refused to tow the AC party line. In essence, farraday rocked the boat, and challenged the AC leadership on many issues, and in doing so, was deemed unsuitable to the AC. If the AC is not meant to be representative of the members, and is, as was told me me, a sounding board for certain members to interact one-on-one with the Admins, giving only their point of view, then in the interests of getting the best cross-section of JC society, one would not want to draw all the members from a small select group of friends, most of whom share the same points of view, am I right? One would want to seek out people from various subcultures here on the JC, not use a cookie-cutter mold when selecting newmembers.

    As the co=creator and "Supreme Chancellor" of Dantooine Base, this is not what I, nor the other founders, had in mind for our board when we created it, and it saddens
    me to see that this is what it's evolved into. Dantooine Base was meant as a social alternative for social misfits, not a stepping stone to a JC career. But greater than that, this is not a good development for the JC as a whole.

    Whether the AC has any actual influence on things that go on behind the scenes or not is debatable. But what isn't debatable is the c
  2. Ben Kenobi Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Mar 27, 2000
    star 5
    I agree. You cannot get a fair representation of the board's population when all or most of the members are members of something like DB.
  3. Darth_diarrhea Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Oct 20, 2001
    star 4
    Totally agree. Posters from a more diverse background are needed for the group to work at all.
  4. royalguard96 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 13, 2001
    star 5
    I agree with everything that was stated in the intial post.

    The AC is supposed to be representative of all the boards on the JC (so I was told) and not only do most of those individuals come from the Base, they are very isolated to the JCC. The movie and other forums have next to no representation.

    Our interests mirror the JC's interests. Nothing more.
  5. Crimson-Larko Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 14, 2001
    star 4
    As one of the original members of Dantooine Base, I agree with what EmpressPalpatine has just said. The base was never meant to be used for this, and this is a problem that must be rectified.
  6. Aragorn327 Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Aug 20, 2001
    star 6
    Perhaps a way to fix this would be for members to be taken from certain forums? For example, one from Games, one from Lit, one from the JCC....?

    ...of course that way would end up with too many members on the AC...
  7. Jotun Denal Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Nov 4, 1999
    star 6
  8. Porkins in a Speedo Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 6, 1999
    star 5
    personally, i am not comfortable with the way the AC is set up. there's just way too much potential for someone to try and manipulate things to their own advantage. and as far as the AC not being here for the members...well, let's just say that that rubs me the wrong way...

    *waits to be crucified*
  9. Master Salty Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 18, 1999
    star 6
    I'll resign if it makes anyone feel better.
  10. Darth_Dagsy Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 18, 2000
    star 6
    To me, it isnt whether many post at the same private board. That is irrelevant.

    The question is whether they let that influence their thoughts and ideas. Whether they do whats best for the group, or whats best for the JC.

    There were a number of DB ACers in AC3, and many voted in for AC4. All 3 Perm ACers are DBers. But did AC3 vote in the DB AC4 members because they valued their opinions, or because they were friends, and a member of the same group?
    The former is fine by me. The latter is not. When I was in the AC, I voted for those I thought would best do the job. I only really knew one of them.

    Frinedship should never be allowed to influence decision-making.

    The question that we all need to ask each other, and the AC needs to ask each other, is then Is the good of the JC your sole priority?
  11. farraday Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2000
    star 7
    It might be considered that the members of the AC do have a broad range of forums, but there also seems to be a bit of a chokepoint involving being part of the DB.

    Edit//Master Salty I'm not certain that your resignation will make matters better if the process is being called into question.

    If I might dare to suggest something, the permanent members are the most obvious cause for concern since they're there for the long term and as such are more likely to have any influence on such topics as new membership.
  12. dp4m Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Nov 8, 2001
    star 10
    I don't actually mind that the majority of the AC comes from a group (Forceboat, Blue Yoda, Outlander, etc.), per se.

    But I do think that they should TRY (in some cases it's just really too difficult) to represent as many different Forums (the larger, the better) as possible.

    For instance, my concerns would lie primarily with EU Lit. My concerns would, in all likelihood, not be in lockstep AT ALL with someone primarily in the Movie Forums. The representation for EU Lit is Night4554 and AmazingB who, while very active in the JC at large, are not terribly common posters in EU Lit (though Amazing is coming around ;)).

    Now, there are considerations. Should the AC members be chosen by those that are varied posters (i.e. in other Forums than their primary) or is that not necessary? Should AC members be chosen because they post in Comms (and is thus more likely to be aware of JC issues) or is that not necessary?

    Since no one but the AC knows how AC members are chosen/elected we don't know if these are important. But I think membership in "clubs" is less germaine than proper representation to the various Forums on the JC.
  13. keokiswahine Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 4, 2000
    star 5
    upper management and middle earth AC have both given me grave concerns, and I fear for their future as viable. We have survived so many tumbles and dramas, yet our beloved board seems to be polarizing, again. While I lurk all the time, my posties are few and far between now. and it saddens me. :(
  14. farraday Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2000
    star 7
    I would disagree, especially if the board is by invitation only and the slant is so obivous.

    If the AC is to bring a spattering of differnet views, it seems counter productive to have a preponderance of it's membership from a single off site board.

    While it is quite easy to explain as those are the peopel they know best, I think it breeds it's own insularity and elitism which is part of what we wanted to cure in the mod squad, correct?
  15. Spike_Spiegal Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Mar 11, 2002
    star 5
    I'm a memeber of the DB although I haven't posted in a long time.

    I totally agree with what Tessa, Crimson, farry, and others have said. A more diverse selection of people on the JC for AC is needed and this just not just include the DB issue.

    However, I don't think it is necessary for people to resign (Salty, don't resign) or get all worked up over this. The new terms will come around and these concerns can be applied to the election of those members when the time comes.

    After we talk about the issue hear of course and get views of everyone of course here. :)
  16. Darth_diarrhea Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Oct 20, 2001
    star 4
    I agree with Spike. This wasn't an attack against any one person. It was just an attempt to change how the system works in the future.
  17. keokiswahine Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 4, 2000
    star 5
    There seems to be an aire of eliticism, again; something that was hoped to have been cured previously. Alas, the people's voice now come from a single source, and not necessarily representative of all areas of our beloved board. [face_plain]
  18. deltron_zero Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Feb 1, 2002
    star 6
    Is the good of the JC your sole priority?

    Jesus Christ, I certainly hope this isn't the case for anyone, as that would be exceedingly sad.

    (Sorry Dags, I just have to mess with you for some reason ;) )

    Anyway, I am in complete agreement with Tessa on this issue. But it seems to me that before we question the membership or how it is selected, the most important issue that Tessa brings up that needs to be dealt with first is exactly what the AC is for. How does the AC benefit these forums and why is the body necessary? Personally, I would agree that "the masses have comms" as their sounding board and shouldn't need a group of members to act as a "go-between". But then what's this?


    The AC is meant to provide personal insight and a membership's point of view into various subjects, and to give the Administration a better idea as to what the membership thinks of a certain proposed policy issue.

    />

    And if:


    />
    then what the hell is that? Doesn't this seemingly elitist group "have comms" as well? If this is really the point of the AC then I can honestly see absolutely no reason for it's existence, and I would even go so far as to say it could be doing more harm than good./>/>/>/>
  19. Spike_Spiegal Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Mar 11, 2002
    star 5
    I agree with deltron. The issue of what the AC is for needs to be addressed as well.
  20. Darth_Dagsy Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 18, 2000
    star 6
    Bah, Deltron you know what I mean :p

    When you are at the JC, the JC has to be your priority. :p
  21. Jedi Greg Maddux Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 3, 1999
    star 6
    Master Salty, there's no need to step down just because you feel the DB presence in the AC needs to be diluted. Your opinions are valued just as much as anyone's here, regardless of affiliation, and I would indeed be sorry to see you step down.

    I'll admit it. I'm a Dantooine Base member. I honestly fail to see why a negative label should be affixed to me or my friends. We're not rebels. We have no intentions of taking over the JC.

    When I was an AC member, I only had the JC in mind. While I didn't let outside influences affect my decisions, I was more than willing to take the time to listen to anyone who had an issue and bring it up.

    I'll be honest. When I picked out my 8 potential AC candidates, I tried to pick out 8 that would best represent the JC. I didn't care what their "political" affiliation was. Yes, some of them happened to be DB members, but that's because I know them very well, and value their opinions because they're intelligent SW fans that truly care about the JC.
  22. Valiowk Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Apr 23, 2000
    star 6
    When the members of AC#4 were chosen, we wanted to select a group of members whom we felt were genuinely concerned about the AC. Thus, we chose a group of ACers from the general AC population, instead of choosing a particular ACer from each forum, especially with the possibility of overlap. After the selection was done, we then checked to ensure that most of the important forums all had some AC participation within.

    AC #3 also had members who posted on other boards off the JC. However, we did not in any way let this affect our feedback in the AC or our communication as a whole. We kept matters at other boards off the AC completely. I trust that AC #4 also has the discipline to do the same at present.
  23. royalguard96 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 13, 2001
    star 5
    I think it should be stressed we are not calling out the individuals. We are calling out the methods by which they are being chosen, and how they carry out and view their duties.

    The AC is just a place for a few members to have an opportunity to interact one-on-one. They have no obligation to represent anyone other than themselves" - " I'm an individual, and I have been afforded an opportunity to give the Administration my own personal advice on the way things should be done."

    This statement seems in 100 percent conflict with the AC guildelines deltron posted. I don't think this is what anyone had in mind when the AC was formed, with whatever roster made up that body.
  24. Master Salty Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 18, 1999
    star 6
    These are my thoughts concerning the AC.

    The AC is good in theory but I really feel like we're nothing more than a paper tiger. Granted we have pretty good discussions but in the end does it really matter what we say? I don't think it should be done away with, but it wouldn't hurt to have a more clearly defined purpose. We're supposed to act as intermediaries to the Mod Squad. Why is that even needed? It's probably because the Mod Squad is perceived as uncaring and unapproachable.
  25. Crimson-Larko Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 14, 2001
    star 4
    It's probably because the Mod Squad is perceived as uncaring and unapproachable.

    When the AC was first created there were people like me who shared that opinion. However, there have been great leaps taken in User-Mod relations, and it has not been because of the AC. This is why I view the AC as irrelevant and unneeded.
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