The current membership of the AC

Discussion in 'Communications' started by EmpressPalpatine, Jan 26, 2003.

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  1. YodaJeff Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Oct 18, 2001
    star 7
    Actually, Windy, it has to do with two different messageboards. Which, perhaps, makes it twice as sad. ;)
  2. Master Salty Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 18, 1999
    star 6
    Get rid of ther permanant positions, have 12 people on 3 months terms shifted so every month and a half 6 new people are coming in.

    You realize I can't do this by myself. The best I can do is start a thread on it and let the discussion take its course.

    Have the AC actively look for things to do instead of waiting for thigns to fall into their lap.

    I think most of us are doing that now. All the issues that I listed for you in that PM were issues that I brought to the AC. Nobody brought those issues to me. I don't think this is too much for anyone to ask. In fact, I would imagine the AC members would want to do this. Being proactive isn't that difficult.

    And for gods sake holds mods to a standard instead of "I agree with the administration on this issue" Fine so you believe you're there for your common sense, you're allowed to have some actualy hard and fast opinions to go with it.

    Given the exchange we just had, I'm not one to hold back how I feel in a particular situation. I have my opinions and I share them. I can't force people to accept them or bend to them. We can disagree with the Mods all we want, but you know as well as I, we can be overridden.
  3. ReaperFett Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 9, 1999
    star 6
    Have the AC actively look for things to do instead of waiting for thigns to fall into their lap.

    AC3 did that, so I'm assuming AC4 does.
  4. dp4m Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Nov 8, 2001
    star 9
    Out of curiosity, whenever things start to escalate why do one (or more) Mods jump in and say "It's only a messageboard?"

    I mean, DUH!

    But obviously people like hanging out here -- it's as much a community as a water cooler in an office, or people you meet at exercise class. Here we just happen to like Star Wars. If the community you enjoy is starting to sour and you're not having as good a time anymore, you try and fix it for the better. I'm assuming that's why Mods accept the position -- because they enjoy being here and want it to continue.

    So please -- I'm assuming people get that "it's just a messageboard" -- but Star Wars was JUST a movie, most things are JUST something. But it's something we enjoy. K'doke?
  5. YodaJeff Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Oct 18, 2001
    star 7
    dp4m, I completely agree with what you're saying. I spend a lot of time here, and obviously I enjoy most of the time I spend here. However, when I look at the grand scheme of my life, I don't want a Star Wars messageboard to be all that I have or care about.
  6. AmazingB Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Jan 12, 2001
    star 7
    Ok, this is probably going to be hugely long as I want to answer as many posts as possible and I'll probably wind up reiterating some point already made, but away we go:

    EmpressPalpatine said: You may think I liked this for some reasons having to do with "power" or "drama" or whatever nonsense. Neither of those are the case. I
    think it's a bad thing for the JC in general to have the entire AC come from such an exclusive group.


    That's not entirely true. Yes most ACers are members of the Base, but not all. I realize it's still a point of contention either way. However, I think everyone who is on the AC and is a member of the Base is able to separate their different "e-lives," so to speak, and will not form some sort of collective Base hive-mind. Just because most of us post at the same off-shoot board, doesn't mean we agree on everything.

    What brought this on was that, until recently, I was under the impression that the AC is supposed to be representative of the general
    populace here on the JC, but this clearly is not the case, as was pointed out to me by a permananent AC member recently, in that they feel they do not.


    I don't want to pretend to know what AYBABTU was thinking when he said what he did, but I'll answer his points from my perspective.

    "The AC is just a place for a few members to have an
    opportunity to interact one-on-one. They have no obligation to represent anyone other than themselves"


    I don't view this as meaning that the ACers don't represent the regular members. As someone else said, we're not a House of Representatives (or equivalent political body depending on where you live). As an ACer, I don't bow to the will of a certain group of posters. If they want me to bring something up in the AC, I'll gladly do so, but just because they bring it to me does not mean I'll blindly support it. In the end, the views of the ACers will be representative of a large cross-section of JCers as I sincerely doubt that we are each alone in our opinions.

    " I'm an individual, and I have been afforded an opportunity to give the Administration my own personal advice on the way things should be done."

    Essentially the same answer. Becoming a member of the AC does not mean we each represent an 1/8th of the JC. We give our take on an issue, otherwise we'd be highly ineffective (and some say that we are).

    "The AC is
    not meant to be a sounding board for the masses. The masses have Comms."


    I don't know that I agree with that. Yes, it's probably better in some instances for members to go to Comms or PMs if they want to bounce an idea off the administration, but at the same time, that's one of the purposes I believe the AC should have.

    As you can see this was rather a surprise to me, as I was under the impression that the AC was here to represent all of us, not just themselves.

    What do you mean by "represent?" Again, we don't each represent an 1/8th of the JC population. Our input is asked for and we give it, we don't poll people before making up our minds. Or someone asks us to bring up an issue and we do so. That doesn't mean we have to agree with it. We just have to bring it to the attention of the Administration. In that sense, we do represent everyone.

    To me, it has become painfully obvious that the AC no longer fuctions as it was intended to, and now, it seems that those in charge of the AC have seen fit to use the Base as their own proving grounds to pick AC members in an effort to consolidate their own "power" and to try to exclude those whose opinions do not fall in line with theirs.

    I'm sorry, but that's just absurd to me. If we were mods, maybe. But as ACers we don't have power. We have titles and we can post to a private board. The Administration may or may not listen to us. That's hardly power. And if the next 8 temporary members are all handpicked by me (which won't happen, it's just a hypothetical), that doesn't somehow give me "power."

    If the AC is not meant to be representative
  7. Ariana Lang Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Oct 10, 1999
    star 5
    Where is Internet_Drama? Did his head get stuck in the toilet or something?? Geez.

    Fact: There are lots of ACers also on the DB. While, as has been pointed out, no one who is not in the AC can know, it does seem highly coincidental.
  8. mac-nut Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Apr 14, 2001
    star 5
    last I heard, ID was banned. :eek: :eek: :eek:
  9. Ariana Lang Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Oct 10, 1999
    star 5
  10. dp4m Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Nov 8, 2001
    star 9
    Well, that was certainly long.

    Yeah... I get that a lot... :p

    But, to recap for those of us just joining us. Most of the points that AmazingB answered are answering the informational portion of this program -- so that's a good summation to this point by an AC member.
  11. Night4554 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 9, 2000
    star 5
    Get rid of ther permanant positions, have 12 people on 3 months terms shifted so every month and a half 6 new people are coming in.

    Hmmm, I don't think that math works out. But, it's a valid idea. I'd have to think about whther or not I'd like it. I'm neutral.


    Have the AC actively look for things to do instead of waiting for thigns to fall into their lap.

    I've already started the process of Mod Evals if that's what you mean. Otherwise, that's also a very valid point.

    And for gods sake holds mods to a standard instead of "I agree with the administration on this issue" Fine so you believe you're there for your common sense, you're allowed to have some actualy hard and fast opinions to go with it.

    I do hold mods to a standard. I haven't seen anything recently that I would call them on.


    Edit//The problem with that is Night the Adminsitration's problems are continued from earlier mistakes.
    If you want me though I cna borrow heavily from PMs to Vert on the subject as soon as a mod assures me I won't automatically be banned for it.


    If they are continued, then that's recent, and is obviously fair game and should be looked at. Get Vertical's permission to post the pm's and edit out any foul language and I don't see any reason why you should be banned. It would be ludicrous. Nevertheless, I'll be sending out a pm on your behalf and seeing if I can get you that assurance.

    ¤Night
  12. dp4m Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Nov 8, 2001
    star 9
    Hmmm, I don't think that math works out. But, it's a valid idea. I'd have to think about whther or not I'd like it. I'm neutral.

    I think he was suggesting 12 person AC.

    6 start 01-Jan-03 joining an EXISTING 6.
    Then 6 start 15-Feb-03 (replacing the EXISTING 6).

    The 01-Jan-03 6 serve until 01-Apr-03 (when they'll be replaced by 6) and the 15-Feb-03 serve until 15-May-03 when they're replaced.

    Etc, etc, etc...
  13. Night4554 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 9, 2000
    star 5
    Oh, yep, it does. I wasn't thinking along a straight line there.

    ¤Night
  14. YodaJeff Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Oct 18, 2001
    star 7
    The "overlapping AC" idea was discussed in AC3, but they ultimately decided it wasn't a good idea. However, AC4 is allowed to consider it again.
  15. farraday Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2000
    star 7
    Why did they decide it?

    And in my opinion it's better then having permanent memebrs who are much mroe likely to fall prey to ivory tower.
  16. ReaperFett Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 9, 1999
    star 6
    No stability. How does anyone know whos on the AC when it changes so often? Also, the AC cant get comfortable with oneanother. Just as youre getting good working together, the team goes.
  17. farraday Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Jan 27, 2000
    star 7
    A good working group?

    Working on what? they've already said they have no ability to affect policy.

    If your concern is wanting people to be able to work togeather longer extend the duration of a term to 4 months and have the partial turnover every two months.

    I'm sure there are enough DB members to make that work :p

  18. Ariana Lang Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Oct 10, 1999
    star 5
  19. Darth_Ignant Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Oct 24, 2001
    star 7
    "We're not sheep."

    I am.
  20. Jotun Denal Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Nov 4, 1999
    star 6
    TheWhitestRapper: SHICE!



    TheWhitestRapper: My SHET!





    Nuff said.




  21. Night4554 Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 9, 2000
    star 5
    From my profile:


    "Oh what the hell I'm nothing if not a sheep." -AmazingB

    ¤Night
  22. Porkins in a Speedo Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 6, 1999
    star 5
    i still think that pride is the main reason why ACers are taking so much offense at all of this.

    bottom line:

    1. yes, some things could have been said better in the original post. perhaps we should have been more clear and selective in the language.

    2. the issue was brought up because it has the possibility of being detrimental to both the jc and teh base.

    3. it just miiiight be, cooooouuuld be, that those of us involved in the heart of the matter had *GASP* good intentions?? do ya think that's possible?

    4. the reactions of some people have taken the meaning of "personal" to a whole new level. [face_plain]

    but, alas, "some people you just can't reach." ...and prejudgement and stigmas sometimes follow like a shadow. ...and that is unfortunate, to say the least.


    farewell.
  23. tenorjedi Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Aug 17, 2000
    star 5
    I'd like to weigh in a few things.

    First off the drama is a little thick.

    Second I was a member of the DB for a one month stint, then Tess closed it up, and I never actually went back to check on it. How this pertains to my effectiveness on the AC is beyond comprehension. I post on alot of boards. I moderate a board that has 3 times as many members as the DB. I dunno how what I do outside the JC pertains to anything.

    Now onto the points

    Get rid of ther permanant positions, have 12 people on 3 months terms shifted so every month and a half 6 new people are coming in.

    It's taken awhile for debates and issues to build up on the current AC. We're already a few weeks in and we just recently got the old people out the door so we can focus on the JC. If you want a rotating AC you need to expand the length of membership so that they can find their groove. As for the perm members, they're not required however having more than one keeps them from getting some kind of superiority complex (cause, ya know everybody bows before the AC lol) Their benefit is that they are someone who can help the transistion go a bit more smoothly and who knows what was discussed before. Beyond that, no I don't think we have to have them, but if we do, I think 2 or 3 is the right number.

    Have the AC actively look for things to do instead of waiting for thigns to fall into their lap.

    Well we've basically had to do that already since things have been so quite.

    And for gods sake holds mods to a standard instead of "I agree with the administration on this issue" Fine so you believe you're there for your common sense, you're allowed to have some actualy hard and fast opinions to go with it.

    We've already discussed issues with the mods, and proposed changes in banning, and sentencing, and also in moderating style in the JCC but those crazy mods, they don't always do everything we tell them to. We are anything but a bunch of yes men.

    That's what I was supposed to say, right Vert?

    Working on what? they've already said they have no ability to affect policy

    We don't affect policy, but we can present ideas. We have their ear, and ideas are alot more likely to get heard and considered when you have a select group who works well together and can present ideas well.

  24. Jotun Denal Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Nov 4, 1999
    star 6
  25. Saint_of_Killers Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Feb 18, 2001
    star 5
    Of course it's just a message board, which is why we're discussing it here, on a message board. If people started calling the mods at home or sending letters to their senators about the JC, then yes, that's taking it too seriously. But since this is the internet, I don't think discussing it on the internet is taking things too seriously.

    "It's just an internet message board" has become a polite way of saying "I don't have any answers, so leave me alone kthxbye."
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