Lit The Dark Nest Trilogy - worth reading?

Discussion in 'Literature' started by TheNewEmpire, Aug 9, 2014.

  1. TheNewEmpire Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 12, 2007
    star 3
    Hi there,

    I'm about about finished reading The New Jedi Order series. In fact I'm about three quarters through the final book, The Unifying Force.

    I've decided to give Audible a go and have just subscribed.
    I really want to read the Legacy of the Force books but I'm not sure if I should read The Dark Nest trilogy first.

    I remember reading some negative things about those books back in the day and I was wonder what the general consensus is now. Are they good books? Are they worth reading? Are the necessary? Do they follow on nicely from the NJO? If I don't read them, will I be missing valuable information that I'll need to understand/enjoy the FOTJ series?

    Any help would be appreciated...:)
  2. Kablob Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 24, 2014
    star 4
    I'm not sure that anyone can enjoy the FOTJ series.
  3. TheNewEmpire Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 12, 2007
    star 3
    I'm hoping it'll be everything Anakin Skywalker's fall was not.
  4. CT-867-5309 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jan 5, 2011
    star 5
    The Dark Nest Trilogy is a well-written, fantastic set of novels that perfectly continues the narrative of The New Jedi Order series. The plot is exciting, the characters are brilliant extensions of the ones you fell in love with during the NJO, some with pleasantly surprising new twists! This is a trilogy you cannot afford to skip.
    Last edited by CT-867-5309, Aug 9, 2014
  5. DarthJenari Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 17, 2011
    star 4
    Are they good books? They're honestly not terrible, and I for the most part enjoyed them. However, they do not, in any way, honor the New Jedi Order Series or the important events and outcome from the novels in it. They are the start, of those things being completely overturned. I'd say they're interesting enough, and are therefore worth reading, but they're really not necessary. Only a few things in them have any real bearing on LOTF, and where certain characters are within it. The plot of LOTF really doesn't require you to read DNT at all though.

    EDIT: You should prepare yourself ahead of time, take classes, read some books on dealing with pain and loss, and get in contact with a therapist to have appointments ready, so you can deal with the disappointment when you read FOTJ.
    Last edited by DarthJenari, Aug 9, 2014
  6. TheNewEmpire Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 12, 2007
    star 3
    Without spoilers can you elaborate?
  7. TheNewEmpire Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 12, 2007
    star 3

    Sorry, I got confused. I assumed that you were replying to my stated intention to read the LOTF books but you were actually speaking about the 9 book series following LOTF. Sorry. Caught me out there.[face_blush]
  8. Darkwriter Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 28, 2006
    star 4


    It is. And the Dark Nest Trilogy is a fantastic precursor to that series, it really sets up what happens in LOTF. I don't want to spoil the main plot if you don't know it already (although I'm guessing you do). But if you want to get the most out of LOTF, you absolutely HAVE to read the Dark Nest Trilogy. Otherwise, the first book will make very little sense. Besides the fact, Troy Denning is one of my favorite authors. He's so skilled at creating internal conflict; I feel like my heart breaks every time I read one of his stories. And for good reason, given his reputation as an EU author.

    I really enjoyed FOTJ too, but Legacy is my favorite era. It's pretty different from what precedes it, but I think it does have a lot of value. Too bad they won't be publishing Sword of the Jedi...
    _Catherine_ likes this.
  9. Kablob Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 24, 2014
    star 4
    Wait, you're talking about LOTF with that?

    Oh. Oh my.

    I am so, so sorry.
  10. DarthJenari Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 17, 2011
    star 4

    The lessons Luke and the Jedi learn during NJO, and the conclusion they reach at the end, the role Vergere played in things, Jacen's character arc and journey, the Galactic Alliance, Tahiri's character, all these things are pretty much destroyed by the time you reach Crucible, the last novel to chronically take place within the old EU, but their destruction can be said to start with DNT. That's why I said it doesn't honor NJO. In fact, i'd go a little further and say it doesn't even attempt to be read/written in the same spirit, because it takes up the trend of pushing all non-solo/skywalker Jedi to the background, whereas NJO has them as the main heroes of course, but others still get to shine.
    Force Smuggler likes this.
  11. Kablob Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 24, 2014
    star 4
    If anything, LOTF will give you a new appreciation for Anakin Skywalker's fall. Because it will look so much better by comparison.

    LOTF is like a lazy rehash of the prequels. Yes, it's so bad that it looks lazy next to the prequels.
    Last edited by Kablob, Aug 9, 2014
  12. AdmiralWesJanson Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 23, 2005
    star 5
    I applaud you for posting this with a straight face.

    Denning is a decent writer, but his Star Wars books have issues with pet characters, inane plot elements, characterization issues, and an unnecessary about of gorn. Like Traviss, he may be a good author, but is a poor Star Wars writer.
    Force Smuggler and Kablob like this.
  13. Vthuil Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 3, 2013
    star 4
    Don't be sarcastic to people who may be asking a serious question.

    Particularly when said sarcasm might result in them actually reading the DNT. Urgh.
  14. Darkwriter Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 28, 2006
    star 4

    I'd disagree. DNT starts asking questions about the bureaucracy of the Jedi Order, which is a direct result of the NJO. DNT and beyond deal with the consequences of what Jacen went through and how that effected his philosophy. One of the reasons I loved DNT is because it deals with the political strife between the Jedi and the GA, which was after all the reason Palpatine managed to overthrow the Old Jedi Order. And I always felt that Allston especially tried to introduce more minor characters into whatever book he was writing.

    I have to agree with you about Tahiri, however. Watching her get tossed around feel like whiplash.
  15. Kablob Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 24, 2014
    star 4
    If you're a fan of NJO, then I'd advise you to just stop once you're done with it. It will spare you the pain and urge to bash your head against a wall.

    This is what I mean by saying that LOTF is a bad rehash of the prequels. What was the kriffing point of creating a new Jedi Order and Republic, if they're going to repeat every single mistake made in the last thousand years of the Old Republic, except that this time they're going to drive the galaxy into the ground in less than forty!
    Last edited by Kablob, Aug 9, 2014
  16. Darth_Henning Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 1, 2007
    star 3
    They were ok. Not great, not terrible.

    Some of the characterizations (mostly Jacen, Cal Omas, and the senior Jedi) were radically different from what was set up in NJO. However, the story itself was comprehensible and worked somewhat. Had it been taken in a different direction afterwards it would probably be remembered as a decent, but unnecessary series.

    Unfortunately, what did wind up following it has turned it into a much maligned trilogy, more than it deserves, despite several flaws.
    Riv_Shiel and Valin__Kenobi like this.
  17. DarthJenari Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 17, 2011
    star 4

    Not really interested in getting into an argument about it, seeing as you've already given your opinion and i've given mine, but the only thing you said right was the structure of the Jedi Order and how it worked with the Galactic Alliance. I'd point out that I didn't say it did every single thing wrong, I just pointed out major things it did wrong. The path Jacen took after NJO made no sense and was terribly written, the philosophy he developed resembles his NJO one, and Vergere's in a fairly small way, but contradicts it in many others. We pretty much see where he is in the final novels of NJO, and the places he goes to after don't correlate with that at all. Minor characters are introduced, of course minor characters will appear in every book, even a book written in the first person that focuses on one character specifically. However, there's still an immense focus on the Skywalker/Solo family, with everyone else from DNT on being given smaller roles. One of the best things about NJO was in fact that it actually focused on many characters within the New Jedi Order. Some were introduced just to die of course, but many old characters received a good deal of focus and development. That disappears in DNT, starting with the Young Jedi Knight group.
    Last edited by DarthJenari, Aug 9, 2014
  18. Kablob Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 24, 2014
    star 4
    Basically, you're about to take a long dive into the worst of the EU. DNT isn't the worst, but it's the beginning of a long slide into utter terribleness. By Crucible, I'm convinced that a reboot was actually necessary, and I'm glad we got one.
    Last edited by Kablob, Aug 9, 2014
    Pfluegermeister likes this.
  19. Darkwriter Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 28, 2006
    star 4

    Okay, I'll admit that Jacen's shift in philosophy is rather abrupt. I just kind of took it as a result of the five years he spent off by himself. I was never satisfied with that and would have liked to see the empty five years between NJO and DNT filled in. Jaina's character suffered pretty heavily from that period, too, and was written off as PTSD. Basically. I still enjoyed the series, though it's okay of you didn't. Each to their own.
  20. Ender Sai Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 18, 2001
    star 9
    It's like this...

    Do you need to experience cancer to be a stronger human being? No, though undoubtedly, surviving cancer will make you stronger.

    Dork Nest is utterly and irredeemably awful, much in the same way biological warfare or the Taliban are awful.
  21. DarthJenari Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 17, 2011
    star 4

    I think that's the in-universe justification for the most part, and of course that's one of the main things we see FOTJ attempt to deal with. I also really wanted a set of novels focusing on his journey, if only because I enjoyed seeing closer looks at other Force Organizations.

    It's like I said in my initial post, I enjoyed the books despite the negative impact I thought they had on a lot of things. I thought the conflict itself was fairly interesting, along with the villain, and this is the start of Alema Rar's journey, which is in my opinion the greatest contribution Denning ever made to the EU.
    Darkwriter likes this.
  22. Darth_Henning Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 1, 2007
    star 3
    We could have rebootedd post NJO and it would all have been good.

    LOTF and onwards could have BEEN Jacen's dark vision...
  23. Kablob Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 24, 2014
    star 4
    Yikes. Even I think that's too harsh. Comparing a bad book series with things that literally kill people is a bit much.

    Include NJO in that and I'm with you. Actually, make that a reboot of post-ROTJ and I'm with you even more. I can count the good things from after ROTJ on one hand.
    Last edited by Kablob, Aug 9, 2014
  24. Ender Sai Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Feb 18, 2001
    star 9
    Not really. It was that bad.

    Jacen turned off sensors witht he force FROM HIS X-WING. That is not ok.
    Pfluegermeister likes this.
  25. Vthuil Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 3, 2013
    star 4
    Er. If you're going to quasi-Godwin the thread, couldn't you at least do it over things that are seriously wrong with those books? Dumb Force use is nothing exceptional.