The Dawn of a Mary Sue.. The Bria Tharen HATERS club.

Discussion in 'EU Community' started by jewlmc, Aug 7, 2002.

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  1. eeyore Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jan 19, 2001
    star 3
    Adi,

    I remember reading a Bria fan posting that Han joined the Rebellion to avenge Bria's death, and that's why he ran down the hallways shouting at the stormtroopers in ANH. Rather funny, considering Bria didn't exist back then :p

    Harrison Ford had a lot of good insights into Han's character before he starting hating SW.
  2. Friend_of_Skylark Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 19, 2002
    star 5
    I just think it's really funny how Harrison wanted Han to die in the last movie but GL wouldn't let him :D
  3. Shelley Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Sep 9, 2001
    star 5
    Well I'm glad Lucas didn't kill Han off. Leia would've been heartbroken (which would be too much after such a wrenching separation), not to mention Chewie and Luke.

    Han chasing after the stormtroopers because of Briarf? That's a new one. Jeez, some Briarf fans seem to have some trouble with the fact that ANH was scripted and filmed long before Briarf was so much as a twinkle in her creator's eye.

    Lucas created Han, and he did not create him as a heartbroken, hurt-by-love man. Nor did Harrison Ford play him that way. Why? Because he was neither heartbroken nor hurt by love. No amount of retroactive "explaining" for non-existent emotions using one of the most blatant Mary Sues ever to grace (if that's the word) a printed page will change that.
  4. Jedi15 Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Nov 7, 1999
    star 4
    Han chasing after the stormtroopers because of Briarf? That's a new one. Jeez, some Briarf fans seem to have some trouble with the fact that ANH was scripted and filmed long before Briarf was so much as a twinkle in her creator's eye.

    Kinda like the Mara fans who keep insisting that Mara is in ROTJ, despite the fact that Mara didn't even exist until 1991!

    And the idea that Han chasing after the stormtroopers because of revenge for Bria or whatever is ridiculous. That scene was played strictly for laughs (and it worked!). :D
  5. ReaperFett Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 9, 1999
    star 6
    possibly my favourite scene :)



    The revenge idea doesn't really work though, because it doesn't as such say that the Imperials killed her. It just said the Imperials IDed the body. And had Han wanted revenge, the Mos Eisley guard would have been wiped out.
  6. Adi_Gallia_9 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Apr 16, 2001
    star 5
    Good point, RF. We saw how Han grieves in the NJO. Is he was so heartbroken about bria why didn't he either shoot everyone in sight or run away from everything and everyone?
  7. Guinastasia Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 9, 2002
    star 6
    Mara in ROTJ: in the SE, you can see a dancer in blue and white, with blue and white striped hair, in Jabba's Palace. Most of us Mara fans like to think of that dancer as Mara, possibly. Hey, why not-it's just a dancer.

    :p
  8. jewlmc Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 29, 1999
    star 4
    Hey,why not-It's just a dancer.

    Because it isn't Mara that's why. :p I believe the character actually has a name.

    But we are getting into territory that belongs in the MJ HATER club not here.
  9. Aunecah_Skywalker Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 25, 2002
    star 5
    Could somebody please tell me in which flashy cover with a lot of literary papers inside it Bria Tharen was introduced in? I just want to read the story before I make any opinions - though the posts I've read here practically convinced me already that she's ... err ... yeah.

    Aunecah_Skywalker
  10. Adi_Gallia_9 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Apr 16, 2001
    star 5
    The Paradise Snare by Ann Crispin. It's a pretty good book, bria excluded.
  11. Aunecah_Skywalker Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 25, 2002
    star 5
  12. Shelley Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Sep 9, 2001
    star 5
    Han wasn't heartbroken about Briarf because there was no Briarf. :)

    But even if there was, it sure doesn't look like he was too devastated over her death. So I guess he shares my opinion that she wasn't worth it.
  13. Adi_Gallia_9 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Apr 16, 2001
    star 5
    I hate how bria fans claim he was heartbroken in ANH! :mad: They claim he's grieving off-screen. I respect their opinions, but how do they know what he's doing? If his attitude on-screen is any indication, he's perfectly happy off-screen. It's annoying how bria is presumed to be such a factor in ANH.
  14. Shelley Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Sep 9, 2001
    star 5
    She isn't a factor; Lucas wasn't even aware of her when writing or filming ANH--and from what I understand he still isn't. Any attempts to shoehorn her into the movie by saying that Han grieves "offscreen" is pure wishful thinking.

    Han isn't grieving. Onscreen or off.
  15. MenionLeah Jedi Padawan

    Member Since:
    Mar 17, 2002
    I find it hysterical how some people can claim that Lucas knows nothing about Han's character, therefore if Lucas says that Han wasn't heartbroken in ANH it means nothing - only Crispin really know Han Solo as the heartbroken, grieving over a lost love man we saw in ANH ;)

    Did anyone here know that Crispin got the idea of Bria meeting Winter and Bria stealing the Death Star plans from Bria fans on SW boards? Very interesting...
  16. Shelley Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Sep 9, 2001
    star 5
    I didn't know that, but I'm not surprised.
  17. eeyore Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jan 19, 2001
    star 3
    Whenever an author solicits ideas from the fans, it turns into a big fanfic. Case in point: Tyers soliciting ideas from the fans for Balance Point for it to include a ton of love scenes in it. It's a nice thought, but what fans of characters often want isn't good for the storyline. Bria could have been much more tolerable if she wasn't made so important and knowing every important person in the galaxy.

    The thing about Bail is pretty sad. The only time Bail is ever mentioned in the EU, it's so he can be so impressed by Bria that he's inspired to join the Rebellion. From the way Bail looks in AOTC, he doesn't seem like the type who would be easily bowled over by a pretty face.

    I don't understand people saying that Lucas is wrong. It's his universe, so in Star Wars terms, he's plays God. I don't agree with everything he's done (Jar-Jar, for example) but I don't use it to discredit what he intended in the original trilogy.
  18. Shelley Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Sep 9, 2001
    star 5
    Yes, it's a real shame about Bail. That is, I believe, his only appearance as an actual character in the EU (instead of simply being referred to), and it's to pay homage to the Mary Sue-iest of Mary Sues.

    And I cannot reconcile the Bail I saw in AOTC with the Bail in that book. Bail in AOTC looked like he was going to start the Rebellion himself. And he certainly didn't seem the type to turn to mush over a pretty face and say, "Gosh golly, Beautiful Girl! I'll join your cause right now!"

    This is off topic, but one of my favorite images from AOTC is at the end, when Bail brings his knuckles down on the balcony railing in regret and frustration. The use of a Clone Army is not what he wanted, he tried to stop it ("Unfortunately the debate is not over.") but he couldn't. Great moment.
  19. Adi_Gallia_9 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Apr 16, 2001
    star 5
    I know! I love that part, Shelley! It shows just what kind a person Bail is; he's a compassionate leader who wants the best for his people. He helped form the Republic; he didn't join it because of a girl. He joined it b/c he didn't agree with Palpatine and the path he was taking. Damn Mary Sue. :mad: But I'm confident Ep. 3 will help show the Crispin was completely off on Bail. Just like Owen as Anakin's stepbrother replaced Owen as Obi-Wan's brother, George will fix the Bail issue as well.

    And I agree while I don't agree with everyone George has done, I accept even those things as canon, such as Jar Jar. I might not like it, but I can't deny he is part of Star Wars b/c George wanted him to be. In the same vein, the bria fans can't deny that Han was fine in ANH just because they want to. George made Han perfectly fine in ANH; therefore Han is perfectly fine in ANH. George is to Star Wars as God is to the Bible. Like it or not, what George puts in Star Wars is the truth.

    And it's completely wrong for the authors to take fans' ideas and put them into their books. It would be a good fault, but it results in a book skewed to one part of the fandom.
  20. eeyore Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Jan 19, 2001
    star 3
    Much of Crispin's trilogy has been contradicted already....

    Boba Fett has been revealed as a clone, not "Jaster Mareel" who adopted the name Boba Fett later on in life...

    The Death Star plans being shown in AOTC, where obviously Bria hadn't transmitted them yet...

    Jabba the Hutt being shown as being in power in TPM, while in Crispin's trilogy, he only rose to power a few years before ANH...

    Life is good :)
  21. ReaperFett Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 9, 1999
    star 6
    The Boba thing wasnt her planning was there ages.


    And that was all fixed months before we saw EP2 :)
  22. Shelley Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Sep 9, 2001
    star 5
    Therefore, the EU was retrofitted to the movies. Not the other way around. Lucas ignored the EU when he started to make the prequels; EUthors have to scramble to make their stories and characters fit, coming up with some really entertaining contEUrtions. And usually they don't work very well anyway.

    Briarf is a Mary Sue who has no place in SW.
  23. Doo-Kimmie Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Oct 22, 2001
    star 1
    Yes! YES! There's a Briarf haters club! Now I can vent my rage at this character who was written to do nothing except to try and usurp Leia's place in Han's heart.

    I don't understand why the briarf-lovers think that Han is "heartbroken" in ANH. He doesn't look it to me.

    briarf is a thinly-veiled Mary Sue and, as my good buddy Shelley says, has no place in Star Wars! Down with briarf!

    Woo-Hoo!
  24. Jedi15 Jedi Youngling

    Member Since:
    Nov 7, 1999
    star 4
    Bria is a cheese-head. :)
  25. Doo-Kimmie Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Oct 22, 2001
    star 1
    Briarf is a major cheese-head. Blecch...

    Even if she mattered, and she doesn't, she couldn't hold a candle to Leia Organa! No way, no day! :)
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