The Demotion of Strilo

Based on a combination of both Grimby and Strilo's posts, I'm not even sure I see the rationale for a ban in all this.

 

Exactly. This shows that there is a complete breakdown of communication.

 

You would think the reasonable response would be to reserve judgement when not fully informed, not to draw conclusions.

 

So, from what I can read from all of this:

Grimby knows he's wrong and wants to cover it up
or
Grimby has different standards than everyone else
or
Grimby can't take criticism

Doesn't it just make you have such confidence in the admins?

 

Sometimes you need to start drawing conclusions to get the facts to come out.

 

I motion for a call of NO CONFIDENCE

 

I don't think this is an indication that the entire MS is 'broken'. There are many mods that you've seen in here who are actively voicing their opinions on how all this went down. Many of us have openly disagree with the process and, ultimately, Strilo's demotion. It's important to remember that we can learn and effect change out of situations like this. I hope that even though you may be dissatisfied and frustrated at this point, you realize that there are many mods actively working to help today and in the future to ensure this doesn't happen again.

 

I think it's great to take steps to make it not happen again. Why not start with this one though? Why has the train already passed on this?

 

Seems like a rather backwards, illogical way of dealing with a situation to me, and one that very easily leads to false conclusions. You could try asking questions rather than posting accusations and waiting for a defense.

EDIT: To clarify, I am not taking a side in the matter, just stating that I think its counterproductive to getting answers and the truth certain people profess to be seeking by forcing someone to have to walk down a line of defending against false accusations and misinformed conclusions.

 

I do understand and agree with this. I didn't intend that as a "I don't trust MS anymore arg!". I mean it as a....well, Cobranaconda kind of said it better than me.

I believe that in this situation, it might be more practical for the mods to work alongside with the public to fix this - to an extent. Obviously, Strilo has already been demoted so that's that. There is much more to that situation than the simple fact of his demotion, and the rest needs to be addressed and fixed. I see 3 different parties right now - the admins, MS, and the public. And I'm inclined to think that none of us are really on the same exact page, and we really need to be. Xcore communication is needed.

 

I don't know that it has, Chris. But that's, ultimately, not my decision to make. I'm honestly of the mind that it can be rectified and the issues between the admins and Strilo mediated provided all parties would agree. But that's one opinion here.

edit - I agree that we need to get on the same page here. I'm pretty much posting the same things in the MS as I am here - with the exception of the mediation...I just came up with that. I just want people to understand that, at least for me, I can see both sides of the issue but I think both sides need to come to a middle ground here and understand the other. It's not cut and dry and this could have been avoided, in whole or part, by more clear communication.

 

Well, ya see, we have been waiting. And waiting. And waiting. And waiting. And waiting. You keep people waiting and then give them vague explanations, you get people drawing their own conclusions. It's calling being a functional human being and using your higher brain power to draw these conclusions.

 

I would agree if someone I could genuinely trust was mediating the open discussions.

 

I have no way to answer this other than to be direct. LAJ is a good admin but she tends to go along with the flow of what the other admins think. That's just my opinion based on working with her. As for Rogue...Jedi, I do trust him to a certain extent to be a good admin, I just think this situation has gotten far beyond his control. And both of them answer to Grimby.

EDIT: Also, Sinrebirth, I did not use the words "appreciate" or "accepted" at all. You did. So the answer to that is no I do not feel I was not appreciated or accepted by all three admins. That's why I did not say that.

 

We still haven't heard from the other two admins what their decision was based on. Also, Strilo said he told them both that Grimby's assessment wasn't entirely true and thus would be glad to furnish them any evidence which they required. LAJ didn't take him up on it, Rogue only made cursory inquiries, from what I bothered to read.

If they came to the conclusion based nearly solely on Grimby's accusations, is it valid?

 

So far Strilo is the only one who has actually listed a series of events and facts that has effectively explained the events that transpired. If the truth of the matter is that Grimby is to blame, then yes you are correct - it will come across that he is to blame. Your manner of talk is implying that the blame could not possibly be on Grimby, therefore the explanation is not constructive. Would you like to explain what your version of "constructive" is?

 

There are so many things wrong with this. First off, yes, it would appear that this is an issue between Grimby and Strilo. What's controversial about that? Secondly, yes, Grimby as been rationalizing. That's not a good thing. That means he's explaining away issues. I also don't think you understand how situations like this come to be resolved. Yes, he is extending the issue. But that's clearly because he feels the issue has not been fairly represented. And that's his right. Is he supposed to come in here, see that Grimby has posted something he feels does not reflect the situation accurately and then just shrug his shoulders and say "Well shucks, that doesn't seem quite right to me, but the Head Admin is spoken, so I guess I'll be quiet"? Is he supposed to just toe the line? Because that's not a constructive way to deal with this. Neither is the way that Grimby and the other admins have been dealing with this. So far the most constructive post by one of the principles in this issue has been Strilo's.

 

And again I feel it needs to be pointed out that this was a decision made by ALL of the admins, so it is unfair to have a witch-hunt against only 1 of the 3 people who made the decision. Not that I am endorsing a witch hunt of the entire Admin team, but I do think people need to comprehend that Grimby was not acting alone in his decision.

 

You missed the You know, what I usually do when I'm making light of a situation...

 

seems like Grimby's dislike of Strilo's behaviour has festered for some time without the absolute seriousness of the situation being directly communicated. it seems like a breaking point has been reached, evidenced by the facts we already know: becoming aggrieved over something that isn't an issue at all (Strilo's post in the VIPs thread), flaming over PM, reacting unprofessionally and banning oneself ridiculously. and yet, in this heated and highly emotional state (never the right time to make a decision such as this -- isn't that what the ban is for? to "cool down"?) deciding to wield what power is left and just... remove the problem. probably because there's a sense of embarrassment that he's allowed himself to get to that state in the first place. the two other administrators are culpable in that they haven't stood up against what was obviously a poorly thought out and non-reasoned request ("it's either Strilo or me!"). if we're going to give absolute power to a head admin, then we certainly need two fellow administrators who can stand up and reason against whoever is the holder of that post. checks and balances.

Strilo sounds like he's acted like a bit of a **** for a long time, and perhaps he should have been more wary of the line he was treading. there was almost certainly a stubborn point of no return where he'd lost all respect for the administration and most likely acted uncooperatively. but ultimately that is irrelevent in the context of this discussion. the circumstances surrounding his dismissal and the way it has been handled are poor. it sounds like fair warning was not given and that the head admin has let a lot of built up grief, most likely all reasonable and justified, explode into some very poor decision making. not the behaviour that is expected or required, despite the demands of the job. a head admin should be able to discuss things reasonably, and communicate with his mods at all times. he should EARN respect through his actions and his ability to reason and see things from different perspectives; it should not be demanded because of the position or an expectation to tow the line. certainly he should keep a clear head at all times, and that doesn't appear to the case at all, certainly not in the last week.

 

Just to say that RJ and LAJ are currently offline. They are not ignoring the thread.

 

I just want to take a moment to point out how incredibly wrong headed this is. You clearly don't have a grasp of the concepts "constructive" or "truth". This is exactly the kind of close-mindedness myself and others have been afraid of.

 

Sinrebirth, I don't want to reply to your post extensively because I don't want this to get off topic. I just want to say that the post you just made is a bit unsettling to hear.