If this is a retcon Darkseid, well, just tell me and obviously I can't say anything. And because I don't feel like addressing telepathy later, I'll just put this out here and if I'm wrong someone tell me. When he controlled those Daxamites he had sapped the power of Mordru and the Time Trapper as well as gathering pretty much every magical artifact in that century. I've never heard of him using offensive or persauding TP any other time. He needed black kryptonite to mindwarp Supergirl. Juggernaut will just pound him eventually into unconsciousness because the Darksied that has been in comics since the inception of the drafts, especially as he's be come part of the more mainstream DCU, is not powerful enough to hurt Juggernaut. I don't know if it was exactly since the Crisis, I think it was actually a little after, but it was basically when they decided to make him a mainstream, personal villain. And he will (eventually) get a mainstream, personal beatdown. But if this is old-school, never-before-appeared-all-my-losses-are-avatars Darkseid, then I lose. But then someone should have said so. This isn't some huge revelation of someone's power. We all knew Seid's power and it was assumed and repeatedly stated we were using him with his recent feats including losses to people who, if his never having been hurt by people around Supes-level strength or even the godforce means anything, will include Juggernaut. So yeah, recap: Nerf Darkseid which we have been using and acknowledging as I posted above loses. Old Darkseid who seems to have somehow been inserted here without anyone saying anything wins. This isn't news.