Discussion The Empire in the ST

Discussion in 'Star Wars: Episode VII - Spoilers Allowed' started by purplerain, Oct 2, 2013.

  1. Darth Tunes SfC Commish on an "All-Star" break

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    I don't think it would be impossible, though. It would be helpful & interesting for Episode VII/the ST if new, non-Sith villainous elements were introduced, elements that would aid The Empire.
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  2. Dra--- Chosen One

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    Dec 30, 2012
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    Sure. I figure the Remnant may try to supplement itself with the aid of crime elements or bounty hunters.

    Or their own Imperial Jedi.
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  3. Darth Tunes SfC Commish on an "All-Star" break

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    Hmmm, villainous Jedi? Intriguing.
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  4. Dra--- Chosen One

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    I think it could be pretty cool, but I doubt they'll do it for the ST. I think they want a return to the black and white world of the OT. Introducing gray Jedi would probably confuse things too much. Which I would love. :cool:
  5. Darth Tunes SfC Commish on an "All-Star" break

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    Nah, if done right, I think it could work. Rather than it make that a major plot point in Episode VII (as it would be such a deviation from what we've seen from most of the Jedi portrayed on screen), it could be something hinted at/briefly shown. Build up to it. Episode's VIII & IX would work greatly to have villainous/corrupt Jedi aiding The Empire in their quest to regain former control & glories.
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  6. T-R- Chosen One

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    The Republic/Alliance only have 1 Jedi as of the end of RotJ. We don't know how long it took to find and train a number that would make an impact.

    The Republic had 10,000 Jedi and a clone army, and were still pushed to the brink by droids.

    While the regional governors may be gone, it doesn't mean that the remnant wouldn't consolidate power in a region sympathetic to their cause.
  7. purplerain Force Ghost

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    Sep 14, 2013
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    I was actually going by the Jedi army scene in AOTC.
  8. Mortran Force Ghost

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    Those who speculate about the Empire in Episode VII haven't understood what Episode IV to VI was all about.
    It was a civil war, not a war like WWII.
    ROTJ ended with a successful coup against the government. The Empire did not cease to exist or was defeated. Its government was replaced by a republic. The Republic and the Empire are the same political entity. The remaining inperial fleet and stormtroopers surrendered to nobody after ROTJ, they still get their orders from Coruscant. It is just somebody else being in charge there.
    Since the Empire turned into a Republic after Episode VI authoritarian structures will of course be dismantled over time. But this doesn't mean that all imperial officers just got fired. They remain in their position, get different orders and some of them will get retired. This is how a coup or revolution works. The OT is not about a war between two nations. It is a political struggle inside the Empire. The Empire didn't get destroyed after ROTJ, it got transformed. Just like the Republican military got transformed into an imperial military in Episode III, it got re-transformed into a Republican military after the death of Palpatine.This is how things work in the real world. And the political aspects of Star Wars are not different, since they are copied from the real world.

    So of course there will be an Empire in Episode VII. But it will not be called Empire but Republic. And it will not be ruled by the bad guys, but by the good guys like in the prequels. And the imperial soldiers might not wear stormtrooper uniforms. Uniforms change, political systems change, the Empire remains, even if it is called differently.
  9. Darth Chiznuk Chosen One

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    I understand very well what the struggle in the OT is about. GL has said that one of his influences was the French Revolution and after the royals were ousted from power they didn't just give up. Instead they fought on for several years even though the king and queen had been executed and even came back into power for a while after Napoleon was defeated. Not all revolutions go as smoothly as you describe. The Imperials aren't just officers many of them could be held responsible for the atrocities committed by the Empire and tried as war criminals. So can I see many of these officers holding onto their territory by any means necessary instead of giving up and going to jail or being executed? Yes, I can.
  10. redlightning Jedi Master

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    There could be a new Galactic Emperor who is not a Force user calling the shots and claims to be the heir to Palpatine.
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  11. Iron_lord Chosen One

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    The EU already did this one - he was called Trioculus, and while not a Force User, pretended to be one.

    Maybe, given the whole "original story" thing - it'll be something completely different from anything we've seen before.
  12. darklordoftech Force Ghost

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    I'd love for a non-Force-user to be in charge for once.
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  13. darklordoftech Force Ghost

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    I also love the concept of Imperial Knights. They use The Force to serve the Empire, not to rule it.
    Last edited by darklordoftech, May 18, 2014
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  14. jedijax Force Ghost

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    People really are obsessed with the Empire, aren't they?
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  15. Cushing's Admirer Force Ghost

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    Personally it won't feel like SW without the Empire but I do hope the tone shifts. I don't think they were ever about 'power' as a whole more about order.
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  16. Force Smuggler Chosen One

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    I'll agree with this. Also showing them being the lesser power would be interesting.
  17. darklordoftech Force Ghost

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    The main reasons for having the Empire in the ST are:

    1. The Empire is one of the first things that comes to mind when people hear the words "Star Wars". The first paragraph of ANH's opening crawl talks about the Empire.

    2. It avoids having an army come out of nowhere. The Empire, unlike some other anti-Republic faction that could be invented for the ST, is established to exist in the GFFA.
    =D=
    Last edited by darklordoftech, May 18, 2014
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  18. KINGKONG83 Force Ghost

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    The repel insurgents claimed to be loyalists working to restore the republic,the empire is still the lawful form of the republic and is the state that has stood for milennia,so either they have to try reform the empire back to a republic or start a rival state and do it by right of conquest pitting them directly against the lawful state they are sworn to reform...this is a conflict that may still go on if the latter was true,after all the rebel insurgency was numerally extremely weak in comparison to the Empire..
  19. DARTH_BELO Force Ghost

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    I think it's time to be done with the empire… This is over 30 years later. Sure, I agree that the dying of a head of state doesn't necessarily eradicate the entire government, but over three decades should be more than enough to do away with the Empire completely. (The Nazi regime did not take anywhere near that long in order to completely fade into history. Yes, I used the Nazi regime as an example – it could be said that it is the organization that is closest in comparison to the Empire, therefore IMO it is a relevant comparison.)

    I really hope we don't come into episode VII seeing a galaxy that's still being influenced by remnant imperial powers, or a completely wartorn society. 30 or so years is too long of a time for all that to still be in the middle of happening...

    The only thing I suppose I'd be disappointed with in not seeing anything involving the Empire would be missing out on seeing TIE fighters and star destroyers again. But perhaps it's time to take an opportunity to create some completely new iconic enemy vehicles/starships!!
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  20. DarthWilliams Force Ghost

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    And the Roman Empire was in decline for more than a century before it fully fell. And that's a more apt comparison in terms of size and scope (if we're going to compare real life to SW at all), no?
  21. DARTH_BELO Force Ghost

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    You're right, it is difficult to apply real-life examples to Star Wars.

    Although if I remember correctly, the Roman empire didn't fall mainly because Of a singular effort by a rebellion or warring nation, rather a decline over a long period of time after the government became corrupt, the empire expanded to far, and the general decaying of society in a broad sense.

    In the case of Star Wars, the defeat of the Empire would have come due to a direct effort by the rebel alliance-Not because of a drawn out weakening of their general social/political structure.

    I will agree that in terms of scale and governmental operation, the Roman empire is a good example to compare to the Galactic Empire – but This difference in what really was the catalyst for the Galactic empire's defeat is why I was more inclined to compare it to the Nazi regime rather than the Roman empire.
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  22. Iron_lord Chosen One

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    Hitler's rise might resemble Palpatine's somewhat - but he fell to invasion rather than rebellion.

    Better parallels might be to rulers that were brought down by rebels - Tsar Nicholas II of Russia, King Charles I of England, Louis XVI of France, Julius Caesar of Rome, and so on.

    What happened to the rebels in these cases?

    Sometimes they were brought down by infighting, sometimes by the deceased ruler's friends and relatives, sometimes they ended up becoming as brutal as the ruler they replaced, or even more so.

    Not sure if Disney would want to paint The Rebels as the villains of the new movie series.
  23. D'an Jedi Grand Master

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    Apr 21, 2014
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    Imperial Remnants are for a Thrawn/Boba Fett/Wedge Antilles/Rogue Squadron spinoff.

    The fall of the Empire is more akin to the fall of the Nazis. After the death of Hitler/Palpatine, the brainwashed curse was lifted.

    The fall of the Old Republic is more like the fall of Rome. Gradual decay from the inside out.

    The Empire will be dead in the ST. Quote me.
  24. Darth_Pevra Chosen One

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    May 21, 2008
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    Ah, so quickly? Then why were former Nazis still found in high positions well after the war?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kurt_Waldheim
    http://www.spiegel.de/international...is-played-in-early-west-germany-a-810207.html

    I could find more articles. Maybe for Americans it seemed like everything was over after 45, but Nazism and the war had extreme long lasting consequences for Germany and Austria! So much that the people are still stigmatized today. There are no other countries where the paranoia of being associated with Nazis is this wide-spread.
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  25. D'an Jedi Grand Master

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    Apr 21, 2014
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    And yet Berlin was occupied by foreign entities for the next 35 years. I'm struggling to remember when the Nazis posed a major military threat on a global scale after April of 1945. Oh, that's right- they didn't. They basically laid down their arms despite Hitler's dying wish to continue fighting a gorilla war in the Bavarian Alps. The revelations of the Nazi's war crimes rapidly turned their own people against them.