Lit The Essential Atlas and Galactic Cartography: Official Discussion

Discussion in 'Literature' started by CeiranHarmony, Oct 14, 2005.

  1. jasonfry VIP

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    Darth Bane locations will appear in the next online appendix, out soon.

    Re representation, things get wacky in the Core -- as discussed in the Atlas, lots of the founding worlds kept the right to Senate representation at the system level. Kamino is extragalactic, so it could have been given a seat as part of some hastily created freestanding subsector, or it might have been given a seat as a functional constituency, a la the Trade Federation etc. Either would seem to fit with the comment about the Kaminoans' creation of the clone army giving them a Senate seat.

    I don't recall a senator from Toydaria in Senate Murders -- where does he/she appear? Nor do I recall the Sakiyan senator -- where's the reference? There's enough wiggle room to figure out something, but would need more specifics....
  2. CeiranHarmony Jedi Master

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    In addition to Jasons wiggle room and Atlas built-in saftey precautions I might add:

    Maybe some are nonseated Senators as opposed to seated ones, and they rotate. Or and even simpler, they are senators but not all of them have the right to vote. Hutt Space and other nonrep territory might have lots of seats in the Senate as diplomatic functionaries called Senators, too, just without voting power. they all have representatives on Coruscant in embassies and listen to holofeeds and news on senate sessions, it'd make sense to have them participate and join in a originally perfect democracy of the ancient old Republic even if not fully joining the Republic. so they can raise a point and discuss but not vote on it until they obey the republican laws in joining.
  3. blackmyron Force Ghost

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    I've been trying to tally the senators in the ROTE/CW era and see who's definitely sector senator and who isn't, especially in light of the Atlas. Kastolar Sector, for instance, has a senator from Sneeve and Chalacta; Lambda Sector has Ando, Andosha II and Rintonne with senators.
    To confuse the issue further, Mon Calamari sets a precedent with having "co-Senators", although I believe the Anx temporarily had them as well with Sen. Ryyder's retirement.
    I assumed that with sectors leaving the Republic, there would be vacancies for "new" representation, like Kamino. I like the idea that they could slide in under the provisions for "economic powers".
    For the most part, though, the "single system" representation I would think would be exceptions granted during the initial Reformations to certain worlds as a concession, but unlikely (besides Kamino) to be granted to any new world.
    I'd like to see more the "Representative" system in play.
  4. AdmiralNick22 Fleet Admiral of Literature

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    IIRC, Janson/Dan mentioned that another exception to the "One Senator per Sector" rule was if it contained a world that was the homeworld of a major species. Some if a sector has several major worlds that are the homeworlds of a member species, that sector has multiple senators.

    Alas, I am housesitting at the moment, so I don't have my copy of the Atlas handy.

    --Adm. Nick
  5. Senator_Cilghal Jedi Master

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    In Senate Murders, there's a scene where a Toydarian delegation, inc the King of Toydaria from Ambush, can be seen in the pod beside the Naboo pod. This does kinda jive with HNN Holocast, which indicated Toydaria had joined Republic after Ambush.

    Esseles's multiple senators is vague in chronology, but I think is meant to be pre-Ruusan reformation.

    In MedStar vol I, the Sakiyan Admiral's ambition is to become Senator of Saki...note that although technically in the midst of Hutt Space, IIRC the Sakiyans have always kept political independence from the Hutts, so I don't know of any reason the should not be in the Republic.

    I also noticed in the opening scenes that the Tarnab Senator (Mot Not Rab?) and apparently even Mas Amedda are part of the pro-military expansion group that includes the Kaminoan and Umbaran Senators
  6. jasonfry VIP

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    Ah, thanks re Saki. Saki did remain nominally independent, so it having a senator works. That senator could be a Hutt pawn, a Republic attempt at creating a pawn of its own in the heart of Hutt Space, etc.

    Re Toydarians, a caution: Dave Filoni has repeatedly resisted/tried to work against the idea that all members of a species are the same or all from the same place. I'm not speaking for him, but I can easily imagine him saying that those might be Toydarians from some other system. Or as has been noted, the Toydarians could be a non-voting senatorial chair, an observers' delegation, a full-fledged senatorial seat granted as part of wartime politics and tolerated by the Hutts, etc. Come to think of it, Hutt Space is huge during the Clone Wars, but we've said it's a de facto zone of influence, not a de jure political entity. So there are a lot of Republic sectors within what looks like Hutt Space during the CW.

    Basically, the Senate is so fungible that it resists characterization. Revolving senators? Sure! Co-senators? Absolutely! Etc. Intellectually maddening though that can be, it doesn't seem too out of step with imagining what an ancient body with millennia of rules and exceptions and traditions might look like....
  7. AdmiralNick22 Fleet Admiral of Literature

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    Please, please, please, make a online supplement that details the structure of the Senate under the New Republic and Galactic Alliance. There is enough source material out there to make an article like that pretty beefy. This would be the perfect tie-in to a map of the galaxy post-LOTF, showing the borders of the Galactic Alliance, Empire, and the other powers. [face_praying]

    --Adm. Nick

  8. blackmyron Force Ghost

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    Toydaria was already strange - the Hutts were remaining neutral, but they allow a Republic base to be built in their 'territory'... and the Republic negotiates directly with the Toydarians about it, not the Hutts!
    I got the impression that the Republic was acknowledging Hutt Space as the Hutts' 'sphere of influence', which (as Jason said) doesn't necessarily equate their direct area of control. If the Hutts were against you, I assume that it would've been made very difficult to operate anywhere in the green-marked area on the Clone Wars map.
    And the hodge-podge nature of the Senate is one of the fun things about it - trying to determine what a Senator represents on a case-by-case basis. (For example - the Senator from Rintonne appears to be the one for regional sector Lambda Sector, the one from Andosha II represents 15 Andoan colonies and the one from Ando represents the Ando system plus unnamed 'dependents' separate from the previously-named colonies. And nothing says the systems controlled by the latter two senators have to all be within Lambda Sector)
  9. Senator_Cilghal Jedi Master

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    but one of the Toydarians looks a lot like Katuunko...
    and HNN talkshow indicates Toydaria had joined the Republic...
  10. CeiranHarmony Jedi Master

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    to me most Mon Cals look like Ackbar... so looks can be decieving my friend ;)
    or maybe Katuunko has a twin/decoy...

    and who can say for sure that these Toydarians are not from a different Toydarian world than Katuunko? Heck a planet might even be split into nations and one joins the Republic the other stays neutral or turns separatist or Huttish. we have precedents for all of this throughout the EU.

  11. Cronal Jedi Knight

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    I fully support and endorse this initiative :D
  12. AdmiralNick22 Fleet Admiral of Literature

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    The motion has been seconded. Shall we open the floor to a vote? :p

    --Adm. Nick
  13. CeiranHarmony Jedi Master

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    only after we cleared who gets a vote, who is just a representative and who is only nominally present :p
  14. DarthBroox Jedi Master

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    I think my screen name has two senators. One because all screen names have one senator and another because of an Old Republic Law still in play that allows anyone with a Jaxxon avatar to have dual representation. However since the Ruusan Reformation anyone with three stars next to there screen name has a series of co-senators with voting power that switches back and forth between them based on the position of Centax-1. Then there is the stipulation amended under Finis Valorum that those individuals with compound words in their screen name can have an additional two non-voting members. All in all I don't know which of my senators get to vote on this motion.
  15. AdmiralNick22 Fleet Admiral of Literature

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    [face_laugh] =D= [face_laugh] @ Ceiran and Broox.

    --Adm. Nick
  16. blackmyron Force Ghost

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    Here's an odd question - the Vensenor Sector Flight Academy. Scum and Villainy had it on Arkanis, the 3T Sourcebook in Vensenor Sector (without giving the planet) - and the Databank article on Pash Cracken says it was on Vensenor. So, new planet in Vensenor Sector?
  17. cavalier_one Jedi Master

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    Firstly, I just have to say I love this book, and am really glad that future information will be released over on the official site. Hopefully, this will become the standard for future reference book releases of this importance.

    A question: In the index, you have the planet/system of Tiems, in the Belderone sector of the ORT. Presumably, this references the Battle of Tiems from the Rebel Alliance Sourcebook. Thing is, Tiems was a city on the planet. With this entry, can we assume that the city of Tiems is on the planet Tiems in the Tiems system of the Belderone sector?
  18. jasonfry VIP

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    Ah, two odd cases.

    Re Tiems, yes, city of Tiems on planet of same name. Thinking is the Rebel Sourcebook had ample opportunity to name a planet but didn't, and "Battle of Tiems" implies a larger conflict, so Tiems it is. Both admittedly judgment calls, but the Atlas demanded a bunch of those.

    Vensenor is a mess, as you note. Vensenor was going to be the a planet in the sector of the same name (it got switched to Prefsbelt, if yr curious) but then Scum and Villainy came out and put the academy on Arkanis, which was odd. In hindsight ignoring the Scum and Villainy reference would have been the better thing to do. (Researching this I found a relevant email from poor Modi screaming bloody murder about having to redo his maps for the 40,000th time.)

    I'll ask Leland about it; my inclination would be to say the academy is on Arkanis (latest source) and referred to by confusing shorthand. And then to whistle and walk quickly away.
  19. Thrawn McEwok Co-Author: Essential Guide to Warfare

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    It gets worse, as [link=http://wizards.com/default.asp?x=starwars/article/sw20031113cracken]at least one source[/link] says was on Carida. :oops:

    Arkanis is a good choice, though, as Sirpar is next door...

    QFT! [face_laugh]

    - The Imperial Ewok
  20. CeiranHarmony Jedi Master

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    mobile Academy anyone? Jedi had one, why not the Empire, too? I mean it would make sense for a FLIGHT Academy... a flying Flight Academy touring the galaxy for recruits and teaching in different locations and situations from asteroid belts to whatever. Could be a Cruiser/Fighter carrier as mobile academy with applying offices on several planets, or several planets as safe stops during the tour de galaxy... akin to athmospheric flying lesson centers while deep space stuff is with the mobile academy ...

  21. jasonfry VIP

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    Now that's a good idea! And it just so happens that I see an opportunity to make it so, LFL willing. Retcon powers activate!
  22. Sinrebirth Immortal Mod-King of the EUC, RPF and SWC

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  23. Thrawn McEwok Co-Author: Essential Guide to Warfare

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    Normally, the Academy is sector-based, and flight school is a separate course aboard a Star Destroyer, but the Academy course with integrated fighter-pilot training is an anomaly anyway, so this makes sense... :D

    - TheImperial Ewok
  24. blackmyron Force Ghost

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    Hmmm... that actually makes good sense. Rotating students to various locations - would this mean that Biggs might've been at Arkanis at one point?
  25. Senator_Cilghal Jedi Master

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    IIRC, the Imperial Academy incorporated numerous existing military-academies. It is plausible some of these already were united on a smaller scale, thus Arkanis, Prefsbelt, and Carida might have been "branch locations" of a Vensensor Academy system with its primary campus based on Vensensor planet, and this system was incorporated into the Imperial Academy system, possibly as a subdivision, so that the administration could have minimal necessary change to keep the bureaucratic transition smooth?