Clone Wars The Even Piell Centre for Canon and Continuity Catastrophes

Discussion in 'Star Wars TV' started by Asharak, Mar 5, 2012.

  1. MistrX Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jun 20, 2006
    star 4
    Although they never did seem to decide how CW V2 and LOE relate to one another.
  2. JackG Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 15, 2011
    star 4
    I think LoE trumps the micro-series where there's contradictions, that the official stance of LFL.
  3. TaradosGon SWTV Mod - Like Palpatine with animals

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    Feb 28, 2003
    star 4
    I honestly wouldn't mind them spinning an entirely new continuity, but not for relatively minor things. I was even interested in seeing an episode of TCW that explored an alternate future in which Dooku remained Palpatine's apprentice, just as a "non-canon" way of showing what Dooku expected to happen and what would have happened aboard the Invisible Hand if Dooku won, or if Anakin was killed during the war. I knew the odds of that happening were 0%. But I think there are plenty of "what if" stories that could be interesting in their own right. Like Maul tracking Obi-Wan to Tatooine, or Starkiller killing and replacing Vader. But all of those stories are one-shot stories that have no continuity.

    I would be game for seeing and Infinities whole alternate timeline and completely new continuity where such things can happen and yet still have continuity with all other stories written in that alternate timeline. Like DC's Earth-One or Marvel's Ultimate continuities. Only, again, I would be completely disinterested in seeing the continuities ever cross over to each other.
  4. MistrX Force Ghost

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    Jun 20, 2006
    star 4
    I hadn't heard that. Source?
  5. Zeta1127 Force Ghost

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    Sep 2, 2012
    star 4
    The micro-series was based on an old draft of LoE, so any differences between LoE and the micro-series are the result of that discrepancy.
  6. Arawn_Fenn Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jul 2, 2004
    star 7
    Part of LoE is a fairly obvious callback to events from the microseries.
  7. GGrievous Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 6, 2005
    star 5
    C-canon shouldn't trump other c-canon, but the discrepancy was corrected in the NEC.
  8. TaradosGon SWTV Mod - Like Palpatine with animals

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    I would've assumed that in case of a discrepancy that whatever was newer would trump what was older. Just as G-canon trumps itself with any updates. Or otherwise just new details that have to be accommodated via other sources, like how "a thousand generations" gets changed to "a thousand years" and then the EU has to clarify the discrepancy.
    Last edited by TaradosGon, Mar 21, 2013
  9. GGrievous Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Nov 6, 2005
    star 5
    I took it as "micro series trumps LOE or vise versa." I understand what you mean by correcting/new trumping old.
    Last edited by GGrievous, Mar 21, 2013
  10. Garrett Atkins Jedi Grand Master

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    Feb 11, 2013
    star 4
    I'm going to be bold and say that everything Post-2007 should be made non-canon. Everything is just a mess now. 2008-2014= The Non-Canon years. :)
  11. TaradosGon SWTV Mod - Like Palpatine with animals

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    I suspect everything that's not on film, including TCW, will become non-canon eventually. It seemed like Lucas kept the PT era off limits to the EU so there was no conflict when he started making his films (or minimal conflict). He seemed to let the EU touch upon everything else because he had no intention of going post-ROTJ, pre-TPM, inbetween the OT films, etc.

    But with Disney they seem like they're going to want as much open to them as possible since they are not limiting the films to just 1-9, and probably want to keep their options open and so probably aren't going to be bound to what Lucas Licensing approved when Lucas was in charge of the company.

    Stories like Shadows of the Empire are probably fairly safe, since I doubt any future films or TV shows are really going to come back to the ESB-ROTJ gap. But I definitely think that pre-TPM, post-ROTJ, and the ROST-ANH gap are on the chopping block.
  12. CT-867-5309 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jan 5, 2011
    star 5
    There won't be a "canon" eventually and even the films will be significantly and knowingly contradicted whenever they feel like it.
    Last edited by CT-867-5309, Mar 22, 2013
  13. Todd the Jedi Mod and Sitcom Dad of SWTV

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    Oct 16, 2008
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    Eh, frankly I'm getting more and more indifferent towards canon. Maybe it's me getting old, maybe it's y'all rubbing off on me, or maybe it's canon purists giving too much of a headache. As fans, keeping stock of canon is just too hard.

    But hey, if SW canon survives Disney-ification, then I'll be all the more pleased. :)
    Last edited by Todd the Jedi, Mar 22, 2013
  14. Zeta1127 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 4
    My respect for canon died when Darth Maul was "resurrected" and was in serious jeopardy when I found out about the initial premise of TCW and its numerous contradictions.
    Garrett Atkins, kubricklynch and Esg like this.
  15. JackG Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 15, 2011
    star 4
    I'm basically edging towards this stance too. It's too difficult and not worth it stressing over canon, especially with EPVII on its way. I'll just watch and read; Disney can take all the EU, but not my fond memories enjoying it.

    Basically, why care about canon when the creators don't?
    Last edited by JackG, Mar 23, 2013
  16. darkchrono Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 23, 2005
    star 4
    I have a feeling it will eventually come to this as well. For current Star Wars fans though the good thing is it probably will not happen for quite awhile. Just looking at what they are doing with the Wizard of Oz these days you know that people are going to play around with the Star Wars universe similarly for generations upon generations. It will probably take them a good ten to fifteen years just to get out of their current post ROTJ buzz then they will probably think of a new era they want to go into if there is still a solid outpouring of support for more movies. Fifty years from now though when anything related to Star Wars that is not a movie is hard to find and there is little fan attachment to things Disney has not created I think they very easily will go into different eras and totally erase the EU.

    One thing I think will be one of the first things they would do would be Darth Sidious backstory.
  17. Esg Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 4
    Disney didn't create the OT or the PT. And there is no proof they would shoot themselves in the foot by erasing something that is consistently bestselling
  18. darkchrono Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 23, 2005
    star 4
    Uhh, we are just talking about them earasing everything to do with the EU not them erasing the movies that Lucas made. Of course they wouldn't do that Ep. IV is one of those things that they put in that special library for goodness sakes.
  19. Esg Jedi Grand Master

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    Sep 2, 2012
    star 4
    Then answer why would they shoot themselves in the foot
    Last edited by Esg, Mar 23, 2013
  20. darkchrono Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 23, 2005
    star 4
    Erasing the EU wouldn't be shooting themselves in the foot. It's just time for you to accept that the stories that you have enjoyed reading in the EU aren't going to be very important anymore. They never actually have been very important anyways and they are going to be respected even less so now.
    Pfluegermeister likes this.
  21. Esg Jedi Grand Master

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    Sep 2, 2012
    star 4
    [IMG]
  22. anakinfansince1983 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Mar 4, 2011
    star 7
    That doesn't answer the question as to why the writers would purposely steamroll continuity.

    I've asked this question multiple times and haven't been given another answer so I'll stick with my theory:

    If they choose to steamroll continuity in areas where it would be very easy to write around the EU, it would be because they are too damn stupid and lazy to write their own stories. See: Barriss Offee. And/or they want to play god and piss all over the people who spent money on the books, but that goes back to my earlier statement. If they weren't too damn stupid and lazy to write their own stories, they wouldn't see the need to piss all over the people who spent the money on the books--the ones who will call them on their continuity issues.

    Let me reiterate my first point:

    The statement "you're just going to have to accept it" does not answer the question as to why writers of the ST would deliberately steamroll continuity, nor does it answer why Filoni did it.

    Try again.
    Last edited by anakinfansince1983, Mar 23, 2013
  23. darkchrono Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 23, 2005
    star 4
    Well let's just go over this again because you EU fans seem to absolutely refuse to accept the difference. The EU books are 'C' cannon. 'C' cannon is not the same as 'T' cannon or 'G' cannon. At any given time 'G' cannon or 'T' cannon has the right to come in and erase 'C' cannon because in most cases 'C' cannon was just the story of some individual author outside of Lucasfilm. 'C' cannon is not the story of Lucasfilm. If Lucasfilm wants to eventually go in and tell the story that they have in mind then they have every right to do so because 'C' cannon was not the story that they told.
  24. Garrett Atkins Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Feb 11, 2013
    star 4
    [IMG] A homeless guy off the streets is ranked higher than trained, professional authors?
    Last edited by Garrett Atkins, Mar 23, 2013
    anakinfansince1983 likes this.
  25. anakinfansince1983 Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Mar 4, 2011
    star 7
    You're confusing Lucasfilm-licensed C-canon (and it is spelled "canon"--a "cannon" is what one can find at Civil War monuments) with fan fiction. C-canon is a story that Lucasfilm gave an author permission to tell and then licensed it; you will see Lucasfilm's logo on the back of most any EU hardback or paperback. The ROTS novelization is considered C-canon but Lucas approved it line by line.

    So no, they don't have "every right" to steamroll it, and steamrolling it is again nothing more than sheer laziness and an attempt to **** on the authors and the fans who bought the work.

    If it wasn't the story they wanted told, they shouldn't have licensed it in the first place. "Oops! I changed my mind!" doesn't fly in the adult world.

    Try again.
    Robimus, K'Kruhk, Zeta1127 and 2 others like this.