The fate of fanfilms - a prediction

Discussion in 'Fan Films, Fan Audio & SciFi 3D' started by Michelangelo, Jun 18, 2001.

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  1. Michelangelo Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Nov 3, 2000
    star 1
    Don't get me wrong, I am grateful for Lucas's progressive stance and lenancy on copyright laws and I hope he doesn't change but as more and more people keep pushing the envolope of what is acceptable and what will be tolerated, I think we are getting closer to a time when Lucas just won't take it anymore.

    Lets be honest, the only reason his lawyers haven't swarmed all over this and all the other fanfilm sites is because of one universal marketing rule of thumb : DON'T ALIENATE YOUR AUDIENCE. But now the audience is starting to alienate the them.

    But with things like 'The Phantom Edit', I believe our privlage here is being extremely threatened. Up until now each fanfilm has been a homage to the original films. Honoring them in a way (I won't talk about paradies since they exist under a different set of copyright laws). But I can't think of a bigger insult to starwars and to George personally than this rehased version of Ep I, and I don't think he's going to stand for it very long. The makers of this 'movie' are basically saying "we know better than you how this movie should be, and we're going to take advantage of your 'as long as its not for profit stance' and use it to slap you in the face." Nothing good can come out of the exposure this thing is getting. Its humiliating as a filmmaker (can you think of any other movie where a fan was so dissatisfied with it that he felt compeled REDO IT!!) And this is not good press for the upcoming starwars movie. Think about it, If fanfilms stop being a billboard for Lucasfilm, meaning free adverstisment from which they indirectly profit, what reason do they have for not shuting us down.

    All I'm basically saying is that we as filmmakers and fans need to be responsible if we want to keep this hobby. Not only by controling the content in your own films but by not supporting insults like TP'E'.

    thanks for listening to me on my soapbox :)
    Eric


  2. Xrazir Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 13, 2001
    star 2
    Yeah, I agree. It only takes a few idiots to screw it up for everyone. That's why we need to work together to keep each other responsible.

    -XraziR-
  3. Zaxis Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    May 24, 2001
    star 1
    "All I'm basically saying is that we as filmmakers and fans need to be responsible if we want to keep this hobby. Not only by controlling the content in your own films but by not supporting insults like TP'E'."

    You bring up good points that I think most people are already aware of. I don't think that "The Phantom Edit" will have too much of an impact in the SW fan film arena. "The Phantom Edit" is not a "fan film" at all. I also don't think that this is the first time that people have taken copyrighted material and altered it this way, although it may be the most known to SW fans.

    I'm pretty sure that this *is* crossing some copyright laws since (I think) it is composed of mostly (or all) copyrighted material that has been regurgitated. I can?t see it getting too much attention in the long run anyway.

    I honestly don?t think that GL could give a crap about things like this in any other way than legal intrusions. For all those who hated TPM, there were so many more who enjoyed it (shortcomings or not).
  4. tumblemoster Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 1, 2000
    star 4
    I think you forget that the original edit of "The Phantom Menace" absolutely sucked. Its hard for die hard fans to admit, but TPM had some very major things wrong with it. It was a box office success not because it was a good film, but because it was an instant cult classic, with a very dedicated previous fan base.

    More importantly, "The Phantom Edit" isn't a fan film, and has no connection to the fan film community. We wouldn't do anything like that. We make fan films. We create original scripts based in GL's universe. Whether or not you think The Phantom Edit is good or not, or whether or not it is over the line, its still not a fan film, its something else.

    I expect Lucasfilm will see that.

    -tm
  5. Michelangelo Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Nov 3, 2000
    star 1
    <<I can?t see it getting too much attention in the long run anyway.>>

    The Chicago Tribune actually reviewed it.
    http://chicagotribune.com/leisure/printedition/article/0,2669,SAV-0106180230,FF.html

    And I saw it covered on 'The Daily Show.' Make no mistake, this is getting national exposure and therefore is very dangerous.

  6. Michelangelo Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Nov 3, 2000
    star 1
    <<More importantly, "The Phantom Edit" isn't a fan film, and has no connection to the fan film community.>>

    I don't care about that debate. Whether it is or its not isn't important. The connections between us and TP'E' are being made because it used copyrighted material... and so do we. And if GL thinks that this negative press isn't worth it, WE might be part of the group that receives C&D orders.

    I'm not saying that its going to happen but the possiblity is there and its undenible.
  7. sjsuamidala Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Feb 6, 2001
    star 3
    I don't agree with you. While the Phantom Edit is getting national attention, the creators didn't do it for national attention. THEY aren't making money from it. Silly trade show guys who have nothing better to do with their time are selling it, and that should be stopped by the law.

    TPE is not a fan film. Lucasfilm is smart enough to see the difference.

    They are also smart enough to realise that the people who did this will do it no matter what - because they didn't release it. Some friend of a friend did, and that is the person to blame. Not the creators.

    Besides, they can't stop the films from being made -t hey can only stop the websites from hosting them.

    Andrew
  8. Scott_M Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Oct 24, 2000
    star 4
    I believe who released it is irrelevant. The people who created it are ultimately liable should any claims of breach of copyright be made. Same with any fan film.

    None of us want to have our films sold by unscrupulous dealers, but I doubt a court would be interested in a plea of "He sold it; not me."
  9. sjsuamidala Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Feb 6, 2001
    star 3
    And I doubt lucasfilm would be interested in sueing me. All they'd get is my Net worth - wait - that's a comptuer and a couple cameras.

    Wow - they'd make bank there.

    Andrew

    EDIT: I think people act like it's the end of the world. I mean, it's not.

    We truely are a small community of people. Most of us don't do anything at all. The few of us that do make movies (myself NOT included as I have yet to finish one) do so with Lucasfilms blessing (many are even paid to do it on AtomFilm). Then there are one or two people who sell things on eBay and at conventions.

    They may get hit by lucasfilm - they may be charged with stuff, but it's not like that'll make Lucasfilm suddenly arrest Dave Macomber and Mark Thomas. It's not going to happen.

    That would just be silly.
  10. Jedi2016 Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Jun 3, 2000
    star 4
    Has anyone contacted LFL to ask about this? It is a valid concern, after all, for those of us making films based on that world.
  11. DorkmanScott Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Mar 26, 2001
    star 6
    How precisely would one even BEGIN to go about contacting Lucasfilm?

    M. Scott
  12. spoo Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 16, 2001
    star 4
    Luban, Lucard, Lude... nope, not in my phonebook
  13. Kristoffer_PTH Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Feb 13, 2001
    star 1
    I wrote them a letter a long time ago (I think I dug the adress up somewhere off the website or something) about the do's and dont's of fan films... They never wrote me back. I dont' think that they can take unsolicited mail.
  14. The_Scream_Man Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    May 1, 2000
    star 5
    I think we'll be ok, since a lot of the FF community seems to be against the Phantom Edit.

    i said it somewhere else as well: Its not our business to change Lucases films.
    Thats it.
    nuff said
  15. sjsuamidala Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Feb 6, 2001
    star 3
    Again, what are they going to do?

    They'll tell you, "Cease and dissist." You say, "Ok."

    Either way, you got to do what you love to do.

    They say, "We're suing you."

    For what? Your dog and his collar? C'mon. Lucasfilm has more important things to do with their time than go around making fans unhappy.

    They only care if it hurts the franchise - the Phantom Edit is included.

    Films that are in bad taste are also included. But those never get shown on the net from sites (like TFN). So no big deal.

    They don't care if 10 kids in a garage in wisconsin or whereever make a lightsaber movie.

    Big whoop.

    Andrew
  16. Thayne_Correlles Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Dec 27, 2000
    star 2
    Time for my Quip again.

    "Lucas lets us play in his backyard, Not go into his bedroom and redecorate..."

    As a fan film Community I beleive that we should distance ourselves from the Phantom Edit and have nothing to do with it. When it comes down to it it isn't a fan film at all. the guy just ripped of Uncle George, he did it to get noticed we do it for the love of the game. Man, I sound like Kevin Costner.

    Damn American Robin Hood... ;)
  17. Avene Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 28, 2000
    star 4
    So what happens differently in The Phantom Edit anyway? I can't understand how it would be possible to rearrange scenes to make it a differnet film? Wouldn't it just confuse people if things which happened earlier in the film happened later or whenever?
  18. sjsuamidala Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Feb 6, 2001
    star 3
    Avene - it was more complex. Mostly it was jsut deleations. And they made the Gungans and the Nemoidians speak gibberish so they could change the diaologue.


    "he did it to get noticed"

    Nope. In Apirl of 2000 (over one year ago), they made it for fun. It took over a year for it to get noticed. If they wanted to get noticed, they would have succeeded much earlier.

    They did it for the love of the game. They just changed the rules for their street game.

    Besides, I dont' think our "Fan Film COmmunity" (TFN) cna get farther away from it. We doint host it. That's it.

    We dont' have to denouce it. Simply not allowing it to exist here is enough.

    Andrew
  19. Avene Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Mar 28, 2000
    star 4
    Oh, I see.. makes more sense now.
  20. Renderking Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Mar 26, 2001
    star 3
    tumblemoster, Phantom did not suck. I took the movie for what it was.

    And if someone did something like that to one of my films, I would be in jail for physical assult.

    Nuff said.
  21. tumblemoster Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 1, 2000
    star 4
    You are a die hard fan is all. Phantom was a huge critical disapointment. Even the cast commented that the script was not very strong. In short, it sucked. Natalie was the only high point, and they didn't even let her act.

    -tm
  22. Alex-Kushaan_Exile Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Aug 29, 2000
    star 2
    Personally, I liked TPM, and I think even people like tumblemonster must admit there are more "high points" than just Natalie, such as the lightsaber duel, etc. As for the original post:

    "Its humiliating as a filmmaker (can you think of any other movie where a fan was so dissatisfied with it that he felt compeled REDO IT!!)"

    I think Lucas knows by now that there's a strong dislike for Jar Jar and Anakin, and this isn't some kind of rude awakening...also, how do you know other films aren't edited by fans? The Phantom Edit itself was around for quite some time before it generated much publicity, and less-popular films (which, judging by profits, include all films that aren't Titanic) may be edited, but these edits might not be fussed over nearly as much due to the lesser interest in those films.
  23. SoulKrusher Jedi Master

    Member Since:
    Nov 25, 2000
    star 4
    I enjoyed Phantom as well, it has alot of very high points. I think for most us we saw Star Wars as kid and enjoyed the adventure. I think you have to look at the film as if you are a kid again wanting adventure and excitment before you will pleased with it. Its a personal thing and there will always be those people who loved to hype the bad things instead of what was good. Their choice.
  24. sjsuamidala Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Feb 6, 2001
    star 3
    Episodes 4-6 were re edited. Apocalypse Now is reedited. Both for the big screen.

    Natalie Portman was acting - I didn't know if you could tell. Most people might not, since a lot of people need tell tale signs of acting in order to believe that someone is acting. That's hwy Keanu Reeves is considered a bad actor.

    Andrew
  25. Renderking Jedi Knight

    Member Since:
    Mar 26, 2001
    star 3
    I really don't understand what was so bad about Jar Jar or Ani. I'm just not seeing it!
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